Alternatives to the Creative Cloud

[davedunlap1]

With Adobe's decisions to force users to go to subscribe to the creative cloud, I thought it might be a good idea to get a list going of some alternative programs. I'm a designer working mostly in print with some web - anyone know of some good alternatives for these?

Photoshop -> Gimp

Illustrator -> ?

Indesign - Quark

Dreamweaver - ?

Flash - been moving away from that anyway

What programs are you going to look into to replace the creative cloud?

[Piem3D]

You can also try:

Indesgn -> Scribus

Illustrator -> Inkscape

Hello

I'm sorry but it's nonsense!

Have you ever tried to import a 600 fully layered illustrator artwork in Scribus ?

Have you ever tried to import the same file in Inkscape ?

I guess no. As soon installed and tried, as soon un-installed..same thing for xara.

The fact is that Adobe knows very well that  actually they  have NO COMPETITORS for Big Projects who need reliability.

To my eyes, the only program that got much more things and which does as well (even better) than an Adobe Program is "GIMP VS Photoshop" (and vs Fireworks)..but you have to learn GIMP.

In fact, even in the 3d world, Autodesk has not such an advantage upon the others competitors.Autodesk (Autocad, 3dsmax, Maya, Xsi, mudbox... and much more) tried to corner the 3d professional market.. actually, they did pretty well but not totally because some others famous independant solutions are still alive today and some very well .

For Adobe, as for Autodesk, the problem that could occur in the future could be an "anti-trust" suit but that's an other story

Microsoft paid gigantic fines to europe for much less than this.

[Adam-C]

Microsoft paid gigantic fines to europe for much less than this.

Yup - that's why I've already written to my MEP about this - all you other European Adobe users should do the same...

[Phillip_M_Jones]

they need a class action suit brought against them.  and allow the have CC but forbid them from not providing DVD versions for people that desire.

[wkjeiwoi]

Piem3D wrote:

You can also try:

Indesgn -> Scribus

Illustrator -> Inkscape

Hello

I'm sorry but it's nonsense!

Have you ever tried to import a 600 fully layered illustrator artwork in Scribus ?

Have you ever tried to import the same file in Inkscape ?

I guess no. As soon installed and tried, as soon un-installed..same thing for xara.

The fact is that Adobe knows very well that  actually they  have NO COMPETITORS for Big Projects who need reliability.

To my eyes, the only program that got much more things and which does as well (even better) than an Adobe Program is "GIMP VS Photoshop" (and vs Fireworks)..but you have to learn GIMP.

In fact, even in the 3d world, Autodesk has not such an advantage upon the others competitors.Autodesk (Autocad, 3dsmax, Maya, Xsi, mudbox... and much more) tried to corner the 3d professional market.. actually, they did pretty well but not totally because some others famous independant solutions are still alive today and some very well .

For Adobe, as for Autodesk, the problem that could occur in the future could be an "anti-trust" suit but that's an other story

Microsoft paid gigantic fines to europe for much less than this.

In actual practice, few people would ever even consider loading a 600-layer file into another program. There's simply no reason for it unless you're using CS, whose apps support that kind of thing. And even then...600 layers? Seriously? I've created some hellacious layers files and worked with a lot of heavy hitter illustrators and have never seen such a thing. Not to say it couldn't be done...I guess that's why the clown car act was developed...

I can say that, after using Adobe products for 25 years*, Inkscape, Gimp and Scribus are in fact worthy alternatives to Adobe Products. They are not the same, feature for feature, but they are worthy alternatives. That they are not exactly the same as the adobe titles is why they're 'alternatives.'

I'd add to the pile:

Photoshop > Pixelmator

Illustrator > Sketch and iDraw

And let's not forget Canvas. Back in the day when the vector graphics race had 3 serious horses, Canvas was a worthy tool. Now windows-only, I hear rumblings about their making a Mac version once again.

I think that having more choice software would help everyone, including Adobe.

*I used Illustrator back when in came on 1 floppy disk.

[billhdz]

Once you start using other software, there will be no need to open Adobe files. The files will be the ones from the new software you are using.

There are ways to work with Adobe files in the meantime, while you make a transition.  No system is perfect, but with a little expertese, it can be done.

