P: Auto-write changes to XMP

[Lumigraphics]

In Camera Raw, there is a half-buried setting to write changes to XMP. Unfortunately there is no way to specify that settings should always be written to XMP, so every file I process, I have to manually run that command.

How about adding a preference to always write changes? I move files between machines as my workflow, I use presets and dng profiles, and everything blows up if changes aren't saved out.

[TheDigitalDog]

I was under the impression that XMP (sidecars) were always saved. Are you not seeing this? 

In recent versions (June or so of last year), Camera Raw database was no longer being used but anything in there was still read only. 

As for profiles, well the best way to transport them and a lot of other useful data is by using a DNG workflow where the profiles (and more) all get placed into that container. 

[Lumigraphics]

@andrew_rodney 

I have color checker profiles and default presets for two cameras used in product photography. I can open a CR2 file and the computer will show the preset settings and profile, but if I click Done, there is no XMP sidecar saved. I have to manually save the settings to XMP.

[Lumigraphics]

And converting everything to DNG would work but it adds a bunch of processing time. My current workflow is fine other than this annoyance.

[TheDigitalDog]

What if you make an edit (tiny but worth trying). 

The 'Done" button tool tip indicates the changes should be saved (but document not opened). 

[TheDigitalDog]

Well without a DNG workflow, you'll at the very least, need to populate both computers with the DCP profiles. Most likely the same with presets. Much of the other edits should be written with the Done button used. 

[Guest]

@lumigraphics I find this very strange.  I do not create or use DNG files.  I always see xmp files created after I click Done.  Is there something you are doing in moving files from one computer to another that causes the xmp files to disappear?

[Lumigraphics]

I open the CR2 files in ACR. The default preset that I have created for that camera loads along with the associated profile. I can see the develop settings I have specified.

I don’t touch anything, I simply click Done. What I want is the preset adjustments (custom color balance, clarity, noise reduction, etc) to be written to an XMP sidecar. I don’t need to make any edits, that is the whole purpose of having default presets and profiles.

However, there is no sidecar file created and all of my adjustments are not written to disk.

And I am NOT changing to a DNG workflow. I have a tested and working setup other than writing changes to XMP. I typically do no further edits or changes in ACR, I simply open the files into Photoshop at that point.

[TheDigitalDog]

So please, so we can see the behavior on your end, do what you're doing but make a tiny (one value of anything) adjustment of ANY slider. Do you see an XMP? 

I don’t touch anything, I simply click Done.

Which may be the issue. 

[Lumigraphics]

@andrew_rodney 

yes if I make further changes, ACR writes out the sidecar file. I'd just like my profile adjustments to be saved, I archive the files to our file server and that way the preset adjustments are portable.

[TheDigitalDog]

Seems not designed to do that alone. Maybe a bug? I can bug it but again, might be by design. Got older versions you can test?

[JohanElzenga]

So which version of Camera Raw do you use? Nobody has asked you that and you haven't said it, but I strongly believe this is the problem. Like Andrew already said, the option to save the edits in the Camera Raw database rather than in XMP was depreciated quite some time ago, so Camera Raw will always write sidecar files for proprietary raw, unless you use an old version that still can write to the database. 

[Lumigraphics]

@Johan_Elzenga

Nope. PRESET settings are not written to a sidecar if no manual changes are made. This is in ACR 13.4.

[JohanElzenga]

I can't reproduce that on my Mac running Big Sur and ACR 13.4. If I apply a preset, change nothing else and click 'Done', then the settings are written to XMP just fine. 

[JohanElzenga]

Ah, I think I see what you may mean now. I have a preset that is used as camera default. If I open a raw image of that camera, do nothing and hit 'Done', then an XMP sidecar file is written to disk. But if I open that sidecar in a text editor and check what's in it, then the preset settings aren't written in there. Of course you do not notice this if you open the raw file in ACR on the same computer again, because the camera default preset is once again applied if you do. But if you would open the raw file on another computer -that doesn't have this camera default preset- then you won't see the settings.

