Problem saving metadata to source file

Participant ,
Aug 03, 2022 Aug 03, 2022

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I have LR 11.4.1, On a windows 10 PC I am new to LR, it my primary need is to face tag my massive photo collection, several thousand, in many many folders. I have successfully managed to face tag and folder of sample images as a practice. But when I do select all, Metadata, save to file. Although the LR 'bar' moves along, intimating it's doing something, the file TAG fields do not contain any peoples names. I have tried the export option, but this groups all the image files together, with no regard for the original folder hirechy. But the metadata is change using this method so as LR has proved it can do this with the export function, why would it not be able to do it with Metadata save to file function ???

 

as a last resort I have installed. a plugin, which is designed to replicate the folder hierarchy on an export, but can't work out how to use it yet.

 

hopefully there is a way to do what I need without this plugin

 

thanks

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LEGEND ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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"the file TAG fields do not contain any peoples names"

 

Metadata > Save Metadata To File will save the names assigned to faces to various photo metadata fields in the photo. Please describe in detail which program or service you're using to examine the saved metadata and which fields you're looking at, along with the type of file (JPEG, raw, etc.), 

 

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Participant ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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Ok, when I found that metadata save to file, didn't do what I wanted, I looked at the file in windows explorer, only viewed the TAG field, as this is where names are typically stored, multiple names having commas between them. So then I tried the export option, unfortunately it doesn't save the folder hierarchy, but exported the photos anyway, every one had the peoples n,aes in the TAG field, e.g. Christina,chris,Emma,Julie......so it did what I wanted the metadata save to file option didn't do, but as the files were simply grouped together, this wasn't acceptable, if it was only a matter of a few folders, I could manage doing them individually, but with hundreds of folders, this isn't practical.

 

this is why I searched and found the plug-in which using the publish option, should do what I want, havnt quite worked out why the changes to publish manager won't save, but that's another story......so I wonder which fields the names are saved in, in the source files ?

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Participant ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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Doesn't seem a way to edit a post, just checked on my PC using windows explorer, it stores the peoples names in TAG ( using export ) in Exif Tool GUI it shows under XPKeywords, which doesn't have any of the other people I tagged for the photo, so I've no idea where they are saved.....thanks

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LEGEND ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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Neither Windows File Explorer nor Mac Finder are reliable methods to interrogate metadata.  Adobe apps (LR, Photoshop, or Bridge) are pretty good (not perfect), while Exiftool (and things built on it) is the most authoritative.


LR stores the keywords corresponding to face names in these metadata fields (by both Save Metadata To File and Export):

[XMP]           Subject                         : Evyn, Jasper, Karyn
[IPTC]          Keywords                        : Evyn, Jasper, Karyn
[XMP]           Weighted Flat Subject           : Karyn, Jasper, Evyn
[XMP]           Hierarchical Subject            : Evyn, Jasper, Karyn

 The first two are industry-standard, the second two are Adobe-specific.

 

LR also stores the names assigned to faces in this industry-standard field:

[XMP]           Region Name                     : Karyn, Jasper, Evyn

 

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Participant ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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Hello, When I export with ALL metadata selected the Peoples names go into the TAG field in windows explorer, and in EXIF Tool in the KEYWORDS Tag........Which is where I want the peoples names to be, so when i send the images to friends, they can esily search by peoples names, in windows explorer using the TAG search.

 

so if it saves the Metadata this way with export , i wonder why its not the same with Metadata save to file ???

 

ExifToolGUI - PRH_0016-2.jpg 2022-08-04 21.14.33.jpgUntitled Export 2022-08-04 21.20.58.jpg

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LEGEND ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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As mentioned above, Metadata > Save Metadata To File saves keywords into the same metadata fields that Export does. You screenshots appear to show the exported files, not the original files after doing Save Metadata To File.  Is the original file in the LR catalog a JPEG or a raw file?

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Participant ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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They are all jpg that's what I don't understand, using save to file, putts the people names into something called Keywords and is not visible in windows properties details, whereas export does....don't understand. Would be a lot easier for me to if I could save the metadata to file in the same way export does 

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LEGEND ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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"Would be a lot easier for me to if I could save the metadata to file in the same way export does"

 

It does.  Select a problem photo with keywords, do Metadata > Save Metadata To File, and attach it and the exported version to your reply here.

