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J
JJo-45
Participating Frequently
March 28, 2022
Question

Tiff files are not uncompressed

  • March 28, 2022
  • 4 replies
  • 5981 views

Jorma Jokinen.

I have made a Family Tree chart in tiff format. Every time I get new information I open it in PS and do my editing. After repeating this tens of times the older parts of the chart are beginnig to seem more and more unreadable. Why this because tiff format is told to be uncompressed and loseless.

 

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    4 replies

    T
    Test Screen Name
    Legend
    March 31, 2022

    "I open a picture in PS, edit it and save in tiff format in mode without any compression. Why it is not exatly the same picture that I had on the screen when I open it again? "

     

    I think the results shown from your screen shots are clear. It is not the editing and saving of TIFF which causes the slow damage to the picture. You could open and save a TIFF a million or a billion times without any damage.  The damage is, therefore, caused by the things you do when you're editing (not necessarily every time).

      J
      jazz-y
      Legend
      March 30, 2022

      It seems to me that the problem is not related to the image format.

       

      Your example looks like you first reduced the size of the entire image (or an individual layer) and then increased it. For example, I took your screenshot with good readable text, its size 576x801 px reduced it to 200x308 px, and then returned it to its original size using  Preserve Details interpolation algorithm (Photoshop uses it automatically if you did not change the interpolation settings) . It can be seen that very similar distortions of letters to images have occurred (the difference is only in sharpness, I assume that you added it later).

       

       

        TheDigitalDog
        TheDigitalDog
        Inspiring
        March 28, 2022

        The TIFF format is always lossless, even if you pick one of the compression options which you may not want to do for support in other products and time lost compressing and uncompressing. A TIFF isn't a JPEG so no, you can open, edit and save without the same kinds of data loss as JPEG. Now unless you're re-editing high-bit data, edits can produce some data loss from the image editing itself but not in this case, due to you picking TIFF.

        More here: http://digitaldog.net/files/TIFFvsPSD.pdf

        Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"
          davescm
          Community Expert
          davescmCommunity Expert
          Community Expert
          March 28, 2022

          "The TIFF format is always lossless"

          That is not the case if you flatten an 8 bit image and save it as a TIFF using the jpeg compression option. Then the compression is lossy. If in doubt, try it, just Save As, choose TIFF and choose jpeg compression, setting the quality to low. On re-opening the TIFF file, the jpeg compression artifacts are obvious.

           

          Dave

            TheDigitalDog
            TheDigitalDog
            Inspiring
            March 28, 2022

            I don't have such an option I can select.

            Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"
            T
            Test Screen Name
            Legend
            March 28, 2022

            Yes, the TIFF format is lossless UNLESS you choose the "JPEG" option on saving (that is, the JPEG option for saving TIFF).

             

            Can you share a little cut off part of the family tree, with no complete personal info, to show us what the damage looks like?

              J
              JJo-45Author
              Participating Frequently
              March 28, 2022
              Here is a pair of pictures. The older date is 15.09.2021 and the newer
              22.02.2022.
              Between these dates there has been numerous open and save actions.
              Saving of the work file has always happened in uncompressed tiff format.
              The size of whole chart in tiff format is 487 MB and in jpg format which
              I have used when sending it to friends is 13 MB.
              T
              Test Screen Name
              Legend
              March 28, 2022

              New try with pictures.


              Thank you for the pictures. I agree, bad things have happened to this picture. There seem to be colour changes in lines, but this is not the kind of damage done by JPEG. I wonder if you could look under Image > Mode and tell what options are ticked?  There should be two options chosen.

              Also, please do confirm what options you choose for TIFF saving. These are the options I see

               

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