Inspiring

Question

15.4.1 another big step backwards on my system OSX

Forum|Forum|4 years ago
August 19, 2021
5 replies
4623 views

Without OpenCL support, and relying on Metal or Software Only rendering, I get no real-time playback whatsoever with .mxf clips with one instance of Red Giant Colorista applied - even at quarter resolution. A massive number of frames are being dropped, with only occasional bursts of real-time performance.

This is with 4K source footage in an HD Sequence, both at the same frame rate of 23.976.

This renders this version of Pr completely unusable to me. For reference, Pr 14.9 is still working like a champ, which I infer is because of the OpenCL support that Adobe chose to discontinue for Pr 2021.

I have a powerful MacPro7,1. System Compatibility Report finds "No Conflicts to Report."

MacPro7,1 - 2.7 GHz 24-Core Intel Xeon W - 256G RAM - AMD Radeon Pro Vega II 32 GB

ATTO R680 PCIe SAS SCSI RAID6 (8 drives)

OSX 10.15.7

I wonder if anybody with a similar computer gets acceptable results on Big Sur, or has any other idea for the reason for my thread title.

Hardware or GPU

This topic has been closed for replies.

David Simonton, DVA

Community Manager

Jim, I'm trying to create something to simulate your workflow, and I have a question for you that I don't think has been asked yet:

Are there certain parts of your sequence that drop frames, while other segments play back without dropping frames? If so, I'd be curious to know what all is happening in the parts of the sequence that reliably drop frames.

I've got some 4k media that I'm scaling to fit a 1080 sequence (that's correct, yes?). Some MXF Op1a, some ProRes4444, some PNG stills with alpha, and I'm applying Colorista (V). I also have a 1080 source that I've stabilized in its own sequence. Any other variables I need to throw in?

J

Jim CurtisAuthor

Inspiring

Hi, DS. Yes, certain sections play without frames dropping, such as when there's one instance of Colorista IV. But, as soon as the CTI hits a spot with a PNG super, or an additional effect, it starts dropping frames and keeps dropping them. Once the Dropped Frame light turns yellow, it stays yellow, unless I hit the spacebar twice. Then, depending on what the section I stopped on has going on, it may stay green for a few seconds before turning yellow again.

I've been given mostly 4K .mxf footage recently, shot at 23.976 that I'm using in 23.976 HD Sequences. But, I'm seeing the same poor Metal performance with 4K ProRes 422 captured on an Atomos Ninja, and that codec is eaven easier on the GPU than .mxf, IINM.

What kind of computer are you using?

David Simonton, DVA

Community Manager

Thanks for getting back to me, Jim. These tips may be helpful in getting a repro here, and I'll keep you posted. I've got a 2017 model iMacPro, 3.2GHz, 8-core Xeon, with a Vega64 (16GB). I suspect it's especially relevant that once you hit a bottleneck, the frames keep dropping and don't recover. I'll spend some time nosing around in that direction.

B

Baffy19

Legend

Without OpenCL support, and relying on Metal or Software Only rendering, I get no real-time playback whatsoever with .mxf clips with one instance of Red Giant Colorista applied - even at quarter resolution. A massive number of frames are being dropped, with only occasional bursts of real-time performance.

This is with 4K source footage in an HD Sequence, both at the same frame rate of 23.976.

This renders this version of Pr completely unusable to me. For reference, Pr 14.9 is still working like a champ, which I infer is because of the OpenCL support that Adobe chose to discontinue for Pr 2021.

I have a powerful MacPro7,1. System Compatibility Report finds "No Conflicts to Report."

MacPro7,1 - 2.7 GHz 24-Core Intel Xeon W - 256G RAM - AMD Radeon Pro Vega II 32 GB
ATTO R680 PCIe SAS SCSI RAID6 (8 drives)
OSX 10.15.7

I wonder if anybody with a similar computer gets acceptable results on Big Sur, or has any other idea for the reason for my thread title.

By @Jim Curtis

I'll say this: both on the Imac system and on Windows, the use of standard effects (not to mention third-party plugins) is no good for a professional video editing program. Let those who are reading now experience the application of various kinds of effects to their project on their own machines. Am I interested in hearing the opinion of others??? Or is everything perfect for everyone??? I won't believe it. I have one opinion for the majority of users, so this is that they simply do not apply them to their projects, so there is no response.

J

Jim CurtisAuthor

Inspiring

I had some time to do more experimenting. I trashed my 15.x prefs, reset the plug-in cache, opened a 14.9 project, deleted all the third party effects from my Sequence, and saw SOME improvement in playback. It's still periodically dropping frames.

So, I applied Colorista IV to some clips, and to my surprise, it played back SOME of the clip in real-time, but eventually started dropping frames.

