[Locked] No perpetual licenses are you serious?

[Mattrman]

I just head that Adobe was planning to abandon its perpetual license in favor of an on line only rental program. At first I thought that this must be a joke. I have been using adobe products for 18 years. Primarily Photoshop, Illustrator and Indesign. I am currently an owner of CS 6 Master collection and obviously do upgrade my products and have consistently done so over the years. I am not connected to the internet full time and in fact my work computer is never directly connected to the internet. So how does this work? Is adobe now forcing me to connect to the internet - it seems that this is the case.

In regards to upgrade cycles, I dont want to rent my software and be tied to a rental agreement. I want to upgrade when I choose, not rent my software like some kind of loaner program!

I want to purchase the software then not worry about it. For instance when I travel, I dont want to be bogged down with downloads and upgrades chewing up my bandwidth. I have traveled to many places where internet access is very limited. Downloading from a wireless card in China is painful, I dont want to be bogged down with no software or large megabyte downloads costing me a fortune on the other side of the planet.

Adobe I know that I am just one person and you will probably not listen to me but did someone ask? No one asked me about this. How simple could this be - I want to buy the software then use it when I want where I want, is this too much to ask?

Please let me continue to use this software in the way that I have used it for so long. If others wish to have the creative cloud then great! More power to them, don't alienate your other users. Please provide both alternatives.

Best regards - Matt

[Greg_Bohn]

Oh, I think it's clear that this change is mostly in Adobe best interests, not its customers (for the many reasons  stated before) and that Adobe is trying to leverage its dominant market position to force this change on its customers.

  I was just saying that they will only get away with it if enough of their customers simply roll over and accept it ("Thank you sir. May I have another?" ).

[MattPhotos]

Completely agree. Removing choice from your customers is alienating your customers, at least a large group of them. I am a sole prop. business, and don't want to be tied in to a monthly fee. I've used Photoshop, and now Lightroom for years, backup and store my own images and do not appreciate being told to change my business/work model to conform to what Adobe thinks it should be. Not happy, and sincerely hope the online only model is rethought, and abandoned.

[toxic_waltz]

I find it VERY interesting that Adobe has just hidden this thread from view.

You can't hide the truth [].

[Brntoki]

Still showing on the first page for me. Perhaps with all the other problems abounding it's just getting pushed off the front page more easily? That, and we've pretty much said it all already and it's clear that Adobe is deaf.

[bitm07]

Diablo Venom wrote

I find it VERY interesting that Adobe has just hidden this thread from view.

You can't hide the truth you pussies.

Still showing on the first page here in the UK

[bababongatwo]

Also very interessting... Telling a lot about the situation of Adobe...

http://forums.adobe.com/message/5438175#5438175

Wonder, what game they play. More and more.
And I think also: The Core-Apps will never see a great Update for a long, long, long time...

Adobe is going in the direction of useless, unwanted sync- and share- and pad-gimmicks.

Seems planless.

[thxapproved]

Let me put it this way as I put in a note to Adobe...

I work for a PBS television facility that not only produces television productions for broadcast, but also provides services for clients as well.

We are beginning the process of replacing all our AVID edit workstations with Adobe ones.  HOWEVER, with the new CC business model, we are re-thinking the switch from AVID to Adobe.  While the concept of having the most current version of the software available is a very tempting prospect, the biggest problem comes in here:

1. There is a strong possibility the advancements of the software will outpace the hardware and drive the need to replace with a greater frequency with no opportunity to prevent future upgrades that may be seriously deleterious to the operation of the hardware..

2. No matter how much equity you build up in the Creative Cloud software, the moment you cease your subscription, is the moment you lose the functionality of the software.

This is all unless I'm somehow misunderstanding how CC works.

My suggestion would be where you charge an initial large up-front fee for the software and then offer a subscription fee to keep current.  Then, as a user, if I choose to stop upgrading, I can simply stop at my current version until such time as I can afford to replace all my hardware and continue my subscription.

At this point, because of the CC business model change, we are seriously considering not to make the Adobe switch, but instead continue with AVID.

And this is my biggest complaint.  Glad I'm not the only one.  I just hope someone will listen.

[Andy_Bay]

Thxapproved, you have the right understanding.

If you are not happy with Avid, you might also want to download the demo for Edius 7. That editing program is pretty amazing, especially regarding the speed and the possible workflows.