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Participant ,
Aug 04, 2022 Aug 04, 2022

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Ok sounds good, will do,that tomorrow, time for  💤💤 now

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Participant ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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This photo had no keywords, i did face tag and added names for the three people, then did mjetadata save file, but cant see any people info in the image. Is this what you meant ?TEST.jpg03-.jpg02-.jpg01-Lightroom Catalog - Adobe Photoshop Lightroom Clas.jpg

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Participant ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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Hello, I have solved the problem. I was having problems displaying the picture image as a thumbnail, I was getting just an icon image. This has only started happening recently, possible since I installed Lightroom. However the icons do flash for a split second with the thumbnail image then go blank. I researched this phenomena, and was suggested to look in her registry under Jpg, to check I was authorised, when I opened it I saw the word Sage in there. Then I remembered installing sage to be able to see psd thumbnail images, which I don't think ever worked. Possibly sage and Lightroom have clashed 🤷🏻‍:female_sign: and I have now uninstalled sage, the thumbnails are back to normal, and metadata save to file WORKS.....so that's amazing news, don't really need to go through the export with the plug in now, unless I need extra features that publish has. All I need to do now is find the setting that protects the date picture taken stamp on the file, as don't want that overwritten.

thanks so so much for all the help

injave learnt something today, maybe one day it'll help someone else

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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Just as a note, there is also a Microsoft:Keywords namespace which can, as you guess, contain keywords. Other apps can read and write to these fields, there is a bug in Bridge and Photoshop that can cause problems when moving files back and forth so always double-check your metadata before making final exports.

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Participant ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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I feel like bashing my head against a wall.....it worked perfectly, just did a folder of photos and as before nothing 😱 one think I've noticed, I've gone back to my test picture, is that when I import it, it creates a copy of the image in my Boot drive, in pictures, in. Folder, dated by year. Just don't understand why it worked just a few hours ago....not it doesn't, as matter of interest, will Lightroom import tiff files ?

thanks, just don't know what to do now, will go to bed and try again tomorrow 🙏

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Participant ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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Wish it was possible to edit posts, just did a metadata save to file, and the one in my boot drive C has the people info in metadata, but not the file I imported from....😱

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Participant ,
Aug 05, 2022 Aug 05, 2022

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Thanks that's a good point, it doesn't look like Lightroom checks if the metadata is written or not, because currently it's not working, if that happened during a big job, it may not get detected, think Lightroom should have an option to verify metadata is written IMO 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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Lightroom Classic functions designed it is a parametric editor, when you are working with Lightroom it is reading and writing to the Catalog file. The article at the link below explains basic info how that functions. As far as Lightroom is concerned the info is in the Catalog.

Lightroom Classic is an alternative to Adobe's applications for managing images including raw image files Bridge and Camera Raw which are file browsers and store info in the file header or to xmp. Using the options to Save metadata to the file in Lightroom Classic is necessary to share info with those applications since they are unable to read directly from the Catalog file.

https://www.lightroomqueen.com/what-is-a-lightroom-catalog/

Writing info to the Catalog is a primary function while saving metadata is a second function. That may happen in idle time, or complete the next time you boot the application.

Just some thoughts for you to be aware off.

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.6.8,; LrC 11.4.1, Lr 5.4.1, Ps 23.3.2-ACR 14.4,; Camera OM-D E-M1.

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Participant ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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Thanks was very interesting, but still need to solve my problem, will turn pc on in a short while and try again 🤞

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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Some additional information.

https://www.lightroomqueen.com/lightroom-catalogs-top-10-misunderstandings/

 

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.6.8,; LrC 11.4.1, Lr 5.4.1, Ps 23.3.2-ACR 14.4,; Camera OM-D E-M1.

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Participant ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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So basically, metadata save to file, is rather ambiguous, as the assumption, the one I made anyway, was that it writes it to the file, so other programs e.g. windows explorer can view the people tags etc.

I am virtually certain this happened when I did the MD save to file yesterday, but I could be wrong. So if it doesn't t, then export using the plug in is my only real option, at least I know that works, although I must have the folder view in Lightroom fully expanded to get the correct original hierarchy. Don't know why adobe doesn't simply write MD to the source file, simple, and export keeping original folder hierarchy, seems an obvious requirement IMO......thanks for the links.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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The only applications that can read all the metadata you write to the file, which includes your edits, are Bridge / Camera Raw. Other applications can read some metatadata but not all.

Only Lightroom can open or read from the Catalog File file which is protected by a (lock file) which is in place when it is open in LrC.

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.6.8,; LrC 11.4.1, Lr 5.4.1, Ps 23.3.2-ACR 14.4,; Camera OM-D E-M1.

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Participant ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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Thanks, so is there a way outside of Lightroom to convert the XMP data in the file into Exif ? And save to the same file ?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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In your Catalog preferences you have "Automatically write metadata to xmp " selected that would achieve the same thing, the metadata tab on the menu bar option "Save metadata to the file achieves.

LrC while will not automatically read metadata from the file you should receive a prompt that there is a mismatch and from there you can select to read the metadata from the file or overwrite the info in the file with the info from the Catalog. Choose wisely if you select to update the info in the Catalog you may loose some of your LrC work.

 

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.6.8,; LrC 11.4.1, Lr 5.4.1, Ps 23.3.2-ACR 14.4,; Camera OM-D E-M1.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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More info,

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/metadata-basics-actions.html

 

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.6.8,; LrC 11.4.1, Lr 5.4.1, Ps 23.3.2-ACR 14.4,; Camera OM-D E-M1.

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Participant ,
Aug 06, 2022 Aug 06, 2022

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Thanks, looks like it's the export function with the folder hierarchy mainyed option for me......such a pity adobe didn't have the metadata to file as in export....

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