I have iStat Menus installed, and can see how my CPU (24 cores) and GPU are being utilized. On starting playback, I occassionally see ALL my CPU cores being pegged for a few seconds, then slowly reducing to just a few cores working moderately, which is something I hardly ever see in any app. I see my GPU meter going to about 60%, then slowly reducing. This is completely different from what I see in Pr 14.9.

I wrote to RedGiant about this, Kevin, and I don't expect a reply for days. Their support is usually marginal at best, and non-existent on weekends.

R Neil Haugen

Legend

Jim,

I've the full RG Universe ... and had the RG app manager stop taking my logon. Tried the Maxon app, wouldn't take my logon. Their site logged me in instantly but the app manager wouldn't.

Contacted RG/Maxon support and got an email back in only three hours. Which is a lot better than I'd have before. Basically, told me to uninstall the RG manager and go to the new Maxon one, try that. Which eventually worked.

But I even had followups from them! So maybe Maxon taking over RG might get us better support. Michael Szalapski (known as the ACP Szalam on the Ae board) is now with Maxon, and is a very good user-focused person. I hope that's a good sign.

And it's really a puzzler watching how PrPro and Ae play out on different systems. I can't always fit any logic to it. Some major machines choke, some fly. Some weak systems fly, many choke. What the ... ?

Just puzzling.

Neil

Everyone's mileage always varies ...

R Neil Haugen

Legend

I would note that the removal of OpenCL support on the Macs is due to direct instruction from Apple. Sadly.

Neil

Everyone's mileage always varies ...

J

Jim CurtisAuthor

Inspiring

Deleted by original poster

Kevin-Monahan

Community Manager

Jim,

Sorry. The best place for any bug report is here: Premiere Pro User Voice. I have yet to hear of any widespread problems, but the release just came out. I will keep an eye out. For sure, contact the manufacturer of these effects.

Thanks,
Kevin

Kevin Monahan - Sr. Community and Engagement Strategist – Adobe Pro Video and Audio

Kevin-Monahan

Community Manager

Kevin, and anybody else who's interested: The performance under Metal in Pr 2020 / 14.9 is almost as snappy as with OpenCL - only a few frames every few seconds are dropped with Colorista applied. That's the third party effect I use most. Second most used is Samurai. With OpenCL, playback is real-time, no dropped frames and no degrading of playback quality.

The difference between 14.9 and 15.4.1 with Metal is night and day. Add one instance of Colorista in 15.4.1, and in some cases there's no playback of video at all. In others, there's about four frames per second. No real time whatsoever with any Red Giant, Boris, Digital Anarchy, or other third party effect. And, forget about scrubbing the CTI in the timeline.

Pointing the finger at third parties isn't helpful. Their effects work fine (for the most part) on Metal in 2020 / 14, and therefore I would expect them to point the finger back at Adobe, leaving us hapless customers as collateral damage in Vendor Wars.

As far as Apple discontinuing OpenCL, they are still selling hardware that supports it. Their jillion dollar MacPros made for PROS are sold with cards with OpenCL supported GPUs. Many of us PROS are still using their high-end machines. I got ten years of service from the previous Mac tower, and I expect to be using the new one until 2029 likewise. Adobe seems to be focusing their development of Pr on amateurs. Maybe consider dropping "Pro" from the name of the Premiere Pro, if that's the case. It's not that Adobe can't support OpenCL for while longer. They've just chosen not to.

Jim,

This is a valid concern. Get that User Voice post up detailing the issue. There might already be one up there, I have not checked yet. Once you do, I'll help advocate for the issue by making sure a bug is filed and that the engineers have it on their backlog (to do list) and place it in the proper priority.

I know it's not helpful to indicate third party effects manufacuturers, but I think it's an important thing to send a signal to them about the issues you are facing. That way, the third party folks will engage with engineering and things tend to get done faster that way - not trying to merely give you the runaround. Larger issues like this, are complex and might take some time to work out.

Dev for Metal needs to be better for effects performance. Good request. Hope to help.

Thanks,
Kevin

Kevin Monahan - Sr. Community and Engagement Strategist – Adobe Pro Video and Audio

J

Jim CurtisAuthor

Inspiring

Update: I just opened two older projects in which source footage and Sequence are 29.97, and getting better real-time performance. One had ProRes sources, and another had .mxf.

I had tried several other projects with 23.976 sources (.mxf) and sequences, and got many many dropped frames on all of them.

Sign up

To post, reply, or follow discussions, please sign in with your Adobe ID.

Sign in to Adobe Community

To post, reply, or follow discussions, please sign in with your Adobe ID.

Scanning file for viruses.

This file cannot be downloaded