Photoshop CS4 is a disaster

[_ProArtist_]

I'm am just at a loss of words.

What a mess. It could not be any slower. What were you thinking Adobe?

You ripped apart the code just to add GPU support for what? To provide worse performance?

Make sure you DL the demo first... CS4 is a disaster.

The latest hardware cant even run it smoothly... Dont tell me its graphic drivers.

[_Tenchi_]

Update:

n.b.
dual quad core
4gb ram
Nvidia Quadro 1700
xp
Latest DirectX and Drivers
Tried turning off McAfee (no effect)

Option 1 - OpenGL off: quick brush strokes, pixelated at levels of zoom other than 100%, 50%... Rotate disabled.

Option 2 - OpenGL on: slow slow slow strokes, crisp lines at all levels of magnification, Rotate enabled.

What am I going to do?! I'm sticking with option 2 because I need te crisp and sharpness, but I'm getting sooo frustrated with the lag. Adobe help!!!

[_iVan_B__]

I would make sure it's not the software incompatibility issue, as it seems to be in most cases. If you can create an image of your hard drive first so you can later go back to where you were if need be, do that first.

Then reinstall only Windows, service packs and the latest drivers and NOTHING ELSE (not even antivirus). Then install Photoshop and if it runs, it's software. Then you can start loading one program at the time (biggest suspects first) and test Photoshop in between 'till it starts being slow again. That way you'll know the culprit.

And just to be sure it's not more than one thing, uninstall the offending software and continue installing everything 'till you have everything tested.

The reason I'm suggesting this is because that's how I solved my own issue. Mind you, I assumed this would apply to most people here, so I went an extra mile (or ten), but in the end I did find out that (in my case) it was Kaspersky that did Photoshop in. Got a new AV (AVG, to be precise),and things are snappy.

In your case it may be different software that is causing the issue. Adobe even states this in one of the threads here (forgot where). It would appear that on different platforms, different softwares cause this very same issue. But you have to try to find out what it is on your own system.

Ultimately, if you load OS, latest service packs (SP3 for XP or SP1 for Vista - necessary for installation) and the latest drivers, once the Photoshop is installed you'll know if it's hardware or software.

I wouldn't expect Adobe to go an extra mile to tell us what the issue is, as there are as many hardware/software configurations out there as there are people with computers; it would be impossible for them to test it all.

Try it, you might be surprised. I sure was.

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

BSOD is generally an HW issue. If you are not getting those, your HW is probably not the cause. The caveat here is the ram. It may be problematic yet not cause a BSOD. So run a ram test first.(Assuming a problem on a fresh install.)

Also, as I mentioned before and this is especially true for Vista, what oder you use to install software can affect it's startup time, for openers.

[BobLevine]

> BSOD is generally an HW issue.

A flakey driver can easily cause a BSOD.

Bob

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

The HW has to crash to generate a BSOD. Yes, you can force the crash through software manipulation. That's how HW is tested in certain circumstances. Push it till it crashes, then look at the data.

AFAIK, anyway!:D

[Rob_Keijzer]

A nice way to test RAM is a Windiag bootable media. You can download an image and burn it.

It boots the pc directly into the test. No need for a "real" OS.

Let it run overnight to see if errors accumulate. No errors? must be fine then.

http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

Rob

[Guest]

>> BSOD is generally an HW issue.

hmm... i dunno about using hte word "generally" there either. "often", "sometimes", "50/50"... but like bob says, software CAN cause bsods quite often.

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

It's the HW that crashes, not the software. The SW brings on the crash, but as you both have experienced, the same SW crashes one computer but not another.

Lots of interactions yada yada yada, but in the end, the HW simply gives up.

Correlation is not equal to causation.

[Guest]

>It's the HW that crashes, not the software.

yea, but the poster was speaking specifically about the bsod errors. a bsod reports an unrecoverable error that the operating system encountered. it has nothing to do with hardware, per se. it MAY be related to a hardware fault, but it doesn't have to be.

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

Can an os have an unrecoverable error that causes no problems at all?

Actually a reasonable question, as I often encounter statements that indicate something serious happened, but the computer goes merrily along.

Or does it?