The idea is to eventually ending up using other software for all your work and not have to reply on Adobe apps any longer.

[wkjeiwoi]

you're losing me here, billhdz...

maybe we're getting snagged on semantics. are you suggesting that Adobe wants users to be completely free and independent of the need to use Adobe software to open and edit files which were created in Adobe software?

I think we all know that, for the most part, if we create a file in a non-adobe application, we don't need adobe software to open that file again..

not sure what you're getting at..please clarify, if you have a moment?

[billhdz]

@wkjeiwoi

Sorry for the confusion.

Some people are afraid to move from Adobe software to an alternative, because they feel they need to always depend on Adobe files. My point is that that's not the case.  You can make a gradual move to non-Adobe software and eventually not have to depend on Adobe files.  Other software use their own file  formats and will also export to standard formats.

Adobe would like us to stay with them and their file formats, but if we are not a big fan of the forced creative cloud, we don't have to.  We can move on to other software.

I hope this clarifies things a little better.

Thanks for the talk!

[wkjeiwoi]

It does, nicely so..thank you...

the part where I get a bit concerned is when it comes to working with clients who use adobe and want an all-adobe workflow..

to a point, as long as you hand them deliverables they can use, who cares what software you used?

However, if they hand YOU an Adobe file of version x.xx, and you are unable to manipulate it in every way they require, that is a problem for you.

for the most part, the alternatives named can do anything you need to, really, except for the adobe-specific features, or opening adobe files directly.

[frankgrimes]

I'm as angry as everyone here, but no need for rash decisionmaking. As a professional web developer, I implore everyone here to never EVER use any Microsoft product for creating, editing or viewing HTML. I've seen the worst of it and believe me it's not pretty.

Please, don't do it.

[Tom_Murray_1]

Photoline handles 16bit and cmyk. But I found hard to use compared to PS.

[f_donald]

I noticed that Newegg has a couple of items on sale this weekend for those eligible and interested.

CorelDraw Home & Student Suite X6 - $49.99 with Promo Code EMCXRVS228

Corel Painter 12 - academic Version - $39.99 with Promo Code EMCXRVS74

[MyCoalescence]

Dont do it! I looked into several providers student lisencing. Adobes student lisence is about 95% same as commercial and you can sell your work. Corel you can not sell your work with student versions.

Also Philip, all you need for student discount is to take 1 class online and bam you are an eligible student. Which is why for years I had planned to get the adobe creative suite just before I graduate in 6 months and have a head start but that has all changed. I refuse to buy even a student edition if they are discontinuing CS.

My dilemia people say if you dont like CC get cs6. That is a trash answer. cs 6 is 1.5 years old in its 2 year upgrade cycle which they will not be doing updates for. Why would I buy something that is almost at the end of its usefulness? I will jump to an other provider in 6 months if adobe does not allow a non CC contuniuing solution moving forward. I will go to corel, pay much less and know I can upgrade and that their product line has a future. Oposed to cs 6 which has NO future.

Here is a list of several top 10 alternatives to adobe. Its not perfect but a great starting point.

Illustrator http://www.onextrapixel.com/2011/03/15/10-best-alternatives-to-adobe-illustrator/

Indesign http://www.onextrapixel.com/2013/05/24/10-best-alternatives-to-adobe-indesign/

Photoshop http://www.creativebloq.com/photoshop/alternatives-1131641

I realize no other company can replace adobe in all they do. I am though still looking for a company that provides as much of an alteranative group of products as possible. On these lists there are 2 componies that come up again and again and again. Serif and Corel.

Serif is a high end hobbyist/low end proffesional and the cost is according to its quality. Most their stuff compared to adobe is stupidly cheap. Their free versions are equal to cs 2 and the full version is probably more like cs 3-4. So good for some but not me but with how cheap they are its hard to go wrong getting a few full versions. Also like 2 weeks after you download their free verions you will get emails giving you 25% off any of their products. I have 2 such promotion codes they sent me for the 4 items I downloaded.

Corel is so many ways seems to be the only contender for 2d work to adobe. Yes corel does have many of its products native on mac and the ones that arnt you can use boot camp to use it.

