Photoshop CS4 is a disaster

[_ProArtist_]

I'm am just at a loss of words.

What a mess. It could not be any slower. What were you thinking Adobe?

You ripped apart the code just to add GPU support for what? To provide worse performance?

Make sure you DL the demo first... CS4 is a disaster.

The latest hardware cant even run it smoothly... Dont tell me its graphic drivers.

[Guest]

> Photoshop CS4 is a disaster

No it's not!

Loads and runs fast; wonderful new features. A photographer's dream!

(No affiliation with Adobe other than as a satisfied user.)

[_ProArtist_]

I'm running a QX7600 Vista 64 system, 8GB ram, Nvidia 8800GTX. Its not my system.

I've tried all of the drivers etc etc. There are too many complaints for it to be user error. The problem is with the hack job Adobe did on the PS code. I'm sure it wasnt pretty. You dont get GPU support into a mature code base such as photoshop without ripping it apart hard.

Its just not right. CS3 ran a lot better. The GPU is not supposed to bottleneck or hurt performance. Its supposed to ADD performance. It does not in photoshops case.

I like the new features, but something is seriously messy with the CS4 code.

The sad thing is... they added all of this 3D object painting support and in the end... its worthless. Its not feature rich to support texture map painting on a professional level, nor is it fast enough. So why bother Adobe? WHY?

Body Paint 3D is still far superior and CS4 inst production ready for Interactive 3D Object texture mapping.

Hell right now, its not even production ready for 2D painting.

[ArrrBee]

It is interesting that looking at the people having problems I see two
reoccuring themes here.

1. AMD processors.
2. Nvidia graphics cards.

Having been burnt by AMD once before I now always go Intel. As for video I
used to be a diehard Matrox user, but they haven't kept up with the
technology so now it is ATI and I have had my share of problems with them.
But, finally have stable drivers.

One word of advice. If you get stable drivers don't update unless you have
to. On several ocassions I have done this only for the drivers to break
things that worked fine before the update. The trick is getting a stable set
of drivers.

Good luck to all,

Robert

[_ProArtist_]

I want to add that even on that system i mentioned... In software mode, CS4 is only using 35% of the CPU and its STILL SLOW.

That certainly suggests that CS4 is programmed poorly. CS3 is a hell of a lot faster.

[CR Henderson]

ProArtist, I do not doubt your word that you are having problems and I've read threads from others who are having problems, too. However, there are many who are not having problems or have only minor problems. I am one of those not having major problems. My system:

Windows Vista Ultimate x64 on an Intel DG965WH motherboard, 8GB RAM, 1TB+ free diskspace, nVidia 9800 GTX+ video card, Wacom Intuos3 6x8 tablet. All of my PS CS3 plugins work fine in Photoshop CS4 Extended 32 bit. I've almost forgotten what the PS CS3 interface looks like for I never use it.

[klsteven-vBdprK]

ProArtist,
just a little thing you can try:
Set up the cache level to 6-8.
On my system when the cache level is at 1 for example, Photoshop gets extremely slow! Even turning a layer on or off takes 2 seconds.

[Guest]

>Dont tell me its graphic drivers.

ok then.

[ArrrBee]

No problems here.

Robert

[_Phos_four_dots_]

> "If you get stable drivers don't update unless you have
to."

I think this is excellent advice, and applicable to updates of ANY kindOS, drivers, apps, or anything else.

I ALWAYS read the tech-news sites and look for early-adopter feedback when new versions of things are released.

I NEVER let anything update automatically if I can find a way to turn of that feature in the app, utility, whatever...

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Farrellart]

like stefan states - up the cache. mine is set on 8 and CS4 is smoooooth.

[Rob_Keijzer]

What helped me (XP pro SP3, Q6600, NVIDEA 8400GT+512 MB) was turn on GPU in preferences, but then click on Advanced, and switch off everything there.

Result: smooth canvas rotation, smooth panning (swithed off flick panning, don't like that kind of ballistics) and smooth odd zoom factor image.

One negative result: Smooting in the Brushes Panel doesn't work any more (after these settings, that is) but I still use an ancient wacom graphire with old driver.

I ordered a wacom Intuos, and when it arrives I'll dive into that.

All in all I'm satisfied with CS4.