[bababongatwo]

Not much discussed, but beside the missing exit-strategy (and losing my whole archive after subscription) - The argument, that you have to follow all of Adobes dictated hardware requirements, was my "second place concern".

The more I think about all the lacks (which will all become reality in long term) I wonder, why they can get anyone into dependency. May be, as the price sounds so "little" (compared to boxes). They should make daily/hourly payments - that sounds like realy nothing.

So I also decided not to follow Adobes "Vision of a cloud". No credit from my side for missmanagement and user ignoring. It´s not easy for me, to come out the dependency of Adobe-based workflows and file-Format troubles (Which is a dependency without subscribing for a long time user as me) - but it hurts less with every day.

----------

CC = Cash Cow = Terminating the word "Archive" in digital future = Lifelong dependency = NoGo = Never

[FrannieKN]

Since I have no inclination to subscribe and have been looking for alternatives to the Adobe software that I'm so comfortable with, it took 'til this morning for it to dawn on me about the point you make on software forcing hardware upgrades. 

I realized that, one day, my hardware will not be compatible with CS6, and I plan to be efficient with someone else's applications before then. But I didn't even think about the CCers who will eventually be forced to update hardware since even their willingness to pay subscription fees won't matter. Can you imagine booting up one morning to edit a client's ad at deadline (hey, it happens!), then finding out that last night's update rendered your hardware obsolete? Gulp!

I'm still confused on the business decision to eliminate the perpetual license option... if greed wasn't the primary reason. They offered us long-time Adobe supporters a chance to have software we could use without the monthly pay-up-or-else while retaining the right to upgrade per our timeline, and they offered an option to pirating for those who couldn't afford the initial chunk of money needed for a perpetual license. Am I just too simple-minded in thinking that giving customers two options was a great business decision?

[hershd777]

As many many of us have been following this for so long, it doesn't look

like Adobe is going to change their position in the near future. If enough

of us don't subscribe maybe we will see a change, but I am not counting on

it. For me CC is just not a realistic option as I am not a professional.

Furthermore, I want "ownership" of the software.

As I have been looking at alternatives, I have downloaded the latest

version (trial) of Edius Pro 7 (along with their great tutorial) and it is

a very good program. Very similar to PP and much easier to learn than Sony

Vegas (as I couldn't find tutorials), Lightworks (still buggy) and Avid.

Give it a try and spread the word...

[Kabinator]

The price for a year, and all the programmes a user gets isn't that bad. If it were an outright payment. But it's an annual fee. Why do you ask us to pay so much each year/month? Not everyone can afford it. It's a good way to loose customers.

I see the creative fields going similar to how the gaming industry went, only much worse. Games used to come as one. No extras, no micro payments. Now they're coming as a cheap game that you need to spend lots on to get all the extras.

In the creative field, at least for Adobe, it seems like we need to spend the money for the program that comes as one, and the buy it new every year. At least give us a discount for continuing our subscription. What we really want is to be able to buy them outright, but if subscription renewal weren't so expensive as buying the license in the first place, I'm sure more would continue to use the software..

[StormMarc]

ADOBE called me the other day.  It was a pleasant lady from India asking me why I have not joined the cloud.  I proceeded to unload on her all of my objections.  She listened politely and then told me she would pass them on and hopefully the company could find a solution to my concerns.

At one point in the conversation however she did say that Adobe has chosen to go this route, implying they will stay the course and I will miss out on all of the great new features by sticking with my dead CS6 software.  I countered that as a customer I will choose to go another route and I’m currently looking at alternative software as are many other former Adobe devotees. 

My hope is that they come to their senses before it’s too late.  I’m using Premiere CS6 which is a decent program but it needs some improvement like the ones I see in the new CC versions and I will not wait forever if they don’t switch to a more reasonable position on purchasing their software.

The reality is that there are plenty of good editing programs available and I refuse to join a never ending software renting scheme with no reasonable way to obtain a perpetual license.  That is my main concern regardless of how the deflecting marketing speak attempts to convince me otherwise.  Even AVID is offering a perpetual license as an alternative to their new rental model.   

ADOBE software has gone from a perpetual licensing system to a perpetual payment system and in my view that benefits one party—ADOBE.

