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trwalp
trwalp
Known Participant
June 11, 2020
Answered

Photoshop Elements "Backup Catalog" questions

  • June 11, 2020
  • 1 reply
  • 4722 views

First, am I correct in understanding that "Backup Catalog" makes a backup of not only the Elements' "Catalog" but also the entire photo library that the Catalog points to?

 

When you select "Backup Catalog" in Photoshop Elements 2020 (Windows), then select Full Backup, the resulting files and folders bear no resemblance to the original. It looks totally proprietary. Why?

 

For backing up one's photo library, is it okay to use a separate backup program (e.g., Syncback), provided it retains the same folder structure as the original and retains all attributes and timestamps? Likewise, how about simply making a copy of the catalog in C:\ProgramData\Adobe\Elements Organizer\Catalogs?

 

I prefer to avoid proprietary backup schemes because the results are inaccessible and unusable if corrupted in the slightest way. 

----

Update: Case closed.  Thanks to the kind folks here I was able to accomplish my goal of putting the photos and the catalog on an external USB drive. I used PE2020's built-in backup/restore.  It was quick and easy.

    This topic has been closed for replies.
    Correct answer MichelBParis

    trwalp,

    The answer to your question is detailed in many of the posts I did those last days.

    For backing up one's photo library, is it okay to use a separate backup program (e.g., Syncback), provided it retains the same folder structure as the original and retains all attributes and timestamps? Likewise, how about simply making a copy of the catalog in C:\ProgramData\Adobe\Elements Organizer\Catalogs?

    Making a copy of the catalog folder does not work if you have to restore on a different drive (or drives) as the original ones. You can copy or move the catalog folder practically everywhere, but its contents don't change. All links stored in the catalog for the location of the pictures include not only the path in the folder trees, but the identification of the drive. If the drive is missing, all files in the copied catalog point to a missing drive. The catalog is unusable. Also, the present 'reconnection' tool in the Organizer can't reconnect a big library, contrary to what Lightroom can do.

     

    So, any external backup tools will work only if the restore is done on the same original drive(s). Or at least with a new drive with the same identification, which would require a cloned drive, a Windows command to change the drive identification or a change of the contents of the Organizer with an Sqlite tool.

     

    I prefer to avoid proprietary backup schemes because the results are inaccessible and unusable if corrupted in the slightest way. 

    Just consider zipping your media folder tree: it's a valid backup scheme even if you don't understand what's in it. The real issue with the organizer catalog in this respect is that you can look into it and alter its contents. The backup folders contains

    - a 'catalog.buc' file which is a renamed copy of the 'catalog.pseXXdb' database.

    - renamed copies of each of the media files (including xmp sidecar files)

    - a special file 'backup.tly' which stores lists of files to restore the folder structure and manage your backups, full or incremental. If this file is missing, that means your backup is corrupt. It's the last file written into the backup folder.

    - other accessory data or database such as the thumbnails cache and face recognition and other data.

     

    So, using an external backup tool can't work, and that's true for all catalog based softwares. 

     

    For me, the real issue with the old backup scheme in the organizer is that you can't easily 'reconnect' to the same folder structure like what is possible in Lightroom. I suppose that trying to apply the same workflow in the organizer would require a total overhaul of the catalog structure and management. However, I can imagine that with today's growing power of AI, Adobe could manage to improve its reconnection feature if the folder structure is exactly the same.

     

    1 reply

    MichelBParis
    MichelBParisCorrect answer
    Legend
    June 11, 2020

    trwalp,

    The answer to your question is detailed in many of the posts I did those last days.

    For backing up one's photo library, is it okay to use a separate backup program (e.g., Syncback), provided it retains the same folder structure as the original and retains all attributes and timestamps? Likewise, how about simply making a copy of the catalog in C:\ProgramData\Adobe\Elements Organizer\Catalogs?

    Making a copy of the catalog folder does not work if you have to restore on a different drive (or drives) as the original ones. You can copy or move the catalog folder practically everywhere, but its contents don't change. All links stored in the catalog for the location of the pictures include not only the path in the folder trees, but the identification of the drive. If the drive is missing, all files in the copied catalog point to a missing drive. The catalog is unusable. Also, the present 'reconnection' tool in the Organizer can't reconnect a big library, contrary to what Lightroom can do.

