P: Improved Fuji X-Trans Support?

[pinkypunk35]

Is Fuji X-Trans support being worked on?I appreciate that the support is better now than it was, but the reality is that Lightroom is still a long way behind other RAW developers, all of which are less well funded and with smaller teams working on the software.Lightroom has been the leader in RAW processing an image cataloging as far back as I can recall; but with the Fuji X-Trans files many people I know are leaving Adobe Lightroom for one of the many other developers, all of which are producing far better results than Adobe Lightroom.Ones I have personally tested are as follows: Iridient DeveloperPhoto NinjaLightZoneCapture OneApertureSilkyPixRaw TherapeeIridient is very good, and this is a piece of software made by a single man.My question is, if he can get it right, why can't Adobe? They have been leaders in innovation for many years but it seems in some areas now they are falling behind - I have never seen so many people leave a major developer for smaller independent ones, but to Fuji users (both enthusiasts and professionals) it's a pretty simple decision when you compare results.So all I'd like to know is if my patience sticking with Lightroom is justified, and whether a solution is being worked on - or will always be worked on. Or is it a case that the users wanting such a change are not enough to support such work.

[john beardsworth]

the in-camera profile will not automatically apply.  I wish it did.  You can however, change file simulation profiles at any time in LR

To do it semi-automatically, matching the FS you set in the camera, see my X-LR plugin.

[robertoo71705141]

I stop waiting for Adobe to improved in this matter after I change to Capture One 11. 

[robertoo71705141]

Yes please!

[Cicuryn]

Yes, hire that guy, guve him fortune.

[FeedbackCommunityMember]

And keep the Capture One software too!

[Samoreen]

Howard,

Importing an image in LR, even if you apply a preset during import, doesn't affect the RAW file in any way. Your corrections (+ the default corrections) are stored in the catalog and optionally in the XMP file. When you use the Edit in... command or the Export command, the current corrections are applied to the exported JPEG or TIFF transmitted to the external program. The Edit in... command cannot directly send a RAW file to an external program.

In order to have X-Transformer be the first player in the demosaicing process, we have to send it the RAW file directly, either by using the plugin provided with the product or by using the script I mentioned above. Upon return, X-Transformer will produce a DNG beside the original RAW file. You'll be able to further apply corrections to this DNG file as if it were an original RAW.

Also, you can  handle your RAF files in X-Transformer directly , before importing them in Lightroom. Just, you'll import the DNG files produced by X-Transformer instead of the RAF files.

So, in any case, the basic processing can be done in X-Transformer in order to avoid the problems generated by LR on the images produced by an X-Trans processor and then use the LR tools to further process the DNG file.

This is the best solution I have found to handle this long lasting issue in LR. C1 gives good result but not as good as those produced by X-Transformer, especially when the well known artifacts that LR is generating when processing X-Trans RAF files have more chances to appear.

[FeedbackCommunityMember]

No, never - like I said, I've been thinking about it purchasing it, but having to run both pieces of software is not an happy prospect . I can't trash the LR catalog as it's fully keyworded and searchable so I've just been waiting in disbelief. One can't help but feel like the moment they take the plunge, this will finally be addressed.  At this point, it's just been too long though, so one more update, perhaps, and then I'll just have to prep the system to run Capture One as well.  I'm sure it will be excellent. I have no about what you're saying there.

[Mike Katz]

Hi Tanja
From what I see on the Capture One forums, your Canon files will also process far better in Capture One. Have you tried them?

[FeedbackCommunityMember]

Yeah, this seems like it makes the most sense.  I've had the Capture 1 shop window open in my browser all month, but really don't want another huge piece of software on my system. I have a 13 year career cataloged entirely in Lightroom and can still use it for my Canon shoots (studio work), so I am really hoping for a proper solution from Adobe as I'd probably have to hang on to both pieces of software right now and that's a a lot.

[Mike Katz]

Four months down the line,  don't have any Adobe products on my computer, and Capture One is phenomenal for me. It gives me all the processing I need, and the workflow with Sessions is a dream.

The processing tools are very powerful once you learn the product. I can honestly say there's not one feature I miss in Lightroom. And, the new luma etc. masks are already in Capture One.

