What method to identify a font type used ?

[Merlin3]

Hi, opening my last Pshop creation in my new win10 64bit pro PC, it says missing font, highlight the text and it declares Helvetica Bold.

I have copied font files from win7 fonts folder to win 10 fonts folder, however the Type 1 .pfb and .pfm files in there dont get installed that way, so after 2 hrs saying close to 174 prompts, I then discover one right clicks a .pfm and making sure beforehand its .pfb file is with it, select 'Install for all users'

it then installs.

I have such for Helvetica Neue bold, regular etc.

reboot PC. open the pshop work and again asks for Helvetica Bold.

receive from friend hevetica-Bold.ttf, right click install for all users, reboot pc,

guess what, still it says missing font.

so how do I find out exactly which font I need to find, the Helvetica Neueu are the only Helvetica fonts in the old PC fonts folder.

I need to search all my archives for whatever it wants, so I need to find the coding for that font, (the abbreviated name in other words, such as HLH____.PFM  

I used the same font in all Pshop work the last 20 yrs ! so I need to find the right one !

Merlin

[Kevin Stohlmeyer]

Are any of these Type1 fonts?

https://helpx.adobe.com/fonts/kb/postscript-type-1-fonts-end-of-support.html

[davescm]

Type 1 fonts are no longer supported in Photoshop (or other Adobe products)

https://helpx.adobe.com/uk/fonts/kb/postscript-type-1-fonts-end-of-support.html

To use with the current software versions, you will need to source an Open Type version of the fonts

Dave

[Lumigraphics]

Helvetica and Helvetica Neue are Apple system fonts. If you had Type 1 fonts on Windows, you would need to replace them with OpenType versions. On the Mac, this file should work or at least allow direct substitution to the system fonts.

[Merlin3]

Hi,

I still wonder...so how do I find out exactly which font I need to find, the Helvetica Neueu are the only Helvetica fonts in the old PC fonts folder.

I need to search all my archives for whatever it wants, so I need to find the coding for that font, (the abbreviated name in other words, such as HLH____.PFM  

Davescm.... Type 1 fonts are no longer supported in Photoshop (or other Adobe products)
Hi Dave, I am running Photoshop CS6 so how would it know it was not supposed to suport Type 1 ?

It accepted the CloisterBlack after I installed it by r/click install to all on the pfm file.

It also shows Goudy and others installed that way in the fonts list.

CS6 does support Type 1 we can say.

However just which Helvetica font files were in use by me the last 20 years ?

How do I find out ?

Lumigraphics

Helvetica and Helvetica Neue are Apple system fonts. If you had Type 1 fonts on Windows, you would need to replace them with OpenType versions.

The font files from the Windows fonts folder are these Helvetica Neue .

Yes, Type 1 fonts will continue to work in previous versions of Creative Cloud apps (including any dot releases or security updates) apart from Photoshop v23 and beyond, which ended support in 2021. Any release from January 2023 and beyond will not support Type 1 fonts.

OK for my Photoshop CS6 then.

Operating systems are also currently moving towards ending support for Type 1 fonts. Previous versions of Creative Cloud apps will not be able to support Type 1 fonts once support is ended for the operating system.

I am not creative cloud so free of such changes, am I right ?

Many fonts published by Adobe Type in the past (such as Adobe Originals) are available from the Adobe Fonts service for free with your Creative Cloud subscription.

Problem 1. I dont do Creative Cloud so that avenue is barred.

You can also update your Adobe-owned desktop fonts to the OpenType format for free by reaching out to our partner Type Network with proof of your original license.

Problem 2. I have no proof of licence, havent a clue where al these Type 1 fonts came from, perhaps some were bundled with software ?

Problem 3. Perpetual licenses for OpenType format fonts published by Adobe are also available for purchase from Type Network.

No way am I purchasing fonts though...skint.

Problem 4. Converting Type 1 fonts to the OpenType format is possible but will produce a sub-optimal result.

So all this talk of changing the fonts is of no use then. I need to open a document and have it auto replace the Type 1 with its new incarnation, but Problems 1,2,3,4 wreck that chance.

Problem 5.  Additionally, converting your files may be prohibited by the font foundry’s End User License Agreement. Please consult the license agreement or contact the foundry directly for more information.

So if I do know who the font foundy is, they may disallow conversion anyway.

I had 175 'donks' occur when copying .pfb and .pfm fron win7 fonts folder to win10, no way can I go through all this on that many.

For new documents I will have to use 'arial' crummy as it may be for pedigree function. I will have to install OpenType Helvetica family from somewhere and use that in future. As for all the existing work made with Helvetica just what can I do for that ? replace all the text with Helvetica OpenType, or did I read that all fonts are being replaced by an all new system again ?

InDesign has a Find and Replace feature that allows you to locate and replace any missing fonts in your document.

but what of problem 4 ?

Additionally, the current in-app alerts for Type 1 fonts in InDesign automatically redirects users to the Find/Replace dialogue, showing which Type 1 fonts are in the document and allowing them to select a replacement of their choice.

still problem 4 exists.