     

    So, any external backup tools will work only if the restore is done on the same original drive(s). Or at least with a new drive with the same identification, which would require a cloned drive, a Windows command to change the drive identification or a change of the contents of the Organizer with an Sqlite tool.

     

    I prefer to avoid proprietary backup schemes because the results are inaccessible and unusable if corrupted in the slightest way. 

    Just consider zipping your media folder tree: it's a valid backup scheme even if you don't understand what's in it. The real issue with the organizer catalog in this respect is that you can look into it and alter its contents. The backup folders contains

    - a 'catalog.buc' file which is a renamed copy of the 'catalog.pseXXdb' database.

    - renamed copies of each of the media files (including xmp sidecar files)

    - a special file 'backup.tly' which stores lists of files to restore the folder structure and manage your backups, full or incremental. If this file is missing, that means your backup is corrupt. It's the last file written into the backup folder.

    - other accessory data or database such as the thumbnails cache and face recognition and other data.

     

    So, using an external backup tool can't work, and that's true for all catalog based softwares. 

     

    For me, the real issue with the old backup scheme in the organizer is that you can't easily 'reconnect' to the same folder structure like what is possible in Lightroom. I suppose that trying to apply the same workflow in the organizer would require a total overhaul of the catalog structure and management. However, I can imagine that with today's growing power of AI, Adobe could manage to improve its reconnection feature if the folder structure is exactly the same.

     

      B
      Bob_Ganz
      Known Participant
      June 11, 2020

      Michel, I either don't understand or don't agree with your comment that 'using an external backup tool can't work'. I have my catalog on my C:\Drive and have used Acronis True Image for years to do a daily backup. I have my Media on my NAS and have used the NAS' proprietary backup for daily backup for years. I have had to restore both at various times and am careful to make sure that the Media is restored to it's original location (and that the NAS share is mapped as the same drive letter on the PC with the same file structure. I have never had a problem when I restore. Am I missing your point?

       

      trwalp, re your comment 'I prefer to avoid proprietary backup schemes because the results are inaccessible and unusable if corrupted in the slightest way' I can certainly understand although the same thing can happen with a zip file (or technically with a regular file though I can't say that has ever happened to me). The backup program I have (Acronis) has a validation app and my practice is to have Acronis automatically validate the backup file every time I create one. While I have had corruption problems in the past, I have not (yet) had one with the current version. I especially like the fact that you can schedule the backups in a number of different ways and, in my case, have the backup file stored on a NAS share. I don't know if other Backup apps have the validation feature but for the reason you cite, I wouldn't get one without it. Trying to recover a corrupted backup has got to be the most frustrating things that can happen.

       

      Bob

       

        trwalp
        trwalpAuthor
        Known Participant
        June 11, 2020

        Thank you for the additional input, Bob.  

         

        In this particular thread my goal is not to simply backup and restore to the same system and drives; it is to move the photo library and catalog to an external SSD that can then be used with PE2020 on two different PCs.

         

        Since both you and Michel addressed my backup preferences I must add that I want a backup that looks identical to the original source, i.e, a Windows folder structure just like the original data. In some instances I use SyncBack's versioning system but it's pretty much invisible. I don't want my backups proprietary, incremental, zipped, nada -- because I can't simply connect the backup drive and access the files. Beyond Compare is my best friend, and it cannot run a compare against a proprietary backup! 

         

        For drive images, Terabyte Image files (like those from Acronis) are fine, and I agree with you about the verification step.

         

        Interesting that you use a NAS. As I wrote, that's how I started this project. But having used PE2020 for a few days I discovered the error in my plan. Stupidly, I thought my wife and I could share the photo library and catalog, which turns out to be impossible. Plus, there's latency with the NAS. I can hear it spin up when PE runs, which briefly freezes it, then when using PE there is the occasional delay that I attribute to the NAS.

         

        Someday, someone smart is going to release a Picasa/Elements/Lightroom-like program designed for today's family that needs to frequently transfer photos from their phones to a central family library, and all have access to it for editing, printing, and creative uses.  This single-user design is from a by-gone era, where one person in the family was "the photographer".

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