AI Denoise Panorama

[darraghm98410987]

Hi,

Only started playing around with the new denoise feature yesterday. It's unbelievable.

However, I stumbled across a slight problem. I merged a panorama of about 7 images, all DNG no edit on them. Didn’t apply the auto settings from the panorama either. So that spits out a new DNG image for me, but doesn't want to run the AI denoise on it. I get that some formats won't work, as well as compressed DNGs etc etc. Am I wrong to assume all the necessary data is in the panorama to run the AI denoise? 

Would love to know why it won't work.

[TheDigitalDog]

Linear DNGs cannot be processed in Denoise; they are partially processed. Thats likely why some don't work for you. 

[johnrellis]

"Am I wrong to assume all the necessary data is in the panorama to run the AI denoise?"

To build on thedigitaldog's reply, the panoramas are "linear" DNGs -- the raw sensor data has been converted to RGB data prior to merging.  Currently, Denoise only works with raw sensor data, not RGB data.  See here for details:

https://www.lightroomqueen.com/denoise-work/

[thomas_bredenfeld]

just swap your two process steps:

1. apply denoise on the raw files as they only work with original raws while respecting the generic sensor behavior.
2. them merge the denoised single images into a panorama.

also keep in mind that the panorama stitching includes a geometric treatment to compensate the original lens projection and to fit the new projection of the panorama during the merging process (either into a flat, a cylindrical or a spherical projection). so the original pixel pattern necessary for the Ai denoising isn't available anymore after stitching the panorama.

[stephan_7311]

just swap your two process steps:

1. apply denoise on the raw files as they only work with original raws while respecting the generic sensor behavior.
2. them merge the denoised single images into a panorama.

By @thomas_bredenfeld

How will this work with the new "preview" mode where it's no longer creating a new, denoised DNG file, but rather adding the denoising pattern to the existing DNG? My feeling is that even if I follow your advice, first denoise and then merge, the denoising is ignored and the merged file contains the non-denoised images. 

[JohanElzenga]

This is an old thread, things have already changed. The current version of Lightroom can denoise linear DNG files, so you can safely assume that the future non-destructive version will be able to do that as well.

[stephan_7311]

Thx, will try in Lightroom then. In Camera Raw it didn't work (actually I could run the denoise function, but the result was defective and unusable, I basically got a green picture.)

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

Green Pictures are usually a sign of an out-of-date Video Driver. 

[stephan_7311]

Without denoise:

With denoise (1 %):

You think this could be caused by the video driver?

[stephan_7311]

@Rikk Flohr: Photography Hey, thanks for the hint! Disabled GPU acceleration and now it's working:

[Ian Lyons]

@stephan_7311 

Which confirms what @Rikk Flohr: Photography  wrote (i.e. that the issue is related to the GPU driver. 

Note that when you disable GPU acceleration, then Develop module performance will be degraded. Therefore, you should update the driver asap.

[stephan_7311]

Exactly. However, I already have the latest driver - I can check if there any settings that could affect this, but I can't "update". But ... I don't have a "real" GPU anyway, only Intel chipset - I don't see a notable performance difference with GPU acceleration. Not sure whether it's not even faster without. I can live with the current settings.

[johnrellis]

@stephan_7311: "I already have the latest driver ... I don't have a "real" GPU anyway, only Intel chipset"

Please do the LR menu command Help > System Info and copy/paste the entire contents here so we can see exactly which versions of hardware and software LR thinks you're running.

[stephan_7311]

@johnrellis Thx!