So I have to buy InDesign (got no funds for such, no doubt its cloud subs), then open my .psd file into it, it tells me what fonts need replacing, it then replaces them, so its now doing a Photoshop skills and tools set on a .psd normally dealt with in Pshop, then it saves it as Pshop CS6., will it save as CS6, doubt it.

....but is what its done as good as existed before ?

All in all there are too many issues here, I will continue with Type 1 or if I can replace them with AS GOOD AS, then use those instead.

Just what fonts should one acquire to be as gppd as Type 1 for scaling and full font behaviour ?

Problem 4 is worrying that what replaces Type 1 is inferior. Purchasing fonts to replace a few hundred Type 1 is not an option here. some folk have many hundreds.

Why CS6 exclaims Helvetica Bold missing when win7 made the file, yet is happy with the install of Type 1 CloisterBlack, and another prog now sees NuptialScript after its install, all this talk of support removed is for latest progs it seems, I NEED TO SOLVE HELVETICA BOLD issue.

perhaps I redo all the docs I open with the new alternative to Helvetica-Bold.

What is that alternative ?

Merlin.

[Merlin3]

just came to say cannot find Helvetica , all I see is folk saying what loks similar. Well thats not what a document needs, it needs same shape etc with different coding.  There will otherwise be fonts impossible to replace.  Where is the edit post button on this forum though, forums always have such.

I just searched on Adobe fonts for Helvetica family to get the non Type 1 and they dont have Helvetica, well thats a great start, if someone somewhere has decreed Type 1 Helvetica is history, where is its replacement we are supposed to use, called Helvetica open type or whatever ?

Merlin

[Kevin Stohlmeyer]

You'll need to purchase the OTF version from Monotype:

https://www.myfonts.com/collections/neue-helvetica-font-linotype

https://www.myfonts.com/collections/helvetica-font-linotype

[Lumigraphics]

I don't think Helvetica or Helvetica Neue was ever offered for free on Windows. As I stated, it comes free with an Mac or iOS device.

The only legal way to have this font on Windows is if someone purchased it. The other alternative is to use a Mac to access this file.

[Lumigraphics]

And on the format issue-

Fonts were originally bitmaps, circa 1984 and the original 128K Mac. Adobe developed PostScript which included font files, first Type 1 and then the little-used Type 3 formats.

Apple and Microsoft developed TrueType as a competitor because PostScript was expensive to license. Later on, they and Adobe created the OpenType format which replaces all previous formats. Type 1 is being phased out while TrueType is still fully supported alongside OpenType. These three formats are usually, but don't have to be, cross-platform.

Since you have CS6, you can use Type 1, TrueType, and OpenType fonts as desired. However, not all font families are available for free on Mac and/or Windows. In this case, Helvetica is free with Macs and must be purchased for Windows.

You say a friend gave you Helvetica Bold in TrueType format, if this file came from a Mac it will not work on a Windows computer. You would need the genuine Monotype Helvetica, either Type 1 or OpenType.

[davescm]

@Merlin3 said ' Hi Dave, I am running Photoshop CS6 so how would it know it was not supposed to suport Type 1 ?'

Type 1 fonts are still supported in older versions. I had not picked up from your first post that you were using CS6.

Others have already replied on Helvetica which needs to be specifically bought and licensed on Windows.

Dave

[Merlin3]

Hi,

well just looking at Helvetica, and I had at my disposal:-

Helvetica

Helvetica Italic

Helvetica Bold

Helvetica Bold Italic

Helvetica Light

Helvetica Light Italic

Helvetica Condensed

Helvetica Condensed Italic

thats 8 and the link shows they are from £42.99 each so thats at least £343, or a set of 30 is £439

Consider that I also was using Univers, Futura, Goudy , Cloister Black and a few more, thats going to cost a few thousand pounds, As the rebuild to win10 from win7 retaining case and psu and fans cost 1300 hardware, 400 labour and 900 SSD's leaving me peniless, and this is NOT for paid work, a further £2K is simply impossible, having gone without groceries last week as I have no money for them.  As for the 175 pairs of .pfb and .pfm in my win7 fonts folder, they will remain unreplaced .

In fact nothing will get purchased.

Somehow I must get hold of Helvetica for free or go over to using Arial. I only ended up using Helvetica as Photoshop has it there in the fonts list from the last file worked on and it uses it again without any prompt for the next file.

Having installed Helvetica-Bold.ttf from a friend/PC support for my PC, he is with windows , I see only an entry called Helvetica True Type in Photoshop, the BOLD option isnt there.

I open my pshop file and instead of declaring missing Helvetica Bold it again says 'some text layers might need to be updated' but if I go No and select text instead of showing the wording Helvetica Bold is missing , it now says 'editing or rendering the text layer will cause its layout to change' and in the font drop down its showing TT Helvetica, now why doesnt it just let me at the file, as it appears its used Helvetica TT and not the Type 1 that is also in that list.