[Ascenda_MCL]

I believe the CC business model is here to stay and to become the new normal in a not to distant future. Someone somewhere must have done the maths and it must be conclusive because Adobe is sticking to it and is developing the concept even more with its new Photography CC package. This tells me that the future LR6 will probably be cloud based only as well. Too bad I will not buy it if that is the case.

So...we may not like it (I don't and I am not on the CC for that reason), but I can understand other people's point of view that prefer or value the CC model when they do their own maths.

For me and hopefully for thousands of non-professional enthusiasts or teachers that make $0 from using these tools, the CC without the possibility to own the software at some point (basically when I decide I don't want to rent it anymore) is a no go. Too risky as it may become clearly unaffordable and my work may end up being lost after all.

The weight of those thousands of people may however be nothing compared to attracting small and medium (and large) businesses to the Cloud model. And if this prediction is correct then the future for the Adobe fan hobbyists is not going to be so great I am afraid.

But with any bad news usually come new opportunities. Don't know about designer software and video edition but as far as photography is concerned there are already good enough alternatives out there for the non pros like myself. I do not have to use Ps to make my pictures look stunning (assuming I am good enough as a photographer which is still to be confirmed 🙂 ). I can use more photography-minded software that do a pretty good job IMHO. Maybe we should let Adobe become a business to business company instead if they want to. That is their choice and their right after all. And maybe us, the non-pro I mean, should stay well clear of their products not because they suck but because we can probably do something good enough, as non-pro, with alternative software already available and already filling a good portion of the gap. And maybe that is the hidden message i.e.: "if you are a pro and make money thanks to our products then the CC model is probably acceptable to you. If you are not a pro, we don't recommend you buy our products at all, period. If you believe the competition cannot bring you the top notch quality that our products are providing you with, you are welcome to subscribe to the Cloud - we are telling you it is clearly not reasonable for a non-pro though but you are a big boy/girl after all so it is up to you. However if you are that demanding a person that you can only work with the best of the best tools out there maybe you are such a perfectionist that you should turn yourself into a professional after all and start making money from it..." how's that sound ?

At least that is how I translate their marketing garbage. In other words if we, non-pro, want to use pro products we shut up and buy into their strategy because it is not going to change anytime soon. Again I don't know about the other creative fields so my thinking may be wrong for these but as far as photography is concerned there are other software out there that are becoming truly very good and more focused. I would miss LR though that is for sure but nothing is irreplaceable, is it ?

[eschelar]

FWIW, I am a non-professional user who owns CS6 Production Premium and before that, CS5.5 Web Design Premium. (OK, actually, I do work with Adobe software and my Adobe skillset, but on the computers at work - my personal license is for me and I don't make money with it because I make money on computers at work with a different license... that and my photography kinda sucks...).

I paid for these products because I was happy with the direction they were going with $375 upgrades and the new "upgrade from student to non-student license" policy after years of trying to find a way to work $700USD into my personal budget. I used Photoshop for quite a few years via pirating before that when I was much lower on the income ladder.

I have since encouraged loads of people to 'go legit'.

But with CC, the only thing that's halfway reasonable is LR/PS at $9.99/mo. I know a few that fit that budget and usage pattern. I don't yet have a valid suggestion for them for how to deal with stopping the subscription payment and wanting to get back to their work....

But *everyone* I know that works with Adobe professionally simply cannot handle sticking to PS/LR. And there's no intermediate package pricing between that and full on CC.

Insanity.

There's only one thing left for it. Back to the skull'n'crossbones...

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Mine cost me several hundred dollars I could have just spent on video games instead of trying to send some financial good will to Adobe.

I don't know what kind of person can do the math and think it's a good deal to go from $375 every other year (maybe less if it was a good year, maybe more if things didn't go as well as hoped) to $600 every year whether you like it or not *FOREVER*.

Adobe can continue to make a profit from this model as long as they get 1/3 or more conversions to CC - even if their sales of CS6 stop dead. If their sales of CS6 keep going with an equal share to CC, they can get by with one in six people converting. The figures from what I heard were that anywhere between 44% and 50% had made the switch.

They must be swimming in cash.

But one of the things that made Adobe's "don't really give a crap" policy against piracy so effective was that Adobe grew to become a nearly universal standard. *Everyone* in the graphic arts industry uses Adobe - usually several products too. This in turn makes their software more vital and desirable - and in my case, worth paying for.