Painter vs Photoshop = painter wins if your using it for digital illustration

Paint shop vs photoshop = photo shop win, but no one can beat its photo editing tools

paint shop vs photoshop elements = paint shop wins, paint shop is really an inbetween of elements and full photoshop but much cheaper and best alternative

painter + paint shop vs photoshop = tie, corel will digital paint better but photoshop will photo edit better, depends on needs

corel draw vs illustrator = draw wins, its has all the capabilities but just works more intuitivly, customizable work space and can do many things illustrator wishes it could do such as grab 10 obejects and apply 1           gradiant over the whole group without needing to make the gradiant a mask!

corel draw vs indesign = indesign wins, but not by much, x6 is their first edition adding in text/layout heavy tools so great for their first attemp and im guessing in 1-2 editions will be on par with indesign, basicly i           could not find a single major function indesign does that draw could not do, indesign just had enough small type related conveniences to make it still better

word perfect vs indesign = indesign wins, but again not by much, again im guessing in 1-2 editions it will be as good as indesign

They have other products as after shot instead of light room and website creator instead of muse/dreamweaver and designer a 3d rendering program but I dont know tons about them or how well they match up.

Over all I think corel has a very strong possition. It may not be top dog in anything but its great at many things and I dont want to have 6 different programs each from different providers and have to worry about things like compatability, completely different tools/shortcuts and more. When I go from illustrator to photoshop I even get messup for a bit with how the same hot keys do different things or the same tool works differently. Corel is extreamly good at converting files. Say you are the last man on earth not using adobe. Corel has 0 problem converting its files to equivilent adobe files. Thats one of its strong selling points. Can convert to photo shop and illustrator and many many many more so your customers/coworks/printers may not even realize you are not the 1 man left not using adobe. It does not matter how awsome a product is if it does not play nice with the standard line up. Yes things change but it takes time and till it does the non standard needs to play nice with the standard which corel is. Did i forget to mention corel is giving adobe users the discount of buying corel for their upgrade cost? Also corel is doing 3 pay models. 1 pay and get your cd/download perpetual liscence (which they say they are not chaning anything in the near future), 2 standard + cloud premium 100/year not month but year for automatic upgrades to the newest versions and a few handy cloud features and access to extra stuff, and 3rd subsctiption/cloud 200/year not month but year and like adobe you rent but never own. So they have 3 great business models going. Surely 1 will fit your you. Im like the standard perpetual lisence + premium. They generally do upgrades ever 2 years which is 200$ which is exactly the same cost as 2 years of premium so why not just get premium to get all upgrades early, extra cloud access and more and still have your CD! They are also running long term sales on like 1/2 their products so look them up.

[frankgrimes]

MycCoalescence wrote:

My dilemia people say if you dont like CC get cs6. That is a trash answer. cs 6 is 1.5 years old in its 2 year upgrade cycle which they will not be doing updates for. Why would I buy something that is almost at the end of its usefulness? I will jump to an other provider in 6 months if adobe does not allow a non CC contuniuing solution moving forward. I will go to corel, pay much less and know I can upgrade and that their product line has a future. Oposed to cs 6 which has NO future.

What a ridiculous argument. Simply because a new version of software is released does not mean all previous versions are useless. They are tools and are only useless if they no longer work.

Adobe has seldom released must-have features in their new releases so I never saw a need to upgrade to every new version (though I did, but only to ensure I was compatible with my customers' versions). For me, all of CS6 will be useful for many years to come. Photoshop hasn't introduced anything new since CS3, IMO. Video editing? Bloatware. After Effects may be the most difficult app for me to replace, but all their others will remail more than useful for a long time and I see no need to replace them yet.