Is this in fact windows 10 yet again messing about ?

If I elect to choose Update as opposed to 'No' when I first open the file, then highlighting the text shows it as TT Helvetica, and no warnings occur about edit and rendering.

That I installed Helvetica-Bold TT and the list shows it as Helvetica when I dont have Helvetica TT installed is now baffling and concerning. The font I have on screen is Helvetica Bold yet in Photoshop the Bold style in the window is greyed out.

Thus its telling me its not bold when it is, and in the fonts folder it is called Helvetica Bold True Type.

I am almost there as such, but bold is greyed out and its a bold font. this us unnerving and wrong.

I feel I am almost there, else....

I will have to alter all the text to Arial when I open something and it says missing fonts.

Cloister Black is a favourite and others dont have the characters it gives, so that will remain as Type 1. I am not buying it !

I just cannot justify thousands of pounds on just fonts and going without food and heating when I have things I need and I am unable to afford them, some are urgently wanted, when not buying any fonts for the last 20 years or so.

I hate having to spend 3 months of my life doing nothing creative but rebuild PC to win10 and install 130 progs, a number with hundreds of settings, when win7 was fine for actual work.

I hate Msoft. what the heck was wrong with Type 1 fonts, they worked !!!!

Merlin

[Kevin Stohlmeyer]

Unfortunately you wont find Helvetica for free. Monotype is seriously aggressive about enforcing knock-offs and hacked copies. If you find one - be wary as it could be malware.

[davescm]

If you cannot justify paying for a font then you will need to use a substitute.

'Having installed Helvetica-Bold.ttf from a friend' Fonts are licensed and not for free distribution. No-one here is going to promote or condone the bypassing of such licences.

Dave

[Lumigraphics]

Your problem is likely not Type 1 fonts, its using fonts that you don't have a license for. If you MUST get Helvetica faces for free, get a Mac.

Otherwise you'll want to look into a different typeface. Adobe Fonts has a good selection, and Google Fonts is one of the best projects that Alphabet/Google has on the web. I highly recommend it to anyone wanting free type.

https://fonts.google.com/

[Lumigraphics]

Speaking of Google, a Google search for "Helvetica substitute" turned up a bunch of pages, including this one

https://www.learnui.design/blog/helvetica-similar-fonts.html

[jane-e]

---

@Merlin3 wrote:

what the heck was wrong with Type 1 fonts, they worked 

---

To answer this question for you, we turn to Thomas Phinney who wrote this blog post 18 years ago in 2005:

https://blog.typekit.com/2005/10/06/phasing_out_typ/

Jane

[davescm]

That's a useful link Jane - thank you.

Dave

[jane-e]

Thank you @davescm 😊 !

As I was searching for Phinney's blog post (that I was hoping had not been removed due to its age), I came across something more recent. I didn't want to post the link until I actually watched it. In this video "The End of PostScript Type 1 Fonts" from just five months ago, Phinney speaks to the Publishing Professionals Network (www.pubpronetwork.org). It's well worth the time and I was enthralled!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2X_DZRN66o

@Merlin3 If you still want to know what was wrong with Type 1 fonts, Phinney will tell you here. You can start about four minutes into the video. 

If you just want to move forward, you have choices:

• Purchase the typefaces you need. Helvetica was designed by Linotype Design Studio in 1961 and Max Miedinger. It is software and is not free.
• Choose another sans serif typeface, but please don't choose Arial, which is awful. Whatever you choose, expect the text to reflow.
• Use OS and PS versions that support Type 1 and don't update either one Ever.. The downside is security risks and that when any part of your system breaks down you will be in a crisis situation.

Jane

[davescm]

@jane-e Thanks for posting that video. I've just watched it through and it is very good at explaining some of the technicalities and thinking behind the changes, as well as the advantages of the changes.

Dave

[Brad @ Roaring Mouse]

Windows users that ended up with Type 1 versions of Helvetica likely got them bundled with a Postscript printer purchase. This is where most people got Helvetica in the first place since it was one of the base14 Postscript fonts every PS printer came with.  If you still have an install CD for an old PS printer, you could try re-install the Type 1 Helvetica from there.

These are the usual file names:

 (for both .PFM and .FPB))

yes, Mac, since the intoduction of OS X replaced the Type 1 fonts with TrueType versions, but both Helvetica and Helevtica Neue came in Type 1 originally. Apple moved them to Truetype versions in OS X. Despite both having Helvetica in the name THEY ARE NOT the same font. The Neue family has slightly different shapes and are not a direct spacing replacement to the original Helvetica, but would be close enough ... you may just have to rejig the layout a bit there and there.

Other sources you might picked up these fonts in the past. A set of Basic fonts came with every install of the old Adobe Type Manager, and even old Adobe apps sometimes came with a folder full of "Adobe Type Basic".

[Lumigraphics]

I have a copy of the CS2 windows install DVDs at work, I'm going to check those. I also have Mac installers all the way back to Photoshop 3, not sure if I have any of the type disks left. Just to see what Adobe bundled.