Rob

[_Jeff_Holmes_]

Runs like it was custom designed for my system. I've never been more amazed with a piece of software. It may be that higher end systems are happier with this release (if you can even call it that - it's more like a brand new application).

For once, hardware has to catch up to the software. It's elegant and if I could I'd marry it. I'd give it anything it wants and even take out the garbage without being asked.

Asus Maximus II Formula
8GB OCZ Reaper 1066 ram
Intel Q9550 OC'd
Vista Ultimate x64

[Guest]

>One word of advice. If you get stable drivers don't update unless you have to.

amen!

>and applicable to updates of ANY kind

not so. os and other app updates are usually for fixing security flaws. these shouldn't be ignored in today's wild west interweb.

>I NEVER let anything update automatically if I can find a way to turn of that feature in the app, utility, whatever...

that's true.

[_Russell_Proulx_]

C R Henderson Wrote:
> Windows Vista Ultimate x64 on an Intel DG965WH motherboard, 8GB RAM

I'm surprised that system is working properly. I had an Intel 975BX2 motherboard that could not use any brand of 8GB RAM with Vista64 let alone CS4. Intel even RMA'd me a newer revision of the board and it also could not run stable. So I replaced it with an Asus P5E WS-PRO which works fine. I was left with the impression that only x38 and newer chipsets that support "Memory Remappng" will work. The 975 chipset did not so I'm very surprised the 965 chipset does.

see: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929605

Russell

[Guest]

Russell,

It's odd that your 975 chipset didn't support memory remapping. I had an ASUS P5W DH Deluxe motherboard, also based upon the 975 chipset, which DID support memory remap. In fact, I only learned what that was about after finding my PC was only indicated slightly over 3GB of RAM during the POST. This sounds more like the Intel BIOS simply didn't support that option; similarly, I do not see it in the AWARD BIOS of my Gigabyte P45-based motherboard, yet it still detects the 8GB of memory I'm running with now.

I miss my ASUS board...seems it actually outperforms this newer Gigabyte board with my Core 2 Extreme processor, but the ASUS decided to throw up a puff of smoke when I plugged in my headset microphone recently...after years of using an Audigy 2 sound card but troubleshooting an audio issue and thus reverting to the on-board sound. I still need to contact ASUS about a possible RMA under warranty, given I've got 1 year left on it. Oddly too, the ASUS would boot fine with external USB drives plugged in, whereas the Gigabyte does not.

Regards,

Daryl

[_Ray_Majoran_]

Hey everyone,

I'm hoping to get some help as well. I feel exactly like ProArtist - I feel like CS4 is an absolute disaster (because I am experiencing this ridiculous slowness). That said, for fear of being counter-productive and negative, I'm just hoping that Adobe and NVidia can get this problem worked about sooner than later. I am running a brand new Dell Latitude D830 on Vista 32 with 4GB of RAM. CS3 works amazing, but CS4 is a major bog (with or without GPU). The card (that is built into my laptop) is a Quadro NVS 140M. Any help from other users that have solved this on a Dell laptop would be appreciated. (Regarding the AMD comment noted by Robert - my system is running Intel Core2.)

Thank you.

Sincerely,
Ray

[Guest]

It's beginning to look as if CS4 is not a laptop application.

[_J_Maloney_]

JJ just got fired. Ouch. ;)

[CR Henderson]

>Russell Proulx:C R Henderson Wrote:
Windows Vista Ultimate x64 on an Intel DG965WH motherboard, 8GB RAM
I'm surprised that system is working properly.

It didn't for quite some time. Intel had a problem in the BIOS that caused any 64 bit system with over 4GB RAM to run about as well as a TRS-80. If an old version of the BIOS was installed all worked OK. After about 2 years they finally came out with a BIOS version in June that fixed all the x64 problems for the 965 series of boards when used with a 64 bit OS and >4GB RAM.

The problem was discussed here:

http://forums.microsoft.com/TechNet/showpost.aspx?postid=4018443&siteid=17

====================
>John Joslin:It's beginning to look as if CS4 is not a laptop application.