MycCoalescence wrote:

Corel has 0 problem converting its files to equivilent adobe files. Thats one of its strong selling points. Can convert to photo shop and illustrator and many many many more so your customers/coworks/printers may not even realize you are not the 1 man left not using adobe. It does not matter how awsome a product is if it does not play nice with the standard line up. Yes things change but it takes time and till it does the non standard needs to play nice with the standard which corel is. Did i forget to mention corel is giving adobe users the discount of buying corel for their upgrade cost? Also corel is doing 3 pay models. 1 pay and get your cd/download perpetual liscence (which they say they are not chaning anything in the near future), 2 standard + cloud premium 100/year not month but year for automatic upgrades to the newest versions and a few handy cloud features and access to extra stuff, and 3rd subsctiption/cloud 200/year not month but year and like adobe you rent but never own. So they have 3 great business models going. Surely 1 will fit your you. Im like the standard perpetual lisence + premium. They generally do upgrades ever 2 years which is 200$ which is exactly the same cost as 2 years of premium so why not just get premium to get all upgrades early, extra cloud access and more and still have your CD! They are also running long term sales on like 1/2 their products so look them up.

Corel can save to Adobe formats, but without specific features. A lot of other apps do this, too. Corel's upgrading pricing offer to CS owners expired months ago.

Also, I used to work for a commercial printer and they supported all graphics and layout applications, not just Adobe's. This is actually very common. They asked their customers to provide files in universal formats, such as .EPS, and not software-specific formats like .AI, but most customers have no clue about printing so they just gave us their Illustrator, Quark or whatever files and we converted them. To say Adobe products are industry standards is misleading in the regard that printers use them or use them exclusively.

I have always loved Corel and have only recently lost all respect for Adobe.

[MyCoalescence]

I dont think you understood me correctly. If im paying for software that is nearly 2 years old I expect ither a substantial discount as they have done with other editions or cs 7. Adobe is doing neither. As said Im a student 6 months from graduation. I do not own any creative software yet. I am planning on getting what I need in the next few months. There is little point paying 1300 for the design suite or even 1/2 that for the student discount because it will be nearly impossible to get a hold of said student discounted copy when I can pay 1/4 that at xara or 1/2 that at corel.

Why would I buy software they arnt planning to do updates for. Thats just stupid. Im not saying there is anything wrong with cs 6. Its good and works well. If cs 6 had come out right now yes I would get it because it is at the start its of life but you forget adobe cyles are 1.5-2 years and it at 1.5. So give me a discount, cs 7 or ill get my software else ware for less and get updates and did I forget upgrades. CS 6 is not dead but has no future. No updates or upgrades meaning they are leaving it to rot. Did you also forget they said they would only support it for the next OS. I dont want good enough. I want an alternite path that keeps going. Now or later cs6 users will have to go CC or switch providers. Im just deciding to switch no rather than wait a few years. Id rather buy a product i can upgrade which will be cheaper than buy cs6 and possible not upgrade it to CC.

I know I saw the corel sale for adobe users still in effect on an add at a site. Any how they still have sales on many products so tough bananas. Saw the ad at pc magazine this week. What sales are now does not matter till I buy just saying many alternate adobe providers are having significant sales off and on. http://www.corel.com/corel/pages/index.jsp?pgid=800281&item=pressRelease&listid=15000043

Yes ive been to printers I know they accept files. I was actually refering to being able got exchange files with adobe users. Im sure there are hickups but it would help. Most less than 100$ software cant deal with adobe formats. Just a nice thing to have. Adobe is the standard probably as google is. Photoshoped has become a word as googled is a word. In my life before the past few months I could name on 1 hand the products people mentioned as alternate to adobe mostly quark and corel. There are many more as we both know. Adobe has such a hold id never ever heard of most the alternate providers befor and didnt realize there was so much more out there. Id say that is part of it being the standard.

Im liking the look of corel and will try their trial version but also xara. Harder to find reviews on xara. The more I learn of corel and its products the more im impressed, especially considering their price being so much less than adobe and their revinue being acording to wikipedia about 1/15th that of adobe. What do you think of corel as an adobe alternative? I can live them being 90% as good overall for the lower price.

[Danny_Michael]

>Photoshoped has become a word as googled is a word.

More and more "Photoshopped" is no longer a compliment, but considered a fake. Much like Adobe's many false promises over the years.

[MW Design]

Corel vs. Illy

I use them all: Illy, CorelDraw and Xara Designer Pro. For general vector drawing, and when incorporating bitmap images into a design, I use XDP far more than the others. It has a far faster graphics engine. It is not color managed, so you really ought to understand what you are doing as regards color. Output to PDF is good.

I use CD for a lot of separation work, mainly for some local screen printers. I have used CD since it became available. So for a lot of years.

