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Andygeol
Andygeol
Known Participant
June 28, 2022
Answered

Assign color profile vs proof setup

  • June 28, 2022
  • 3 replies
  • 3133 views

Confusing problem. I use a calibrated monitor and have always proof matched paper via View>Proof setup>Custom>icc profile of a particular paper, then used adjustment layer to get a better match. This is now not getting me close to what is coming out of my printer. What I have now discovered is that if I go to EDIT> Assign Profile>Profile (icc of the paper), the monitor and print are a VERY close match.

I have always been told that Edit asign profile should be the original colorspace the image was captured in ie Adobe1998. This ensured that what came out of the camera and what was on the screen would be a close match.What has gone wrong? Is it User error or has PS changed?

I use Win 10, PS CC ver 23.4.1

    This topic has been closed for replies.
    Correct answer NB, colourmanagement

    "Monitor and  proof not matching is a gross understatement. I always use the same paper, profile my monitor every 2 weeks and generally have a very close match between print and monitor. However now, since last PS update (ver 23.4.1), if I print test reference images without letting PS control colours all is ok but when I let PS manage colours using appropriate icc profiles it is totally off.

    This leads me to conclude the problem lies with PS"

    It seems like you've either found a bug or something has changed. IF the printer profile is accurate and the screen is accurately calibrated AND if the viewing conditions are acceptable then using "PhotosomMamages Color" is that way to go, be sure also to set the print driver media options consistently. 

     

    I wonder if you are experiencing a change to the display profile bright about by an update. I'll post some tips about that too 

     

    I hope this helps
    neil barstow, colourmanagement net :: adobe forum volunteer:: co-author: 'getting colour right'
    google me "neil barstow colourmanagement" for lots of free articles on colour management

    3 replies

    Bob_Hallam
    Bob_Hallam
    Legend
    June 29, 2022

    Keep your currently assigned ICC profile as Adobe RGB.  That is not the problem.  The problem as you have described it is that your monitor and proof do not match.  This is a common problem and can be resolved with a few changes.   

     

    First, make sure your screen is in a Dim but controlled light environment and you have a way to view your proof under the same lights maybe a short distance from your display or have a viewing light to view your prints from GTI.  They make tabletop viewers that are pretty reasonable.  

    Second, Calibrate your display and make sure the Gamut of that display is close in size to your chosen color space of Adobe RGB.  Many times this critical step is overlooked and the user is on an sRGB display color-correcting Adobe RGB files.  That won't work because the monitor's color space is smaller than the container space of the image.   Choose ICC profile v4 or a matrix-based version 2 profile.   When you calibrate use an advanced mode that allows you to adjust the white point of the display.  This step is critical to your workflow because the canned choices do not work well.  Then it's just lather, rinse and repeat until you have the exact right profile white point for your controlled light viewing area.  

    Lastly, profile your printer, Ust M1 if your paper has optical brightness, or MO if it doesn't, and keep it profiled.  Use your destination or printer profile to view through in Photoshop and simulate the paper color.  If the paper color is incorrect.  Make sure you have evaluated the paper correctly for Optical brighteners and possibly make another profile with the correct M standard.  

    That will solve your problem.  

    ICC programmer and developer, Photographer, artist and color management expert, Print standards and process expert.
    Andygeol
    AndygeolAuthor
    Known Participant
    July 2, 2022

    Monitor and  proof not matching is a gross understatement. I always use the same paper, profile my monitor every 2 weeks and generally have a very close match between print and monitor. However now, since last PS update (ver 23.4.1), if I print test reference images without letting PS control colours all is ok but when I let PS manage colours using appropriate icc profiles it is totally off.

    This leads me to conclude the problem lies with PS

     

    Bob_Hallam
    Bob_Hallam
    Legend
    July 4, 2022
    quote

    The definition is correct, but you've not understood the principle.  Chromatic adaption is always at play in a monitor-based proofing environment.  

     

    I never said otherwise. I simply pointed out the actual misunderstanding and generalization about daylight. Or the fact, that there are no actual displays or man-made illuminants that produce it.


    The "misunderstanding" is assumed.  Daylight is variable light, which is an important factor in managing a color-managed display.   I wish I had a dollar for everyone that told me they had a calibrated display but also had that display in a room lit by window light.  That window light being brighter than a display will always be the adapted white.  

    ICC programmer and developer, Photographer, artist and color management expert, Print standards and process expert.
    T
    Test Screen Name
    Legend
    June 29, 2022

    If Assign Profile "fixes" the profile, then something is very wrong. Not sure what, but it's kind of like sticking a label on a banana saying "apple". It is done when the file was prepared wrong, and never otherwise...

      Andygeol
      AndygeolAuthor
      Known Participant
      June 29, 2022

      I know that this is wrong which is why I am very confused. I haven't changed my workflow from camera through ACR to PS then print with paper proper profiles. Adobe RGB 1998 workspace all the way through and haven't seen this level of mismatch before. I am now waiting for more paper to try different things including removing then reinstalling Photoshop

      TheDigitalDog
      TheDigitalDog
      Inspiring
      July 2, 2022
      @Andygeol wrote: I am now waiting for more paper to try different things including removing then reinstalling Photoshop

       

      You should always test output using good color reference images designed for that task. The color reference images RGB values are such that they are set for output and are editing and display agnostic. Test the output this way and examine for the same color issues so we know it's not your image-specific issues causing the problems:
      http://www.digitaldog.net/files/2014PrinterTestFileFlat.tif.zip

      Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"
      TheDigitalDog
      TheDigitalDog
      Inspiring
      June 28, 2022

      The only time you use the Assign Profile command is if the document has no profile (kind of rare) and you know what profile to assign as it defines that color space. OR (even more rare) the image has the wrong profile assigned. Otherwise don't mess with it, no matter what the display preview looks like. 

      See:

      http://digitaldog.net/files/06AssignProfileCommand.pdf

      See: http://digitaldog.net/files/PhotoshopColorSettings.mp4

      Photoshop CC Color Settings and Assign/Convert to Profile video

       

      Now if you're not getting a soft proof that matches your display, that's another issue altogether. 

      See:

      Why are my prints too dark (or don't match the display)?
      Why doesn’t my display match my prints?
      A video update to a written piece on subject from 2013
      In this 24 minute video, I'll cover:

      Are your prints really too dark?
      Display calibration and WYSIWYG
      Proper print viewing conditions
      Trouble shooting to get a match
      Avoiding kludges that don't solve the problem

      High resolution: http://digitaldog.net/files/Why_are_my_prints_too_dark.mp4
      Low resolution: https://youtu.be/iS6sjZmxjY4

       

      Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"
        Andygeol
        AndygeolAuthor
        Known Participant
        June 29, 2022

        Thanks for your reply. I have never really looked at Assign Profile 'cos I have always been told to leave it alone. My working colour space is always Adobe1998 RGB cos that's what comes out of the camera.  I only started looking at this because what was on my screen  and what came out of the printer was way off. It is as if the PS print engine is not picking up that RGB profile setting at all and using the paper icc profile in its place.

        I calibrate my monitor using iDisplay Pro and use the paper manufacturers icc profiles and my workflow has not changesd.

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