Then there are the messages that simply close the app, but not the os. The os does try to keep a distance from those events, and when we have dueling software, well, I would concede your point.

[Guest]

>Can an os have an unrecoverable error that causes no problems at all?

it depends on what caused it. ;)

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

Any snow there, dave?

We are expecting really cold (for Portland) days ahead. Lows in the teens. And snow.

[Guest]

yup. and cold as a...

[Guest]

You mean "cold es" Brew! ;)

[_Sweetc_]

bump

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

Here's some feedback on the i7 system with respect to video cards and the brush performance.

I'm running it on Vista 64 Ultimate with no other apps.

First of all, Brushes. On my home machine, an AMD single core with XP pro 32 bit, I have two problems. One is the truncated circle, the other is the bad gray value when cloning in an 18% gray range. It would switch automatically from a black circle on white, a white circle on black, and an unfortunate, fixed gray on gray.

Different matter on the i7 machine. No truncation, but there is only a black circle no matter what the background color is, until I hit caps lock, then hit it again. The circle now changed to white, no matter where it is placed, but tries to shift to another color when the cursor is moved. Exit PS and open it up again and the brush reverts to the original condition. Not very promising!

As to the video cards, I found a rather startling result, given the wide spread nature of performance among video cards/drivers. I have none.

I have my own card on hand, an nVidia 7300. At the lab, we have 7200 and 7100 versions laying around. I have the latest driver installed for the 7 series. What was starling is that it didn't matter which card is installed, the system showed none of the problems discussed throughout this forum. That is, I could substitute any of them and if there are subtle differences, the drivers reload for that particular card (or corrected for the card) and I see no change in anything, including the a fore mentioned brush problem. IOW, the system is completely stable with respect to swapping 7 series cards, and if the brush problem is video related at all, it follows the card as well.

This is true also when trying out different platforms/cpu combinations. All I need to do is swap the HD among them, assure that BIOS is set at default (and in one case, set to a significant overclock) and run.

So, there you have it. So far. If I absolutely had to have CS4, I would invest in the Intel board and the 2.66GHz processor. No need to spend for the faster ones, overclock is simple and pretty stable (up to a point!) But really, I didn't even know that one of the boards was over clocked until I did a BIOS check before closing out the test.

[_ProArtist_]

Lawrence... Since you have no performance problems, could you try going to a high resolution to see how PS performs. My current theory is that screen resolution is effecting performance drastically.

What resolution do you normally run CS4 in?

[_Firebomb_]

Hi guys.

I have been reading allot of post's around these forums with people having problems with Photoshop CS4 running slow. I had the same problem hence why I have been here reading. Lagging brushes, zooming, scrolling, flickering images etc etc.
I, of course cant say where the blame should be placed BUT I did manage to sort my lag issues. Ill state my current set up and then tell people how I fixed it for me.
Hopefully it will help someone.

System -
Windows XP pro (sp2) not installed sp3 yet. 100% clean install. (Installed last week, no fonts other then system fonts and no other programs apart from CS4 design package - its still runing fast now with 200+ extra fonts and other software installed)

4GB DDR3 1066 Ram (3.25 used)
Intel Core 2 Duo 3.33GHz 1333MHz
1GB GTX 280 PCI-E Mem 2210MHz GPU 602MHz, 240 Cores.

GPU driver = 180.48 (the very latest)
PhysX driver = 8.10.13 (the latest)
DirectX = 9.0c (latest version)

Main monitor = 27inch at 1920x1200 res
Second monitor (dual view) 22inch at 1650x1050

Ok so I have semi decent hardware but it was still lagging to the point where it was almost unusable but what I found was this.
By using the
b "NVIDIA Control Panel", going in to
b "Manage 3d Settings" and editing Photoshops 3d settings the lagging problems stopped.

The main setting that seemed to make a difference to me was the "multi-display/mixed gpu acceleration" which I changed form compatibility mode to "single GPU multiple display" mode.

All texture filtering and antialiasing is turned off. "Maximum prerendered frames" is set to zero.

After changing and playing with the settings I now cant get Photoshop to lag other then on extremely large files.
Brushes with color and opacity jittering with wet edges all at the same time on large docs are in real time. Images have also stopped flickering when using the hand tool or just moving the window itself.