That is indeed a bug.

[JohanElzenga]

@Rikk Hi Rikk,

Please note that this indeed a bug!

Thanks,

Johan

[TheDigitalDog]

Might be a bug, might be by design; does anyone have old enough versions of ACR that DO write this to XMP? That would be really useful in getting the bug to the engineering team to fix. 

[Lumigraphics]

@andrew_rodney

I assumed it was by design because there is an explicit command in the UI to write settings to XMP. For my purposes, its just an annoyance because I know to do so but I can see it biting someone who didn't know.

[TheDigitalDog]

Have you tired the same in Lightroom Classic? 

[Lumigraphics]

@andrew_rodney 

I haven't, when I started this job (2014) I tested Lightroom and Bridge worked better for my needs. I don't even have LR installed on my work machine but its probably worth a test to see.

[JohanElzenga]

@andrew_rodney The problem is that an older version won’t use presets as camera defaults. That is new too.

[TheDigitalDog]

The problem is that an older version won’t use presets as camera defaults

Yes, but I was hoping simply selecting a profile and nothing more, would (or may not) trigger an update to XMP. 

I can kind of see why just selecting a profile and nothing more might not do this and I can see why it should. The question is, bug or as designed? Might just have to ping some folks on the 'internal' forums but no guarantee an answer will result. 

[dfranzen_camera_raw]

The following behavior described as a bug, is actually as designed:

"...do nothing and hit 'Done', then an XMP sidecar file is written to disk. But if I open that sidecar in a text editor and check what's in it, then the preset settings aren't written in there."

Camera Raw does not add settings to a photo until you actually make an adjustment. This is as designed. 

I understand there are manual steps required to commit the current defaults as the settings, but you do not have to perform those steps one photo at a time.

To batch save the default settings as the active settings for a selection of photos with no settings, you can use the following workflow.

1. In Bridge, Filter for photos with "No Settings" in the Camera Raw section of the Filter panel.

2. Select all those photos.

3. Open them in Camera Raw (cmd/ctrl + R)

4. Select them all in the Camera Raw filmstrip (cmd/ctrl + A)

5. From the ••• "More Image Settings" menu button in the toolbar select "Export Settings to XMP"

You can then close the Camera Raw dialog with Done or Cancel after the settings are written.

[Lumigraphics]

@david_franzen 

Thank you, I'm aware of the steps and this is exactly what I'm asking you to change. Please add a setting where preset adjustments can be auto-written to XMP instead of having to do it manually. It would save me having to remember doing this for every file.

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

Upleveling David's comments to mark as official answer.

The following behavior described as a bug, is actually as designed:

"...do nothing and hit 'Done', then an XMP sidecar file is written to disk. But if I open that sidecar in a text editor and check what's in it, then the preset settings aren't written in there."

Camera Raw does not add settings to a photo until you actually make an adjustment. This is as designed. 

I understand there are manual steps required to commit the current defaults as the settings, but you do not have to perform those steps one photo at a time.

To batch save the default settings as the active settings for a selection of photos with no settings, you can use the following workflow.

1. In Bridge, Filter for photos with "No Settings" in the Camera Raw section of the Filter panel.

2. Select all those photos.

3. Open them in Camera Raw (cmd/ctrl + R)

4. Select them all in the Camera Raw filmstrip (cmd/ctrl + A)

5. From the ••• "More Image Settings" menu button in the toolbar select "Export Settings to XMP"

You can then close the Camera Raw dialog with Done or Cancel after the settings are written.

[JohanElzenga]

@Rikk "Camera Raw does not add settings to a photo until you actually make an adjustment. This is as designed. "

Then I can only say that this is bad design. If one assigns a preset as camera default, and so a photo that is opened in ACR clearly has settings as a result of that preset, then it does not make sense that ACR does write an XMP file when you hit 'Done', but does not write these settings in the XMP file.