Thankfully, Adobe retains this policy and pirate versions are still freely available - although signs do point to this policy starting to change as they might be looking at closing some of the old back doors.

Whereas back in the day of PS7.0, CS~ through CS6, people like me were paying for Adobe because we weren't irresponsible kids anymore, now it has become a situation where people are paying for Adobe because it is the ubiquitous standard.

But if their pricing and length of use policy doesn't work for a huge chunk (probably the majority of actual Adobe users, including the vast number of those who use pirated software) of these people, *and* they suddenly close the back doors, you will see Adobe losing masses of market share. If they keep the back doors open, they will probably continue to receive cash from the small number of people who really suck at math for many years as their software becomes less and less indispensible. They will probably cut corners like decreasing the number and quality of updates (already evidenced), but ultimately, if you keep charging more for a lower quality service, people will eventually figure it out. And as the total number of users starts to drop, the software will become less common. This will destroy Adobe's place as a standard.

The story ends the same way.

The question is - will you be the one who paid to support this self-destructive business policy?

[dsfsdsdfsdffdsf]

I'm a fan of the CC but I'd hope at the end of the day everyone is making an informed, weighted decision regarding the software they use, rather than simply assuming they need it because it's 'industry standard'. If the subscription model no longer offers good value for money or lags behind competitor advances then look elsewhere. There are reasonable alternatives for most of the Adobe lineup, although none that quite offer the integration of the suite. I use the full CC at work because a) we factor the subscription costs into our operating expenses so can justify the price, and b) I believe it offers great value for money for the range of titles it offers (of which we use about a dozen of them regularly). But there's no way I could justify it at home - I stick with the LR/PS deal for my stills and look elsewhere for edit packages. If it's not working for you for whatever reason try elsewhere. And post back to let us know how you found the alternatives.

[RobertoBlake]

Good businesses shift with the times even when their users don't. Companies that fail to do so end up like KODAK and BLOCKBUSTER.

Boxed or Perpetual License software in the Creative Services Industry can't scale anymore with how the technology surrounding the industry and the industry itself is working. It's much the same problem with those going to school for Graphic Design. They are being taught by professors that haven't used the latest software or competed in the industry and designed for new technology and marketing trends. This is why many are shifting into online learning from Lynda and Udemy and Kelby One and paying a subscription or going to YouTube.

The argument is that the competitors aren't doing it, but that is false, they all are following Adobe and just haven't gone ALL IN... not yet. AutoDesk has had subscriptions for a while now and Corel has entered that as well. AutoDesk subscriptions are much more expensive that Adobe and Corel is much cheaper. 3D anv VFX people love the subscription model for AutoDesk because if you think Adobe is expensive you have no idea... VFX is insanely expensive and 3D...::shutters::

Corel is much cheaper for boxed software and subscriptions, 25/mo and 200/year, but its also less widely used (aside from Digital Painting and Concept Art) and thus doesn't land people who want to work in the Design industry or get Freelance Jobs a lot of money. Clients do care about what software you use. Employers certainly do, because it is a matter of "Workflow" something hobbyist don't really understand sometimes.

It's simple, if your intention is to be the best like no one ever was, you find a way to make it happen. If you only use Photoshop, guess what it's now 10/month and you get lightroom. That is overkill for a hobbyist. I don't think I've had a hobby that cheap before, even when I played Magic the Gathering.  You could make that money back on a Photo Blog for Christ sakes. Let alone if you snap something for a friend or family member.

The Full Creative Cloud Subscription averages out to the equivalent of $1.66/day less than $2/day. You could find that in seat cushions, pan handle for it, give up soft drinks or not tip when you when you eat out and come up with that money. It's not a hardship.

Everyone says this is bad for Freelancers. I'm a freelancer, I've been on the subscription model for almost 3 years, gave my physical licenses to family and couldn't be happier. It hasn't hurt my cashflow because I know how to run my business correctly and the passive income side covers that as well as many of the other monthly and yearly cost associated with running my business. It's that simple.

If you have problems finding $2/day in extra cash flow it may have something to do with your business model, not Adobe's.

[eschelar]

What about users who own a personal copy for personal projects. I use myself as an example. At work, I use the company's license.

But for my personal use, I own CS6 Production Premium. It was a perfect match for my interests and skillset. I also got to learn and self-improve with it.