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Portable Bit Map 26.5 - aus der Datei "“PBM.8bi”"
Prägepapier 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Punktieren 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Punktierstich 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Radialer Weichzeichner 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Radiance 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Radiance.8bi”"
Rasterungseffekt 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Risse 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Schwamm 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Schwingungen 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Selektiver Weichzeichner 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Solarisation 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Solarize.8bf”"
SP Substance Suite NO VERSION - aus der Datei "“MaterialSuite.8li”"
Spritzer 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Standardabweichung 26.5 - aus der Datei "“statistics.8ba”"
Stempel 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Strichumsetzung 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Strudel 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Stuck 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Substance 3D Viewer NO VERSION - aus der Datei "“Substance3DViewerForPs.8bi”"
Sumi-e 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Summe 26.5 - aus der Datei "“statistics.8ba”"
Targa 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Tontrennung && Kantenbetonung 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Unterstützung für Skripten 26.5 - aus der Datei "“ScriptingSupport.8li”"
Varianz 26.5 - aus der Datei "“statistics.8ba”"
Verbiegen 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Verflüssigen 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Liquify.8bf”"
Versetzen 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Verwackelte Striche 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Weiches Licht 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Filter Gallery.8bf”"
Wellen 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
WIA-Unterstützung 26.5 - aus der Datei "“WIASupport.8li”"
Windeffekt 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Wireless Bitmap 26.5 - aus der Datei "“WBMP.8bi”"
Wölben 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”"
Wolken 26.5 - aus der Datei "“Clouds.8bf”"

Optionale Zusatzmodule und Zusatzmodule von Drittanbietern: KEINE

Doppelte und deaktivierte Zusatzmodule: KEINE

Nicht geladene Zusatzmodule: KEINE

Einheitliche Erweiterungsplattform - Erweiterungen:

Home Screen (Geladen) 8.3.0.35 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
CmdN: 1.23.5
UAB: 2.18.0-8
Geladen nach: 94 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 44 ms
ccx-timeline (Vorbereitet) 3.1.12.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
CCX Commenting UXP Webview (Geladen) 30.7.0.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 3877 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 0 ms
CCX Sharesheet UXP (Vorbereitet) 30.24.0.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
In app notifications (Geladen) 2.0.25.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 96 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 0 ms
Content Credentials (Geladen) 0.51.4.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 3097 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 1 ms
CC Libraries Panel (Vorbereitet) 4.10.74.0 - von der Datei "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe/CEP/Extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_4_10_74\"
CAPTURE: 2.0.41 STOCK: 4.2.6
Parametrischer Filter (Vorbereitet) 1.0.0.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Photoshop Adjustments Panel (Geladen) 2.3.4.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 1867 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 1 ms
Photoshop UXP Export-As (Vorbereitet) 5.12.1.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Photoshop In App Messaging (Geladen) 4.5.4.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 3877 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 0 ms
Information Alert (Vorbereitet) 0.5.0.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Photoshop Selection Feedback (Vorbereitet) 0.5.0.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Share Panel (Vorbereitet) 1.0.12.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Plugins Panel (Vorbereitet) 1.6.9.0 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Substance 3D Viewer Plugin for Photoshop (Vorbereitet) 1.0.0.0 - von der Datei "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe/UXP/Extensions\com.adobe.substance-3d.viewer.ps\"
IC popup message (Geladen) 1.0.0.0
Geladen nach: 3098 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 0 ms
Multilayer Protection (Geladen) 1.0.0.0
Geladen nach: 3099 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 0 ms
Discover Panel (Geladen) 2502.118.0.9 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Geladen nach: 3880 ms – Einfluss auf die Startzeit: 2 ms
Neural Filters (Eingetragen) 1.15.0.102 - von der Datei "Erforderlicher Ordner"
Scanzeit: 0 ms – Einträge: 34

Erweiterungen:

Bibliotheken 1.0.0 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_4_10_74\index.html”
com.adobe.stock.panel.licensing-embedded 4.0.35 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_4_10_74\extensions\stock-panel-licensing\index.html”
com.adobe.capture.extension 2.0.41 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_4_10_74\extensions\capture\capture.html”
Exportieren als 4.8.16 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop 2025\Required\CEP\extensions\com.adobe.photoshop.crema\index.html”
Exportieren als 4.8.16 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop 2025\Required\CEP\extensions\com.adobe.photoshop.crema\index.html”
com.adobe.cclibraries.manager 1.0.0 – aus der Datei “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_4_10_74\manager.html”

Installierte TWAIN-Geräte: KEINE

[johnrellis]

@stephan_7311: "

Driver date: 2024-08-27 000000.000000-000
Driver age: 8 months
Driver version: 32.0.101.5973

GPUName: Intel(R) UHD Graphics 770"

Your current graphics driver is 8 months old. The latest (from this week) can be downloaded from here:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/download/785597/intel-arc-iris-xe-graphics-windows.html?wapk...

