Text Based Editing - Sequence Doesn't Match Clips / Sequence incomplete

[cam matador]

Transcript for sequence in text window does not match the transcripts generated for the independent clips when viewed source side. The first 10 seconds of transcript of a thirty second clip is missing only on sequence side. Happening for clips throughout sequence. Transcript for sequence is also incomplete by omitting transcripts for individual clips in their entirety. And anything after a few minutes into a 20 minutes sequence is missing.

Yet, as said, the transcripts for individual clips as generated by the text to edit transcript process are complete on the source side. Just not sequence side. 

Static transcribe is also fine. 

Feature is useless as such. 

Clips are Sony MXF from FX9 / FX6. 4k in 1080p 29.97. When usual default channel mapping and modified channel mapping to two track mono (ditching used blank channels). Both used channels have full audio from speaker. Audio is extremely clean and well recorded. 

On the latest Premiere 24.2.1 
Dell 7780 Precision / Nvidia RTX 5000 Ada / 64GB ram / Win 11

Cammatdor

Frustrated Video Editor 

[Stan Jones]

I don't recall anyone reporting this problem.

So if you scrub the timeline, it does not show location in the transcript tab until the 10 second mark?

If you drag one of the clips to the new icon (create a matching sequence), is the full transcript there?

Stan

[cam matador]

Thanks for the interest, Stan.

If I scrub the timeline the transcript highlights move from the very first word but they are the wrong words they are the words that occur 10 second later in the clip. Also out of a 20 minute sequence of such clips I would say half the clips do not have a transcription on the sequence side, just the source side. So the transcript highlighting just stops in those areas.

Cammatdor

Frustrated Video Editor 

If I create a new sequence from one of these clips the same thing occurs. 

I should mention these are SUBCLIPS of selects pulled from a thirty minute interview. And there in may lie the rub. 

The monolithic master clip seems to work properly, but since that is sequence with that doesn't have any edits hard to say if that is the issue. Wouldn't suprise me. Adobe has never figured out to properly implement subclips throughout the editing and media management process. 

[Stan Jones]

I recall someone saying subclips do not work correctly, but I don't find any info in my notes.

Let me preface my comments by saying I do not use subclips, and I do not understand them.

A quick test (in Release 24.2.1) shows the problem.

Transcribe a clip, create a sequence from it. all is well.

Open the clip in the Source Monitor, set in/out, and create a subclip. Right-click the subclip in the Project Panel and Re-transcribe.

Open the subclip in the Source Monitor and switch to transcript view: all is well.

Create a sequence from the subclip, there is only a tiny bit of the transcript text, but it shows the full timecode range.

Now right-click the subclip in the Project Panel, "Edit subclip," and check "convert to source clip." I did NOT retranscribe. The subclip sequence does not change, but a NEW sequence created from the (same) converted subclip now has the correct transcript in sequence view. The subclip respects the in/out points set, but the edit subclip (and opening in the Source monitor) shows it is the full clip - just with in/out set.

@alexander-riss @Kerstin Ebert Can you educate us as to whether this is the expected subclip/source transcript behavior, and whether there is a workaround?

Stan

[cam matador]

I will check out your process but it may limit the usefulness of subclips because they are no longer subclips and mistakes can be made that moves in/out points in what is a now a pile of duplicate master clips. 

Subclips can be an important part of many workflows with a low cull percentage from a big bank of media or where good organization is critical. 

Adobe and many users don't get this. But nearly every other platform handles subclips better by understanding their relation to master clips. Avid is particularly great at it. But they have had media and project management down since day one. 

Thanks

Cammatador 

[Stan Jones]

> it may limit the usefulness of subclips because they are no longer subclips

Exactly; not a workaround.

Let's see what Kerstin or Alexander might say. @mattchristensen @jstrawn Anything about subclips more generally?

Stan

[cam matador]

Yeah. But pretty good trouble shooting on your part!

Thanks for the attention.

Cammatador

[mattchristensen]

@cam matador @Stan Jones Thanks for bringing this up, we're taking a look.

[cam matador]

@mattchristensen 

Matt, thanks for taking a look at this. Please update us when you can confirm or deny the issue and the possibility of a fix.

Cammatador 
Video Editor

[mdemar22]

@mattchristensen Were y'all ever able to find or patch a fix?

[Stan Jones]

@mdemar22,

I don't recall any further discussion of this.

I repeated a version of my test using the current Release, PR 24.3.0, but discovered that my lack of understanding led to incorrect results in my previous tests. My error was in not understanding that creating a subclip from a source that is in a sequence does not replace that source with the subclip.

This time, I added a 2:34 .mp4 clip to a new project, transcribed it, opened it in the Source Monitor, and created 2 subclips. Subclip 1 was from 20 to 50 seconds with trims restricted. Subclip 2 was from 1:50 to 2:00 with trims unrestricted. I then cleared any in/out from the original clip.

When Subclip 1 is opened in the Source Monitor, the Text panel shows limited text but the timecodes and the text included are wrong. When Subclip 2 is opened in the Source Monitor, the Text panel shows the full transcript text of the original clip. This makes sense, since this unrestricted subclip has the Media start and end of the original clip, and its subclip in/out points. The restricted clip has the timecodes for the in/out as its media start/end.

I re-transcribed each subclip. Subclip 1 is quick, but I can see that it is actually processing. The timecodes are correct (per the 20-50 timecode range) and the text is correct. Subclip 2 is also quick, and also goes through some processing. The timecodes are as if the clip starts at zero (which it doesn't) and the text is correct.

I created a sequence from Subclip 1 and it shows the sequence transcript correctly starting from sequence zero. A sequence created from Subclip 2 shows "No dialogue found."

Adding both subclips to a matching sequence shows only the transcript from Subclip 1 and no warning that there is a clip with no transcription showing.

I did not look at the effects of editing the subclips and changing starting times, etc.

Subclips that restrict trims and that are re-transcribed might work correctly.

@alexander-riss @Kerstin Ebert Is this the expected subclip/source transcript behavior?

Stan

[Cvo FHN]

I posted the same question here, I'll follow along in this thread since there's more context. 

The rub definitely seems to have to do with subclips. Transcription feature is great, subclipping is great - if we can get the 2 to work seamlessly then the video assembly and editing process would be absolutely wonderful.