However, in the past 2 years, I've done very little with it. Because of work, I don't have a lot of time to go out shooting much and my camera kit is usually in the office anyhow. I don't mind having software that I have paid for but I don't use it much, just like I don't mind having a camera that I don't use for personal enjoyment that much (I have 4 cameras at this time that I don't use much). But when I need them, they are there.

For me, switching to CC represents a tripling of cost (assuming a 1.5-2 year upgrade routine - I bootlegged through university, but even still, I only upgraded 7.0 to CS3, CS3 to CS4 and CS4 to CS5.5 (legit) and CS6 (legit)). And this was money that came from my pocket when I felt that I had enough to merit an upgrade.

Now though, my office copy is CC, and my personal license is CS6. I have told Adobe three times already that I am ready to pay for CS7 Production Premium and will not enter into a CC arrangement because I don't want to get locked in to paying vs *not being able to use it at all* for when/if I might have to do an employment switch or major change in location and money runs low. Of course they will not budge because this model means that if half their users quit, they are still making 50% more revenue, so why would they.

But do you really think it is worth it to me as a consumer to have to pay 2-3 times more for the exact same service?

Lots of people can afford it - indeed, at this time, I can probably afford it. But there are some rocks in the river up ahead for me that might mean that within 6 months to a year, I won't be in a position to pay at all. Should I then be relegated to the "sorry about your bad luck, by the way *NO ADOBE FOR YOU*" after having supported the company with my thousands of dollars?

If you think that's the correct way for things to work, you've been smoking the wrong pipeweed my friend.

[RobertoBlake]

You're clearly and intelligent person so I'm sure you will understand what I'm about to say. If you value something, you will pay for it. If you want something enough and value it enough you will commit to a means of affording it.

I don't work a 9 to 5 job anymore, I'm in a much more cash flow sensitive situation as a result than most of the people commenting on this forum based on what they've said. You're concerned about 6 months down the road, of all people I get that. But you're making a decision about an investment from the fear of lack or the fear of possible failure. "What if I can't afford it 6 months from now?"  Really. Are you planning to afford rent, utilities and food 6 months from now?

Why plan for failure? Because I know I need to afford things my actions are dictated by that to create the success necessary.
While I can imagine a scenario where I couldn't afford the subscription I've created contingencies to avoid that. And I know there is little chance that once the 30-90 day clock starts that I couldn't turn it around.

I'm sure you are an intelligent enough person as are most people here that you could find a way to come up with $60.

The same way you'd come up with $350-500 for a one time upgrade.

As to NO ADOBE FOR YOU, I'm not on the pipeweed here my friend, that would be you. The bank that covers your house or apartment isn't going to let you skate on loyalty after paying them 10's of thousands of dollars over the years, the same for your car dealership/ car note, electricity company phone company.

NO COMPANY/BUSINESS OPERATES THAT WAY, and that is why they are still in business.

Software at the higher end is moving to a utility model, its a painful shift, but I remember all the gripes when Photography went Digital too. All the crying and nashing of teeth from people who invested in wet laps and equipment. We evolve or we die, it can be simpler than that.

[eschelar]

I gave a good example of a company that does work that way.

Canon.

I pay my money. I get my camera. I wait a bit, I get another one. Great, now I've got a 7D that I don't use anymore because I'm using my 70D for 95% of my shooting.

*But I don't have to keep paying for it every single month just so I can have the freedom to just pick it up and use it when I do have the time*. Nor do I have to pay $30 to activate it if I didn't have to keep paying.

In fact, almost every single software company in the history of computers has operated on a non-subscription based model. And lots and lots of happy customers.

For me, I chose to take a job that suited my technical skills, but because I'm not in sales, I don't get the big fat commission paychecks to buy myself a villa in Spain. And if something happens, I might run into cash flow problems pretty quick. Here's one scenario. I had a bit of a cancer scare recently with some abnormal blood test results. If that had gone a bad direction, I would currently have no work and would probably need to relocate to somewhere where I could avail myself of Canadian Health care and if I'm lucky, my family would help me out. Still, it would leave me with much less cash, most of my "stuff" would probably be sold at a major loss and I'd suddenly be thrust back into the Vancouver cost of living. Based on what I have in the bank and what I know it costs to live there, even without any medical concerns, I'd be down to $0 within about 3 months.