It's a once-off investment as opposed to a license, although I could move onto a license basis as well. I really don't think cost is an issue, even if you purchase it outright it's way less expensive than a good lens.

Really, instead of having to fiddle faddle and go through multiple hoops to get reasonable quality, just try Capture One and see if it works for you.

Mike

[Samoreen]

Howard,

The product comes with a plugin allowing you to send the RAF file directly to X-Transformer, bypassing the Edit in... procedure.

Before this plugin was available, I used a LUA script doing (almost) the same :

    local LrApplication = import 'LrApplication'
    local LrTasks = import 'LrTasks'
    local catalog = LrApplication.activeCatalog()
    local LrShell = import 'LrShell'

    local function openWithExternalProgram()
       local programPath = "C:\\Program Files\\Iridient Digital\\Iridient X-Transformer\\Iridient X-Transformer.exe"
       local photo = catalog:getTargetPhoto()
       if photo ~= nil then
          local photoPath = photo:getRawMetadata('path')
          LrShell.openFilesInApp({photoPath}, programPath)
       end
    end

    LrTasks.startAsyncTask(openWithExternalProgram, "openWithExternalProgram")

Copy this text in a file named "Edit in IXT.lua", store that file in  C:\Users\<user>\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\Lightroom\Scripts, relaunch LR and you should have a Script menu beside the Help menu. Launching the script should load the selected RAF file in X-Transformer directly.

You can use this script for other external programs to which you'd like to send the currently selected file directly. Just edit the program path.

[sheilsoft]

Just out of interest, how do you integrate x-transformer without LR applying its own rendering?

[Samoreen]

Tanja,
I'd rather recommend Iridient X-Transformer (for Windows) which gives  even better results than C1 on X-Trans RAW files and integrates well with LR. A cheaper solution than C1. For the Mac, there's the full Iridient Developer.

[t.linn]

Go C1, Tanja. Their X-Trans support was good in v9 and is even better in v10. The limitations present in v9 are gone. Plus you can purchase a perpetual license that will make it less expensive in the long run then relying on Adobe's rental scheme.

[3dit0r1]

My 7-days isn't up, so I only have your word for it, as there was no mention anywhere when I finished the subscription that I would be placed on a 7-day trial. The only reference at all I could find to what happens when a CC subscription ends, re: Lightroom, was an old Adobe blog post from around 2013 which said something along the lines that the catalogue would remain active, but the develop module wouldn't. Nothing about a trial version was mentioned. At present, as an end user, I've cancelled a subscription and have been placed on a 7-day countdown to... what? Usually trial versions expire after the countdown, so I assumed I would lose all access (again, there's nothing in the email I was sent after cancelling, or during the sign-in process giving me 7-days on LR which detailed any of this). So, I'm not yet sure 'dishonest' doesn't apply.

However, let's be charitable, let's say you're right (it's Sunday evening, I'm relaxing after a nice walk, and I really can't be bothered to argue about something I don't honestly care about, because it's not the reason I cancelled my sub, it's something which annoyed me after the fact). So, let's say you're right and after the trial LR remains partly functional and allows me catalogue access after the 7-days. Let's say it's just incompetence, as you say. Fantastic, we've gone from dishonest to just confusing and incompetent. Well that's about the level of where X-Trans support has started and ended for me since getting a Fuji camera three years ago - from utterly rubbish to merely mediocre. Not exactly glowing praise for a product I'm paying good money for every month.

I now feel I've personally given Adobe more than enough time, far more than is reasonable, to finally solve the detail issue and others, and they're still outstanding. I disagree this is cyclical - C1 and others have always handled X-Trans files better, Adobe has never been ahead in any of the tests I've carried out over the last three years of Fuji ownership. I've persevered with LR as I'm heavily invested skills and workflow-wise, and money-wise (plugins, etc.) in the hope, no, expectation, that Adobe would provide a real fix. Well, three years is enough.

[john beardsworth]

BTW If you are in the same situation as that poster, I think you'd be on firmer ground complaining about competence rather than dishonesty!