Not necessarily. It works fine on my laptop--almost as fast as my desktop and certainly more than usable. My laptop:

>Operating System: Windows Vista 64-bit
Version: 6.0 Service Pack 1
System architecture: Intel CPU Family:6, Model:7, Stepping:6 with MMX, SSE Integer, SSE FP, SSE2
Physical processor count: 2
Processor speed: 2494 MHz
Video Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
Video Card Renderer: GeForce 8400M GS/PCI/SSE2
OpenGL Drawing: Enabled.
Video Card: NVIDIA GeForce 8400M GS
Video Mode: 1280 x 800 x 4294967296 colors
Video Card Driver: nvd3dum,nvd3dumx.dll,nvwgf2um, nvwgf2umx.dll
Driver Version: 7.15.11.7432
Built-in memory: 4093 MB
Free memory: 1965 MB
Memory available to Photoshop: 3469 MB
Memory used by Photoshop: 60 %
Image cache levels: 4
Serial number: make a guess!
Application folder: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop CS4 (64 Bit)\
Temporary file path: C:\Users\xxx\AppData\Local\Temp\
Photoshop scratch has async I/O enabled
Scratch volume(s):
C:\, 284.7G, 147.0G free

It is good that the drivers worked, for as others have experienced I cannot get updated drivers from nVidia, only from HP, and my guess is that new drivers from HP aren't likely to happen all that quickly.

[_Adam_Jerugim_]

Another offer to those experiencing CS4 performance problems...

If you're located anywhere near the S.F. bay area, please let me know. Having a system to debug on that's actually showing this problem is essential for us to be able to get a better understanding of why this is happening.

thanks,
-Adam

[Chris Cox]

Most of these problems really are driver issues (though some seem to be card firmware) -- please make sure that your video card manufacturer is aware of the problems, including the specifics of your system.

[Guest]

I have a amd processor running on vista ultimate 64 and I don't have big issues. I did have some lag like others reported but I set my cache to 8, as stated above, and it runs smooth now. May not make problems go away for others but it helped me out.

Also there is a new directx out 11/5/2008 (today) for those who might be interested.

[_Russell_Proulx_]

> It's odd that your 975 chipset didn't support memory remapping. I had an ASUS P5W DH Deluxe motherboard, also based upon the 975 chipset, which DID support memory remap.

I read CR Henderson's response and wished that I had not sold that board if it could indeed run stable with 8GB RAM. I just ran out of patience with Intel who wore me down with long distance $$ tech support calls and inept suggestions. Seems like Asus, who I was a long time fan of since the old P2B and P4T days, are better at getting their bios' right. Intel really left me thinking that they had nothing to offer...

Russell

[_Mark_John_Murphy_]

Add my CS4 installation to the DISASTER column. Very disappointing. I work with large images and usually have many open at once. There is a painful drag lag, redraw lag, whatever you want to call it. I do not wish to deal with it.

Moving images around the screen leaves a copy of the image where it used to be for a second. Very distracting. When I zoom in on a 20 MB image, in CS3 I can click the hand tool, drag the image around at will and it moves as smoothly as if I were moving a paper image around on a smooth surface. Cs4 is another story. As I click and drag I see a bunch of squares getting redrawn all over the screen. Very distracting.

On my Dell 1330 Laptop there is the additional problem of a disappearing brush outline above a certain brush size. On the laptop there is no hope because Dell will not release another video driver for this machine for XP in my lifetime.

On both the desktop and the laptop there is a gray line bisecting the menu at the top of the screen.

I have downloaded the latest nvidia driver to my dell vostro 400 desktop intel core 2 duo 6850 3ghz 3gb ram Nvidia geforce8600gts driver version 6.14.11.7824.

I have tried all of the turn off open gl and change cache level suggestions.

Something is amiss with CS4. If you have not purchased, don't. You should get the trial version and see if it works with your hardware.

CS3 works great on both my desktop and laptop - both about a year old.

I like Adobe & Photoshop, and I am a stockholder, but I am returning CS4 because it doesn't work on my machines. What disappoints me as a stockholder is that there are millions of others out there with machines like mine. I will be happy to purchase CS4 again, or CS5?, once Adobe fixes the problem with my machines.

And Adobe pointing to nvidia does not cut it. Adobe can't throw software out there and then point to, lets say, Epson as the reason why your printouts are all of a sudden screwed up, or to nvidia as the reason that CS4 is not displaying things correctly. They have to work out these problems with the manufacturers PRIOR to releasing a new version of CS, I don't care what the marketing folks say!

I would be glad to hang on to CS4 for free and work with Adobe to fix their problem (and I do mean their problem)..... but I am not going to hang around on my dime. I am getting my money back.