And the fun thing is - I'd be in no position to get normal work, probably relegated to playing with my Canon cameras to try to generate some feeble income. Except that my Canon Cameras would work regardless of how much money I had recently given to Canon. My Adobe CC software though - not a chance. SOL.

Now I know this sounds like a lot of doom and gloom and hypothetical worrying - *except this very thing happened to good friends of mine who was a downstairs neighbor to me for 3 years*. Fortunately for him, he was married and they owned a small property. He was able to find good work while his wife went through Chemo. She was an AI buff and graphic designer. He was a professional wedding photographer with moderate skills in Photoshop. While she was laid up with ovarian cancer, she dusted off her old copy of AI CS2 and spent a few months generating a small amount of interest in her work (though no income for several months). If she has been using CC - that old copy would just be "sorry, you can't use this, you didn't pay us".

Again, they were lucky because they already had quite a bit of cash and they were married, so he could support her. But not everyone is so fortunate.

This is a sharp reminder to me that if I ever had to hand my balls in a tourniquet over to Adobe, if I hit a health speed bump, I'm screwed. If I lose my current job and have to go back to Canada, I'm very likely screwed.

This doesn't make Adobe's CC proposition very attractive to me as a long term solution.

Not to mention the bottom line that I pointed to before: CC on its own represents a tripling of my budget.

What things do you buy on a regular basis that you would happily start paying triple for without receiving any meaningful improvement in service?

What things do you buy on a regular basis that you would happily start paying triple for that you think would be acceptable to make it impossible (or to be fair, let's say "much more inconvenient") to use unless you visited their store/restaurant or whatever at least once a month?

Can you imagine if you went to MacDonalds or Subway and suddenly they said "That will be $30 for that meal" (yes, McD's costs about 8 bucks in Canada, 10 with tax), oh and I see you haven't been to MacDonald's for more than a month, so you're going to need to go over there and fill in some e-forms to re-instate your service status with us.

Why do you think that is acceptable for Adobe to do that to me if I want to use Photoshop to throw a bit of text or crop a snapshot that I took with my cell phone, but I haven't been keeping up with my payments?

Naw, I bought CS5.5 and 6 out of good will for Adobe because I wanted to go legit and I wanted to support their company for making wise decisions (dropping the cost of their upgrades to $375). Now they are getting greedy, I will not support that for the tiny amount of use I get out of my personal copies. I'll just bootleg it for my home PC... if I ever do a video project for personal use that requires round-tripping from Premiere Pro to Speedgrade... The rest will just have to happen at work on lunch break or whatever.

[davez]

"Can you imagine if you went to MacDonalds or Subway and suddenly they said "That will be $30 for that meal" (yes, McD's costs about 8 bucks in Canada, 10 with tax), oh and I see you haven't been to MacDonald's for more than a month, so you're going to need to go over there and fill in some e-forms to re-instate your service status with us."

That is apples to oranges.

You go into McDonalds for a meal that you will eat once and it is gone.   McDonalds staff do not have to support you or your digestive issues you may have from eating too much later at home over the phone. Unless they gave you tainted food, its all on you and they are done with you the second money changes hands and you walk away with a sack of burgers.

Software we expect to use it, and get support for it,for much longer. That support costs money. Developing new updates costs money. Etc Etc.

[zaph_42]

well as a professional Motion Designer I managed until now to stick to my AE CS6 version ... not easy!

now the time has come that I need to upgrade and "rent" it.

the only thing that made me refuse switching to the CC version was (and still is) that I will not be able to access my own work after I'll stop paying (and there are for so many reasons to do so).

are there any plans from Adobe's side to offer a solution to give access to your own work that you created in countless hours when the CC subscription will end?

accessible but not editable would already do for me.

[eschelar]

It is verifiable by a google search that Adobe has stated that they intended to address this even as early as 2013.

Aaaaaaand they have absolutely not done so. Of course they would not. A kidnapper would not ask for a ransom for a child, then say that the child would be allowed out on weekends and could visit the family's home.

It is contrary to the policy of ransomware. Which is why intelligent people everywhere recognize that CC is ransomware. Professionals who enter into this contract lose control over their own work. This is unacceptable on every level. I consider this to be illegal, although I'm sure there are some Adobe paid lawyers that have made sure it sort of technically isn't.

