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Lightroom v7.3 Sharpening Amount Default Setting

Explorer ,
Apr 06, 2018

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Can anyone throw some light on as to why the amount default setting has been changed from 25 to 40 in Lr v7.3 ?

I would be very interested in why the Lightroom dev team felt this was needed - has there been some change to the sharpening algorithms?

Adobe Community Professional
Correct answer by Ian Lyons | Adobe Community Professional

There has been no change to the sharpening algorithms.

The sharpening amount increase (from 25 to 40), in conjunction with the new Adobe Color default profile, are part of an effort by Adobe to offer a more pleasing “out-of-the-box” rendering for Lr Classic, Lr CC, & ACR.

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Lightroom v7.3 Sharpening Amount Default Setting

Explorer ,
Apr 06, 2018

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Can anyone throw some light on as to why the amount default setting has been changed from 25 to 40 in Lr v7.3 ?

I would be very interested in why the Lightroom dev team felt this was needed - has there been some change to the sharpening algorithms?

Adobe Community Professional
Correct answer by Ian Lyons | Adobe Community Professional

There has been no change to the sharpening algorithms.

The sharpening amount increase (from 25 to 40), in conjunction with the new Adobe Color default profile, are part of an effort by Adobe to offer a more pleasing “out-of-the-box” rendering for Lr Classic, Lr CC, & ACR.

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Apr 06, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Apr 06, 2018

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There has been no change to the sharpening algorithms.

The sharpening amount increase (from 25 to 40), in conjunction with the new Adobe Color default profile, are part of an effort by Adobe to offer a more pleasing “out-of-the-box” rendering for Lr Classic, Lr CC, & ACR.

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Apr 06, 2018 2
Explorer ,
Apr 06, 2018

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Thanks Ian.

Let me get a confirmation from you on something else if I may.  At a base level, they have not changed the unique demosaicing algorithm, just the default 'auto applied' process settings/profile/CLUT, neither have they changed the MelissaRGB GUI.

Or have they?

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Apr 06, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Apr 06, 2018

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At the 'base' level nothing has changed. The demosaicing algorithm is unchanged, MelissRGB is still the default colour space within the UI, and the Adobe Standard profile (DCP) for each supported camera is also unchanged. Likewise, the Camera Matching profiles are unchanged. All of the new Adobe Raw and Creative profiles are built on top of Adobe Standard (i.e. Adobe Standard remains the base profile for all supported cameras). As such, these XMP based profiles apply settings under-the-hood. I can't comment on the specifics of where LUTs are/ are not used.

More info on how new profiles can be built is available in the new SDK at http://www.adobe.com/go/profile-sdk

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Apr 06, 2018 4
Explorer ,
Apr 06, 2018

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Thank you for that info Ian - much appreciated, and things are as I thought.

From a personal PoV I have zero interest in the huge swathe of colour profiles that adorn Lr v7.3 - I'm too much of a Photoshop junkie to be bothered with them in Lr.

The things I wish the Lr dev team would do are:

1. Give us a totally neutral preset (a la Raw Therapee et al).  That would save the donkey work.

2. Update and overhaul the demoz algorithm, or give us the ability to select from a choice of algorithms.

3. Expand the input sharpening options to include a 4 point threshold USM, and full blown RL Deconvolution sharpening.

In other words, package Raw Therapee into the DAM and Print side of Lr - wow, that would be epic!

Thanks for your time Ian

Best Regards

Andy

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Apr 06, 2018 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 16, 2018

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Wildlife_in_Pixels  wrote

From a personal PoV I have zero interest in the huge swathe of colour profiles that adorn Lr v7.3 - I'm too much of a Photoshop junkie to be bothered with them in Lr.

You can hide the unwanted Profiles and Presets (except Classic Presets) using Camera RAW.

The Classic Presets can be removed with a little more work

Read through this thread for ideas. Re: How do I remove or hide default lightroom presets?

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Apr 16, 2018 0
Explorer ,
Apr 18, 2018

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Thanks for that Bob.

What I really don't understand though, is why Adobe have added 'bells and whistles' but not made fundamental improvements to the basic foundation of Lightroom/ACR.

It's a raw file demosaicer and processor, and as such the two cornerstones are demosaicing and input sharpening. Everything else, including the new profiles, is/are meaningless if the foundations are shaky.

And shaky they are.

How old is the demosaicing algorithm, and why are we still limited to a choice of one algorithm?

Why are we still limited to a single iteration deconvolution sharpening method, or unsharp masking with no distribution threshold?

And why are we still not given a 32bit float conversion engine?

Hell, we can RL decon sharpening, a 32bit float conversion engine, and a 4 point fully adjustable USM distribution threshold - with separate fully adjustable halo suppression - in a FREE raw converter!

Adobe remind me of IBM - 'we're too big in the market to fail'.

RT, Iridient and C1 are far superior at raw conversion than Lr/ACR.  Yes, Lr is still king when it comes to DAM, Soft Proof and Print, but the raw conversion HAS TO come first.

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Apr 18, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2018

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I want Lr to apply no sharpening at all at RAW conversion stage - infinitely prefer Ps for this task with the camera I am using now.