There are features in AI I absolutely love. However, for most my work, I don't use them. In the instances I need to return an AI file to a client, I still do the bulk of the work in XDP or CD and then import into AI for its unique features and or simply as a glorified file converter.

In all cases (and regardless of the application--vector, images, layout), I have never sent an original file to a printer since I began in 1989. Since PDFs became available, that is what I send. Before that it was PostScript files.

Download a trial of XDP and CD. Test them for yourself...that's the only way you can be sure of their applicability.

Oh, not that you asked...For many years I have used PhotoLine for images. I'll use PS only if and when I have to, and that ain't much.

[Jamesmcw]

262. frankgrime: 

What a ridiculous argument. Simply because a new version of software is released does not mean all previous versions are useless. They are tools and are only useless if they no longer work.

I completely agree. I've never quite understood the attitude that software is out of date within 1-2 years... I was using PS CS3 up until very recently. The newest features on established long life software these days tend to be superflous in my opinion. Aside from compatability extensions for new file formats etc. The tools and features that I use everyday have been in there for a very long time. There are limits to how far you can innovate with software and an S curve of 'innovation' probably applies. Capitalism demands that they try and keep up the pace of useful feature updates of course but as we all know that ultimately just results in bloated software. They also start changing the UI just for the sake of it etc And I know this because my whole career has been doing UI design!

[ReactionAtWork]

Jamesmcw: You are absolutely correct, and I believe this is the primary reason Adobe moved to CC. Previously, they were forced by tradition (and the need for cash) to release a 'new' version of applications every two years. But each time, the lack of any real innovation or useful new features became harder to conceal, despite the enormous marketing hype. Adobe knew all too well that its customers had realised that upgrading each time wasn't necessary.

So now, with CC, Adobe no longer need to worry about development too much. Their existing market share will support them for a few years at least. There's no point CC customers complaining, because they're now forced to keep paying for CC, and if they stop they'll lose the ability to open the files they created in CC apps.

Adobe can now sit back comfortably with their feet on the desk, do as little innovation or bug fixing as they please, and still watch the cash roll in.

[frankgrimes]

ReactionAtWork wrote:

Jamesmcw: You are absolutely correct, and I believe this is the primary reason Adobe moved to CC. Previously, they were forced by tradition (and the need for cash) to release a 'new' version of applications every two years. But each time, the lack of any real innovation or useful new features became harder to conceal, despite the enormous marketing hype. Adobe knew all too well that its customers had realised that upgrading each time wasn't necessary.

So now, with CC, Adobe no longer need to worry about development too much. Their existing market share will support them for a few years at least. There's no point CC customers complaining, because they're now forced to keep paying for CC, and if they stop they'll lose the ability to open the files they created in CC apps.

Adobe can now sit back comfortably with their feet on the desk, do as little innovation or bug fixing as they please, and still watch the cash roll in.

Clearly, this move is motivated by greed. A need for cash? I'm not so sure. I can't agree with you more about the lack of innovation. I got really, really tired of them promoting fantastic new features at Adobe Max only to learn these features are not planned for the newest release, but "something we're working on." BFD. Still never got physics in Flash. And Flash as a product was ridiculously mismanaged since the Macromedia acquisition. It used to be a fantastic product -- well, it STILL is -- except they let the lies of some other CEO ruin it. Flash has tons of everyday uses on and off the web. No way can javascript replace it. Thanks, Adobe, for showing the world intro animations instead of the real power.

Do they need cash? Hard to say, but I'd guess no. Since they've really stopped innovating, I'm left to wonder what their development force is like. The Flash team is practically gone. They seem to have a couple hanging around the Photoshop team based on the changes I've seen there. Same with Dreamweaver (does anyone actually use DW anymore?). Perhaps the largest teams are on After Effects and InDesign. I still have no idea what their other things do...Muse?

Premiere? Seriously, ANYTHING is better than that. It's ridiculously slow and non-intuitive. Illustrator? Meh. CorelDRAW still kicks its butt.

Honestly, Adobe's products are good, but I think the biggest reason for their success is their availability. One company bulding all these products made it easier. Now, we just buy specialized products from different companies. Less convenient, but still provides a great workflow and killer end products.