[john beardsworth]

That refers to getting access to photos that are only on Adobe's mobile servers and haven't synced down, as I said. Assuming your 7 days is over, try opening your catalogue and you should find it will open and only has the limitations I mentioned.

[john beardsworth]

Ever heard the expression echo chamber? Sorry for putting a contrary view.

[pinkypunk35]

Truth is for most photographers, image quality rules all and for that crucial variable Adobe sucks balls compared to nearly every other raw convertor, and let's be honest, it's pretty inexcusable and just another example of distain Adobe have for their customers.

[Mike Katz]

John, I said clearly "for me". I'm not telling everyone to leave Lightroom.

I don't use reference view, guided upright, or mobile. I never used  the catalog in Lightroom. In Capture One I use sessions, and that works much better for me.

There are other tools like the masking and layers, colour editor, that work better for me in Capture One. YMMV.

And I didn't just looking around at other software because I was bored. I was frustrated! Image quality is my primary interest, and FOR ME, how I shoot, what I shoot, and how I process, Capture One is streaks ahead of Lightroom.

Finally, if Adobe addresses the issues that I am experiencing, I would probably come back. My issue that would remain is now the licensing. Having experienced what I have, I would now prefer to not license, so as to retain my older edits, and it's not an option with Adobe.

[john beardsworth]

Overtaken? Maybe with the default, but more than that, it's only subjective. C1 is definitely quicker with XTrans files though, and outside that area its tethering and its focus mask are superior, but its cataloguing features are primitive, and its UI overcrowded and fiddly. I've owned it for 10 years too.

No real updates? Apart from Reference View, Guided Upright, Dehaze, more local adjustments, the whole Mobile area... "what have the Romans ever done for us?"

[Mike Katz]

John

1) Image quality issues in X-trans is STILL an open ticket that Adobe says it is working on. Phase One has caught up and now overtaken Adobe, to the extent that I have to leave the Adobe platform.

2) Capture One are far slower than Adobe to support cameras, I've made that point elsewhere in Lightroom forums. So yes it took them time to support compressed format, and to support some tools in their system for X-trans. But now, they HAVE done so, and the results are, to my eye and many others, far superior.

3) I really don't want to move off Adobe, I'll lose the ability to work with my edits to existing photos for the last however many years Lightroom has existed. Do you think I'm happy with that? I don't want to move, but Adobe is really not making an effort to keep me. No real updates, older and worse processing of RAW files, painfully slow (and I've had to switch off GPU processing because of another bug). Capture One just works right now, for me!

[john beardsworth]

My complaint was that it took almost a year for C1 to support the raw file compressed format at all, Mike-Photo.... During the 3 years of this thread, Adobe has greatly improved handling of Fuji raw files but you can never please everyone.

[john beardsworth]

Well, Mark, it's a priority for anyone who seriously uses a program if it can't import the files, and it was one of a series of gaps in C1's claims of XTrans support which were fixed in 10.1 and yet marketed as "Improved X-Trans Processing". C1 has finally taken a step forward again, as Adobe did before, but the point is these things go in turns.

I am very surprised that I haven't yet arrived at Detail panel settings that can be be my  starting point for all  XT2 images. I always feel I can match whatever comes out of XTransformer or C1, if I put anything through them, but I do seem to have to review each set of pictures more carefully in LR than seems reasonable, tweaking the Detail panel settings dependent on content. One thing I do avoid is the Pete Bridgwood recipe which you  may have encountered - I have no view about whether his Detail +100 worked with earlier cameras, but I don't think it's relevant with the newer 24mp. I'd also question whether people review the final print.

[Mike Katz]

LOL. The image quality issue with Xtrans was acknowledged as an issue a long time ago, and someone is complaining that Capture One took a year? This thread is three years old!!!

I'm cancelling too, for the exact image quality reasons mentioned above. Love Capture One and I've been with Lightroom from the beginning.

Adobe is the largest, wealthiest, and highest earning RAW software company by far, and they haven't done anything for three years?? There are so many new start-up companies that outperform Lightroom with Xtrans files, it's just downright embarrassing at this stage, not to mention disrespectful to Fuji shooters. It's unfortunately time to say goodbye, at least until they fix this mess.