Can someone please remind me how to convert all images to zero sharpening after import, and how to set default sharpening

to zero so that none is applied on import.

Thanks beforehand.

Ian

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May 22, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 22, 2018

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Just set one of your images the way you want it to be when it is first imported. This would include the sharpening settings. Then, set new camera defaults. On a Windows computer, if you hold down the alt key the reset button in the develop module will change to "Set Default". Equivalent on the Mac will do the same thing.

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May 22, 2018 1
Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2018

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Thanks Jim.

So, when I do that, any import I do will have zero sharpening, but I would have to manually convert images already imported to zero sharpening myself.  Correct?

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May 22, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 22, 2018

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After you have created the new default settings then all you would have to do is click the reset button to reset any image that you wanted to start over on. But that would reset everything back to the default. What you might want to do is highlight a bunch of images and just copy the sharpening settings. You know, copy the sharpening settings from one image that has been set the way you want them and then paste just the sharpening settings to as many other images as you wish.

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May 22, 2018 2
New Here ,
May 22, 2018

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Ian,

So from the various messages above and bringing it all together.

1. You can create an import preset that ensures you have zero sharpening at the time you import.

2. You can select any number of images and apply zero sharpening to them using Develop copy and paste.

2. You can set your default reset to have zero sharpening.

I never apply global sharpening, preferring to select parts of the image and apply sharpening as required.

Michael

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May 22, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 22, 2018

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All of your points are correct. I have created presets for each of my lenses which seem to optimize the sharpening to my taste. I don't set the sharpening to 0 on import, but that is my personal preference. Sometimes I think we get a little obsessed with sharpening. At least I feel that I did initially. I seemed to expect even more than what my camera could produce or my monitor could display. After a while I decided it wasn't worth all the worry. I'm not a professional, and those who look at my work never seem to worry about whether or not the image is perfectly sharp. All they want to know is who are the people in the picture. If they can see who they are and recognize them, that's all that matters. Yeah, bad attitude. But it sure makes life a lot simpler.

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May 22, 2018 0
New Here ,
May 22, 2018

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Jim,

Yes, sharpening is a very personal thing and some can get quite uptight and opinionated about it.

I tend to treat my landscape images such that they should be viewed from an appropriate distance as a single view and apply two basic rules to the image:

1. foreground sharper than background

2. light areas sharper than shadows.

This requires that I use grad filters, radial filters and brushes to select areas suitable for sharpening or softening.

I can then address the actual subject / focal point

Portraits too come in for heated discussion sometimes. I have seen beautiful portraits where the faces are not quite sharp and have an ethereal quality about them.

Yes, sharpening, a very personal thing indeed.

Mcihael

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May 22, 2018 0
New Here ,
Apr 16, 2018

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I have been going nuts tonight trying to figure out behind the scenes changes to sharpening too (if any). I believe after finding some of my presets which I made a year or so back have been looking very 'blurred' when applied. I cannot say for certain but personally its never jumped out as an issue in past versions of LR but...

I think when using the before/after key, LR is no longer going from your current edited image to the image with NO adjustments. It seems to now toggle between your current edit and the new default settings, for sharpening this is now for example, going from MY sharpening mask and amounts  (amount 50, mask 80) to (amount 40, mask 0 new default). So you can't really compare the sharpening from the raw images to the edit now. This is so off putting as typically for my event work I have to shoot wide open in dark areas so my background which I know is OOF is being sharpened a LOT by the new defaults and so when I'm comparing the 2, it now looks like the whole image is getting too soft.

This has become very evident as work I do 2-3 times a month in the same rooms with the same light and the same presets is now looking very different, I typically have higher mask values for this work as its dark and I don't want sharpening applying to all the noise and any background objects, just my subjects. And its making it appear as if my files are now being blurred (which is not, just sharpening is much more selective).

Is this something anyone else has noticed? I could be completely mistaken but Ive used LR for a few years and only just seen this happen after going onto LR v7...

Thanks,

Tom

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Apr 16, 2018 0
Explorer ,
Apr 18, 2018

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Hi Tom

If you take the image profile back to Adobe Standard, do they still look blurred with your original sharpening preset?

I only ask, because of what Ian said in his reply to me - +40 makes Adobe Color look more pleasing out of the box.

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Apr 18, 2018 0
New Here ,
Apr 21, 2018

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Its definitely an out of the box setting that is giving the false impression of what the raw file looks like. So yes having too much sharpening on areas that shouldnt have had any initial makes them look too soft when A/B-ing the 2 versions. So I guess I just have to adapt my work flow slightly, I just have to turn the sharpening on/off now to see the effect instead of using the old method of the before/after key command. I checked out your website and you have some awesome stuff there! I may invest in your sharpening tutorial package!

All the best, Tom

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Apr 21, 2018 1
LEGEND ,
Apr 21, 2018

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All you have to do is have an import preset that sets the sharpening to 25 or set the "Adobe Default" to 25 for your camera and you will have the same behavior as before. 

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Apr 21, 2018 1
Explorer ,
Apr 22, 2018

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Thanks Tom

If you do 'pull the pin' on the 11 hours of sharpening training, I can promise you it'll be worth it!

All the best.

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Apr 22, 2018 0