No matter, I've moved on. I can't even say if Adobe reintroduces the purchased-license model I'd go back.

[quenton8]

It may be that Adobe started CC because they have run out of significant updates to the various applications, but it may not!

As a senior employee in a S/W company, I understand the issues Adobe faces.

I prefer to wait and see -- if I get a consistant stream of updates that I think are useful then I will be happy -- if not, THEN I will look elsewhere, or

yell a Adobe to provide some different agreements.

[frankgrimes]

Jamesmcw wrote:

262. frankgrime: 

What a ridiculous argument. Simply because a new version of software is released does not mean all previous versions are useless. They are tools and are only useless if they no longer work.

I completely agree. I've never quite understood the attitude that software is out of date within 1-2 years... I was using PS CS3 up until very recently. The newest features on established long life software these days tend to be superflous in my opinion. Aside from compatability extensions for new file formats etc. The tools and features that I use everyday have been in there for a very long time. There are limits to how far you can innovate with software and an S curve of 'innovation' probably applies. Capitalism demands that they try and keep up the pace of useful feature updates of course but as we all know that ultimately just results in bloated software. They also start changing the UI just for the sake of it etc And I know this because my whole career has been doing UI design!

To be fair, the poster I was debting here clarified his position and didn't seem to suggest it was necessary to purchase each new version only because it was new.

If I understand him/her correctly now, I think the poster is now suggesting it's uselss to buy software that is, in a manner of speaking, no longer available. And to that point I agree. If I were to buy software now, it wouldn't be Adobe.

[Guest]

Photoshop -> Gimp -

Illustrator -> ?

Indesign - Quark

Dreamweaver - ?

Flash - been moving away from that anyway

What programs are you going to look into to replace the creative cloud?

With most of these tools, I don't think Adobe has been all that creative or open about what they've actually offered for updates.

At this point, ( I posted this elsewhere) I'm going to recommend to our company that we stick with CS6 for the next couple of years and see what happens. We can easily last 2 years. It's not ideal but this push by Adobe has really shed some light on Adobe's plan for world domination...Of course that's hype; after all, we're not talking about world hunger or war here...it's a software package...it's just a tool.

I mainly use Dreamweaver, being a Web Designer/Developer. However, for years, I enjoyed the what you see is what you get interface. In some ways, that was helpful and in others, it was a crutch. It was a good tool to learn but not something that was great for really digging into the heart of things. Hand-coding is really where that skill is learned. With all the templates, Content management systems and development trends, of late, an opportunity has been available to make that move to coding by hand. What I'm starting to understand, with this move by Adobe, is that now might be the point in time in which people really start to move away from their safe comfortable safety zones.

Of course Photoshop and Illustrator are great tools, If one owns version 6, it's not like they're going anywhere.

Because of Adobe's move, I think that there is going to be a rapid expansion of open source alternatives once people start to get the message that Adobe is sending...

I think Adobe is basically saying this: "we own you; you must comply with our demands..."  I say, "you may be right but thanks for the warning, we're going to start to look for alternatives. "

[Guest]

As far as CorelDraw, I don't think it's really up to the task. At one point, about 9 years back, I used it. At this point, I think the current version of Illustrator beats it.

Going forward? Who knows?

[God_I_hate_Adon_tbe]

I can understand your thinking with most of this, LArtJunky.  IMHO, the price tag is just far too high, especially when you can get free packages like GIMP that do most of the stuff (and other little bits and pieces besides) that PS does.  Other packages such as Xara's graphics apps can do many more useful things for web developers.  It's all contextual and how much you want to spend.  $GIMP + $XARA = Approx $100.  Adobe Photo$hop approx $600 to $800...  Perhaps a lot of this is down to simple maths, epecially when the quality is available in other applications.

[billhdz]

Here is a very nice list I ran into that helped us a lot!  Options for any business or person!

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=7591918&postcount=21

We are moving our entire workflow from the the Adobe CS6 Suite to "Xara Designer Pro X". They have a 30 day demo to try!

We are very pleased with the results so far and its high quality Pro software.  We are on Macs so we running the software successfully using Parallels Desktop with Windows.

http://www.xara.com/us/designer-pro/