In general, the most reliable way to get the most recent driver is by going to the manufacturer's web site. Windows Update and computer manufacturers' utilities (e.g. Dell) often don't provide the latest version, and sometimes even the manufacturer's auto-update utilities don't.

[stephan_7311]

@johnrellis , @Rikk Flohr: Photography Thx, it worked after updating the driver (I'm sure I posted this here but can't find the comment). Anyway, driver is still the same but now it doesn't work anymore, or at least not for all images:

Device 0
Name: Intel(R) UHD Graphics 770
Preferred: TRUE
Power Envelope: UNKNOWN
Attachment: UNKNOWN
# attached displays: 1
\\.\DISPLAY6
GPU accessible RAM: 34,314 MB
VRAM: 128 MB
Dedicated System RAM: 0 MB
Shared System RAM: 34,186 MB
API version: 12.1 (12.1)
Device version: 12.0 (12.0)
Vendor name: INTEL
Driver date: 2025-04-03 000000.000000-000
Driver age: 0 months
Driver version: 32.0.101.6734
Supports UMA: SUPPORTED
D3D-ID: 42880

I've now disabled GPU acceleration and it's working this way. And, as I already noticed before, I don't see a significant difference in performance - with or without GPU acceleration it takes around 6 minutes to denoise a 24 MP image.

[johnrellis]

@stephan_7311: "As I already noticed before, I don't see a significant difference in performance - with or without GPU acceleration it takes around 6 minutes to denoise a 24 MP image."

You've got an older, low-end integrated graphics processor, and this is the expected performance on such GPUs.

[stephan_7311]

Yes, I meant, it's not a big deal for me to disable GPU acceleration.

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

Disabling the GPU is only a diagnostic step to confirm the issue. You need to update your driver or wait for a fix from your GPU manufacturer.  The performance will be poorer while disabled. 

[stephan_7311]

My problem returned, not sure if due graphics driver update or Photoshop update. However, this time it is not related to CPU acceleration (unless the bug is related to how ACR uses that).

Whether GPU acceleration is turned on or off - the first panorama that I denoise after starting Photoshop is correct. However, when I later denoise another panorama, I get wrong colors:

Then I cancel ACR (not saving the denoised version), exit Photoshop, start Photoshop again, open the same panorama DNG again and denoise again, and it's correct:

Now open another panorama and denoise -> wrong colors.
Restart Photoshop, denoise other panorama again -> correct.
And so on.

[johnrellis]

I just verified that Camera Raw Denoise,  like LR Classic Denoise, ignores the setting Performance > Use Graphics Processor. Adobe inexplicably refuses to provide a reliable method to disable all use of the graphics processor, wasting countless hours of users troubleshooting issues.

The easiest way to identify authoritatively whether your issue is related to the GPU is to start Windows in Safe Mode With Networking:

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-startup-settings-1af6ec8c-4d4a-4b23-adb7-e76eef0...

If you don't experience the symptoms, then it's definitely related to the GPU.

[FSt0p]

This is an old thread, things have already changed. The current version of Lightroom can denoise linear DNG files, so you can safely assume that the future non-destructive version will be able to do that as well.

By @JohanElzenga

From where did you get that?

Here is Adobe article, which clearly states the opposite.

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/enhance-details.html

• Denoise can run only on Bayer and X-Trans RAW images.

[JohanElzenga]

That link is outdated (last updated Oct 2024), just like this thread is outdated. Lightroom Classic 14.2 can denoise linear DNG files as well, period. Why don't you just try it?

[johnrellis]

Support for Denoise on linear DNGs was added to LR 14.0:

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/whats-new/2025.html#denoise

[FSt0p]

Because I simply can't.

I'm not on LrC 14.x due to system requirements.

This looks quite strange - LrC and ACR articles was both last updated on October 2024, the same time when LrC 14 was released, but LrC article does not state support for linear DNG, while ACR article does, and in fact looks like it's supported.

Seems like Adobe needs to update their documentation.