How to create Outlines in indesign?

I have the same problem in InDesign with the newest version. It is not possible for me to use Ctr+Shift+o to create outlines of text. I have to use the menu. The shortkey does not work right. I try it in two differnt languages.

Great to get your expert opinion on this matter Dov.

I think what we also have to understand is that not all printers are large companies that operate with an Adobe RIP workflow (wouldnt it be nice if they did!).

Certainly in my case, where ive encountered issues and the need to outline work, are with sign writers and smaller scale printers, as we provide artwork for all kinds of media.

The sign writers and smaller scale printers i’ve dealt with generally have sub-standard RIP’s supplied with their printing equipment which can lead to problems outputting or even submitting files to, and ultimately forcing the sign writers and smaller scale printers to ask for people to supply artwork that works on their sub-standard rips.

We also have to take into consideration that not all printers/graphic designers are as well educated in their field of expertise, and just aren’t generally aware of how a rip actually works and what it can handle regardless of who it is made by!

I’ve been in the industry for around 15 years now, starting off working as a machine printer and eventually settling into the origination side of things, and in those years i’ve probably made every mistake in the book…but learnt from it!

Fortunately i have the desire to not keep making the same mistakes and constantly look to further my knowledge and expertise in what i do, a trait i feel that seems to be lost more and more these days!

I've been following this thread without commenting so far without comment (other than being quoted) and quite frankly, I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

A few thoughts:

(1)     With regards to printers requiring that submitted PDF files have text “outlined,” per my quoted comments, yes it degrades quality (typically overly-bolded and distorted details depending on the particular font's design) due to geometric scaling as opposed to intelligent scaling governed by the “hints” in the fonts, yes it yields bloated PDF files that take much longer to transmit and RIP, and yes it yields a non-searchable and non-retouchable PDF file.

(2)     Adobe not only produces content creation, layout, and editing software, but also provides RIP software used for Adobe PostScript and native PDF rendering (Adobe PDF Print Engine). We are also quite aware of the capabilities of the RIP software of Adobe's competitors (such as Global Graphics). As far as we can tell, most of the mishegoss with regards to the need to outline text stems from dicey clone PostScript implementations dating back from over 20 years ago. Typically, if you can open a PDF file in the free Adobe Reader and page through the PDF file and all pages render correctly on the screen, the likelihood of problems when printing is exceptionally low. If the same file is viewed via a soft-proofer (i.e., screen-based proofer) based on the printer's RIP/DFE and no anomalies appear, that likelihood of problem is essentially 0%. It is more likely that you will have RIP problems with gradients, color, etc. The bottom line is that requirements for outlining text are really based on fear due to memories passed down from very few experiences from two decades ago as opposed to today's reality. If you have a print service provider that really still has routine issues with fonts, you have great evidence that the print service provider is using RIPs and at least some workflow software that should have been replaced 20 years ago!

(3)     The idea of opening PDF files in Adobe Illustrator is horrific. Adobe Illustrator is not, repeat not, repeat yet again not a general purpose PDF file editor. The only PDF files that can be safely opened in Adobe Illustrator are PDF files saved from the current or earlier version of Adobe Illustrator with the “save editability” enabled (an option that is not available with any PDF/X file) and if all the fonts used in the PDF file are actually installed on the system. Otherwise, the symptoms you can experience include (a) font substitutions, (b) text spacing changes, (c) unexpected color space changes/conversions, (d) modified content, and (e) lost content (especially if the original Illustrator had content placed via links). Why is this true? Adobe Illustrator doesn't support the full PDF specification, only the subset of PDF needed to represent Illustrator objects! When encountering “printing issues” presented by Adobe customers to us on these forums, perhaps the most common single cause of such problems is the routine opening and supposed “fixing” of PDF files by prepress operators opening the modifying arbitrary PDF files in Adobe Illustrator! The second most common cause of problems are supposed “fixups” made by automated PDF workflow products that some vendors convince some prepress operators to routinely use!

(4)     The printing industry is in severe crisis these days due to the organic changes in the industry and what is actually printed. Many print service providers are desperate for work and would be well-advised to abandon their “my way or the highway” attitude towards modern best practice PDF publishing workflows and their customers.

(5)     I don't expect or even want a print service provider to “fix” my press-ready PDF/X-4 files. If a print service provider believes there is an issue with my files or content, I expect them to contact me and advise me of what they believe the problem is and let me make fixes in my source files if in fact there really is a problem. In many cases, one man's desired effects is another man's “problem.”

          - Dov

You have your answer, Martin, but following along with Derek Cross's thinking, you might find this article (written by another one of our ACPs) to be an interesting read: https://indesignsecrets.com/outlining-fonts-is-it-necessary.php

I know that we often have to do what the client asks, but this might be something to gently share with them, as well.

~Barb

Why do you want to convert your text to outlines?

You've posted in the Lounge which is a non-technical support area. Moving to InDesign forum.