Both with dual view and single screen desk top.
With multiple files open at once and in lots of diff res's.

The problems seems to have stopped so I can only assume that, for myself my GPU driver was trying to somehow process my images with extra 3d stuff even on 2d images and forcing these options off has done the trick. Its almost like the driver is seeing the whole of Photoshop as it would a PC game or other fully 3d program.

[Hudechrome-sd9sPI]

i What resolution do you normally run CS4 in

Whatever the max for the monitor. Today I used a 24" Samsung LCD Flat Screen, with the resolution set at max. 1920x1200.

I did no toying with the nVidia controls. Install OS, install nVidia driver, install CS4, run it.

I don't like the Samsung, and perhaps all LCD's because of the excessive contrast and brightness at default. It wasn't calibrated, so I have to hold off final judgment.

I saw absolutely no lags, even over 100% mag.

What I am trying to establish is a baseline system that will run CS4 as expected. Because of all the work I have done using the i7 system as my job, it was only natural that eventually I set aside some time and run a test, as I did with my own 32 bit systems. The differences are startling.

What is sorely needed is a formal evaluation with a rather complete testing matrix; an an almost obscene cost. (not to mention the ennui on the part of the people actually doing the testing!) I lucked out in that I could setup a system that worked "Out of the box".

What might happen as I load up Vista with other apps can only be guessed at.

I also did no printing from this system.

[_Andrew_Hart_]

Firebomb,

Which tab (Global Settings or Program Settings) did you make your changes to? If it was Program Settings, could you please confirm that you had "Adobe Photoshop CS4" selected as the program. Thanks.

[Walter_Elias]

I tried Firebomb's advice in both the general and Photoshop CS4 tabs of the nVidia Control Panel. In my case I set it to "single display performance mode" in both, since I have only one display, so that kinda made sense. I'm sorry to say it doesn't seem to have any effect. Sigh...and I was hoping someone had found the key to this problem.

I wonder what kind of setup nVidia used to test Photoshop, to come up with their default list of settings. It's possible they also need to do further tests on various systems.

[_Andrew_Hart_]

Re Adam Jerugim's request for volunteer testers in Post #419 above

Is anyone using/testing Stonehenge (ver 11.0x001DEV) supplied to me in response to volunteering to test?

If so, have you had any improvement in OpenGL-enabled performance?

Stonehenge has all but solved my lag problems when OGL is disabled but made no difference to when it is enabled. I don't think it was supposed to if all Advanced Settings were left at their defaults. However, I have tried all possible combinations of disabling individual and multiple Advanced Settings but to no effect.

[_Firebomb_]

@Andrew Hart

Its the
Manage 3d settings>Program settings> and then having Adobe Photoshop CS4 selected in the dropdown box of programs there.
If u do it in Global setting sit will disable those fetures for ALL programs.

@David Nicol

its a shame it wont work for everyone. One thing i might have a go at tho it using "Rivatuner" which is a popular program to edit indepth settings of your graphic card.
That program has loads of setting and tweaks u can apply to openGL and other bits and bobs if u have not tryed it. As long as u dont overclock ya card to the moon with it you cant really hurt ya graphics card playing with most settings.

It might be worth a go to anyone desperate. You can force alot of the openGL settings off at a lower driver lvl then ya can with nvidia control pannel if i remeber right.

[_Firebomb_]

Here a ful list of the settings that worked for me just incase.

Anisotropic filtering - OFF
Antialiasing gamma correction - OFF
Antialasing mode - OFF
Antialiasing transprency - OFF
Conformat texture clamp - USE HARDWARE ( could try the openGL option )
Error reporting - OFF
Extension limit - none.
Max preredered frames - ZERO 0
Multidisplay/mixed GPU - single GPU multidisplay proformace (set to your set up)
Texture filtering - OFF
Texture filtering Negative LOD - CLAMP
Texture filtering quality - High performance
Trilinear optimization - ON
THreaded optimization - AUTO
Triple buffering - OFF
Vsync - FORCE OFF

[_Andrew_Hart_]

Thanks Firebomb. Will give your settings a try in both original release CS4 and Stonehenge. Need a few hours sleep just now - 2.30am here in Oz.