Adobe CC2017 File Create Date and Time (OSX 10.12.2 Sierra)

[DougKatz]

Clearly this is not an Illustrator-only question and may have more to do with Sierra 10.12.2, Adobe apps (or me). But this forum is where the best answers are gotten on a host of things….

Can anyone confirm that Sierra's Finder does not retain the Created Date and Time of an AICC 2017, PSCC 2017 or Acrobat Pro 2017 file that has been Saved or Saved As…? Instead, Finder re-sets the Created Date and Time to the file's Modified Date?

I am seeing this on my new iMac, both in Finder windows and in Get Info panes (command-i). This is not happening with Apple programs like Pages and TextEdit.

Thanks.

[DougKatz]

Don't mean to be a pest about this. Wondering if anyone can tell me a more practical place to post my question. I'm guessing a forum that discusses OS issues more than Illustrator, or even Adobe issues? The problem is a real one if accurate file creation date-stamping is important.

[eclectic4]

We have a client that just asked this exact same question. She states it only happens in Illustrator...

[DougKatz]

Wow. Thanks, eclectic4. From the non-response here, I assumed this was an oddity unique to my setup, and I was just going to have to live with the inconvenience. I may still have to live with it, but it's good to know it may be Illustrator and not me. I expect more people are experiencing it but maybe not noticing. For me it's not a trivial issue. I'd love to get a fix.

If you come across anything – or just have more people reporting it – please let me know.

[Kurt Gold]

I can confirm the wrong behaviour as well. It looks like Illustrator is the only programme that is affected by the issue. You also mentioned Photoshop and Acrobat. They behave fine here, so I cannot confirm the second part of your complaint.

As far as Finder is concerned I don't know how to cure it. Probably you just can't at the moment.

Two workarounds for Illustrator as a temporary solution: Take Adobe Bridge to get the correct infos or – right in Illustrator – go to File > File Info …

[DougKatz]

With apologies to all, it is NOT a problem with Photoshop nor with Acrobat here either. I misspoke in my original post. Illustrator is the only offender on my machine.

Kurt, are you suspecting an Illustrator problem or some interaction between Illustrator and Sierra? (I jumped from Lion to Sierra – a long jump – and from CS5 to CC 2017 – another long jump – so I'm guessing the problem didn't exist with earlier OS and AI versions?.)

And thank you for the workarounds.

[Kurt Gold]

I'm afraid I don't have a clue. First I thought it may have to do with the Autosave option for Data-Recovery, but turning off that option did not help.

As for the Illustrator and OS jumps, I also jumped from CS5 to CC 2017 (still mostly using CS5) and the OS jump was even longer (Snow Leopard to Sierra, still using Snow Leopard most of the time). Therefore I cannot tell which Illustrator or OS version introduced the misbehaviour.

[DougKatz]

You are as stubborn and unfashionable as I! I, for one, am an embarrassment to my profession and my family. It's just that I can get done whatever I need to with my Model T Ford and dial-up phone….

[Test Screen Name]

This doesn't seem at all unusual. There are two ways to save a changed file (from a programmer's point of view).

1. Write over the original file.

2. Write a new file. Delete the old. Rename the new as the old.

1 has the advantage that the creation date stays the same; the disadvantage that if the save goes wrong you have nothing useful.

2 has the advantage that if the save goes wrong you just have the old file; the disadvantage that the creation date is lost

Some apps might try and preserve the creation date, but the system may reject any attempt to fake a creation date.

[DougKatz]

Hmm. Having no programming experience, I readily take your word about the options. On the other hand,

1. This is a change in Illustrator (and/or OS) convention. I've never seen the Created Date changed on a Save As in 25 years – with any program I've ever used, from the simple TextEdit to Word to Pages to any Adobe software. The convention I'm familiar with is to change the Modified Date, leaving the Created Date unchanged.

2. Why have a separate Created Date and Modified Date if they're identical with each save or save as? One would do.

3. A fixed Created Date – set when a file is saved or saved as for the first time – makes so much more sense, don't you think? Knowing when you or someone else first created an illustration, for example, can be valuable in a host of circumstances. It certainly is in my work.

I'm just grateful we have Kurt around to discover workarounds.

[Test Screen Name]

You might find that the true creation date is preserved in the metadata. Certainly would be for Photoshop. Maybe Illustrator changed to do more reliable saves? Sorry it would all be speculation.

[Kurt Gold]

Yes, the metadata does show the correct dates. That's why I suggested to use File > File Info … as one workaround.

The current behaviour is an anomaly. Probably just caused by a little bug in Illustrator, Sierra or both of them.

[DougKatz]

Kurt, I've just opened a file created last month in AICC 2017 that I modified earlier today. As we've been discussing, the file now shows in Sierra's Finder as having both a Created Date and a Modified Date of February 4, 2017, 9:56:21 AM.

I wanted to confirm the accuracy of the metadata. I went to File>File Info…>Basic. There I looked at the dates at the bottom of the Basic panel. They both read Feb 4, 2017, 9:56:21 AM!

Am I not looking in the right place for the metadata?!

[Kurt Gold]

That usually happens if you do a Save as while replacing an existing file. Guess you did that.

The File > File Info … workaround is only safe to operate when you are executing plain Save commands. And you may have to close and reopen the file to get the correct dates. I should have mentioned that.

[DougKatz]

Ah. OK, that's helpful. I think you're also telling me – due to this glitch we've uncovered in AICC 2017, Sierra or both – there really is no way for the moment to discover the true creation date of any Saved As files.

Oh well. Woe is me. Like you say, there are worse things in the world.

[Kurt Gold]

Well, mayhap you could take a field in the File Info xmp data section to declare in lieu of an oath that the current file was originally created in the past.

That may sound silly at first glance, but it could pioneer some unimaginable ways to substitute familiar routines.