But it means that I no longer have any qualms about people who have turned instead to pirating. Adobe used rampant piracy to establish their brand at the top of the ladder and become an industry standard, but creating easy, predictable cracking methods that were not closed from early versions right until today. This worked because as students and young people grew older and matured, both emotionally and professionally, they grew into a desire to purchase software legitimately and give back to the company that enabled their livelihood. It was a very good grand plan for the long term taking advantage of the unavoidable nature of software piracy and turning it into a scheme that put butter on their bread and food on their plates.

Now they are trying to screw those people over and enforce draconian, improper and possibly flat out illegal policies such as ransomware (which is not really any different from Cryptolocker or some other big bad in our real world) and for some reason, they think that will not drive a mass exodus straight back to pirating their software. Their soft-peddle is that they "will address this issue in the future", but in the past 3 years have made no visible attempt to do so.

How do they expect a working professional/freelancer to find new work if they cannot access their work files?
Why do they even think that it's acceptable to limit *anyone*'s access to their own work in the first place?

These are not answers that they want their shareholders to think about. I have voted with my wallet, but my vote is insignificant. But I will remain voting that way until they wise up. I am still willing to continue to pay for upgrades on my own license, but I will never pay a red cent under terms of ransomware.

If someone kidnapped my child, they could expect some serious resistance from me and I would not behave at all nicely, especially if my child were to be secured, I would react with extreme prejudice. True, this is only trying to kidnap my work, so I wouldn't need to kill anyone as I would probably do if my child were at stake. But the insult is definitely the same flavor. Adobe doesn't treat my work with respect. Why should I (or anyone else) treat theirs?

[zaph_42]

Which is why intelligent people everywhere recognize that CC is ransomware. Professionals who enter into this contract lose control over their own work. This is unacceptable on every level. I consider this to be illegal, although I'm sure there are some Adobe paid lawyers that have made sure it sort of technically isn't.

well expressed eschelar​ !!!

Adobe software always was expensive but having no access to my work the day I'll end the CC subscription is not acceptable!

so far I managed to find alternative software to do my job but still stuck on After Effects.

CS6 does still do the job and the "minor" updates are not worth all the money my colleagues spent monthly (while cursing) over the years!

before you could skip a version when you were not convinced about the updates and I believe that was a major reason to impose the CC to us user's!

everybody, I mean everybody of my professional colleagues are unhappy about the "ransomware" of CC and renting their software to be able to do their work.

very interesting is that most of my colleagues kept the CS6 version (next to CC!!!) and therefore exchanging files is still possible. which means we still do our work with After Effects CS6 (because you're not able to save files to an older version) ... and therefore AE has become an outdated industry standard ... and we do work for big hollywood productions!

but wait until the day an alternative to AE is out there ...!

I wonder what would happen when all the unhappy renter's finally stand up and express their point of view: would that convince Adobe to offer an alternative to the CC-RENT? or are we just renter's and nobody cares what we think ... until we move all out?

[FrannieKN]

My work doesn't include needing the upgrades Adobe now only offered through CC, so I'm able to avoid paying a monthly "toll" to Adobe to be able to continue working as a freelancer. I may have to keep a second computer running an older OS so that will not force me to upgrade to CC. And, I'm trying out some of the open source options and finding that they do what I need them to do, so I'll move to those if the day comes that hardware dictates that I can't use my perpetually-licensed software. I will gladly pay other companies to have rights to use their software forever after payment.

And, that's how I vote! I may be just one voice, but everyone else here is another vote, and we should add up to something substantial if Adobe cares. If they're monitoring this forum and hearing that this conversation continues to alienate previous Adobe fans, maybe they'll find a different way to remain profitable that brings back the Adobe that I loved - the one who kept their customer's needs in mind. I was loyal to that Adobe. Provo did a great job marketing one of their products, and it became "industry standard". Then, they decided to either buy out or sue anyone who impinged on their world, and they also moved their "soft" add-ons and upgrades to web-based and charged monthly access. This made many customers angry, and guess what? Entrepreneurs jumped on the chance to compete, and Provo's product is no longer the big name in that market. Adobe isn't the only game out there, but they're using bully tactics like Provo did.

Does anyone else think that Adobe isn't responding to us because they're waiting for those who know what customer service really is all about to die off and are counting on their younger market to accept paying for monthly access?