Premiere Pro no output from source panel w/ Blackmagic Decklink SDI 4K

[TonySal2]

I am trying to resolve a compatibility issue between Premiere Pro 2020 and a Blackmagic Decklink SDI 4K.

Currently I am running Premiere Pro 2020 Version 14.2.0 (Build 47) and cannot output (Adobe term is transmit) the source panel video or audio via a Decklink SDI 4K to an external HD-SDI monitor.

When the camera original footage is 4K UHD @23.98 and the sequence is set to 1920 x 1080 @23.98 the source panel video or audio will not transmit to the Decklink. 

However if the camera original footage is HD 1920 x 1080 @23.98 the source panel video and audio will transmit out of the Decklink SDI 4K.

In either case the program panel (sequence set to 1920 x 1080 @ 23.98) will always output video and audio via the Decklink SDI 4K.

When I double click a clip in the 1920 x 1080 sequence (original clip source is 4KUHD resolution but is now in a 1920 x 1080 sequence) to load into the source panel both audio and video will play out the Decklink SDI 4K but the video displayed is magnified both in the source panel and external HD-SDI monitor.

The effect control of the clip loaded into the source panel indicate the scale is at 50%, position 960 and 540 which is correct but the image is incorrectly magnified as the image downscaling is not happening.

In the Premiere Pro preferences Playback menu the decklink card is recognized for both the audio and video device.

The playback setting are as follows:

Checked : pause media encoder queue during playback
checked : enable mercury transmit

audio device : set to Blackmagic playback 
video device : set to Blackmagic playback - setup (Contextual menu ) set to 
Device : Decklink SDI 4K, For output of unsupported frame sizes: Scale down

checked: disable video output when in the background ( I have this turned on so I can switch back and forth between Premiere Pro and DaVinci Resolve V15.3.1 to release the Decklink SDI 4K to the active application.) Turning it off has no effect on fixing the source panel transmit issue.

When switching to DaVinci Resolve 15.3.1 there are no issues with the same 4K UHD camera original footage playing out on the source or program panels.  

Workstation details:
Mac OSX High Sierra Version 10.13.6
Mac Pro (Late 2013)
Processor: 3 Ghz 8-core Intel Xeon E5
Memory: 12 GB 1866 Mhz DDR
Graphics: AMD Firepro D700 6144 MB

Blackmagic Desktop video : installed and tested Versions 11.4, 11.4.1, 11.5.1 none of which fixed the source panel playback issue.
(note version 11.4 listed an Intensity Extreme playback issue fix for Premiere Pro.)

Thank you,

Tony

[salvo34]

that stuff gets complicated for me too. I have slightly more powerful computer for editing ( under a dust cover now ) and it's win 10. I have cs6 creative suite (boxed) and resolve 15. I have 2 monitors ( eiso primary, HP junk secondary.. both out of graphic card Nvidia DVI ). I also have the same BM card you have in a 16X PCI slot with the SDI out connected to a pro video monitor. So, I have three screens. The one I use as reference is the video one. ( rec 709 2.4 basically ).

I found that they are totally different things. The graphics card puts out it's signal and the card put out it's own signal independent of the graphics card. They are NOT IN ANY way joined together.

PPro can't do that and resolve can't do that... the little application from BM for a monitor is only for their own manufactured monitor... and has no influence on anything else.

I have my video monitor to accept full HD only and my edit program has proxy to full HD if I put 4K into it. I see the timeline on the video monitor that way. It should be noted that this video monitor was originally used on movies and commercials years ago ( playback on set ) and was ONLY good for full HD. It's not 4k.

You have some controls on the SDI monitor ???   Can you go through the menu system and see if you can figure this out ?

OR.....

Can you proxy stuff to what that monitor can display properly ???

Is an interesting problem and thanks for posting this... I'm also interested in how you solve it.

🙂

[TonySal2]

Hi Salvo34,

The issue is not with my HD-SDI monitor as it will works perfectly with a HD camera feed or output from Resolve.

As long as I am feeding an HD-SDI signal to the monitor at native 1920 x 1080 resolution or downscaled from 4K UHD the monitor will not have an issue displaying the signal.  

Most professional HD-SDI monitors can be set to display the incoming source resolution and frame rate which is useful to determine what specific resolutions and frame rates the monitor can display or not.  In this case the primary issue is with Premiere Pro 2020 not properly descaling the 4K UHD source material which is greater than 1920 x 1080 when output from the source panel.

I am able to compare the same footage in both Premiere Pro 2020 and Resolve 15.3.1 to confirm Resolve has absolutely no problem whereas Premiere Pro does.

I will keep you updated if I discover or hear of a solution.

Thanks for you input.

[salvo34]

yes, please let me know what happens if you can... as I'm curious. I only have cs6 which can't take my braw stuff ( 4k ) and probably not even prores.

[salvo34]

I hope this doesn't distract you and so on.. 

If I remember right ( my edit computer stuff is under dust cover now so I can't check this out ), to use cs6 with decklink I had to start the project using the settings under 'Blackmagic' selection. Then I would have to go through all the other settings ( including playback ) for it to work with full HD stuff, years ago.

hehe, probably no bearing on what you have going on.

duh

: )

[salvo34]

pps... if I remember right there was an sd card the came with the decklink... with software on it.. but it sucked and I had to get the update from their website ... wasn't easy getting that software loaded right for some reason.

[R Neil Haugen]

I'm monitoring this as I've been considering one of those cards also ... hoping that someone has a useful suggestion.

Neil

[salvo34]

Neil, if you get card this might help...save it. There's NO markings on the product about what is what.. and I found this on the blackmagic website, but it was hard to find.

[logan_mcnay]

Hey Tony have you found any solutions to this? I have the same issues.  

[TonySal2]

Hello Logan,

Sorry to say I did not find a solution.  Very disappointed to say Adobe online tech support is non existent compared to Blackmagic Designs which does respond.   I did discover other BM cards may not have the same problem and might be worth testing out.  I find working in Davinci Resolve exclusively to be a major advantage with mixed resolution clips and viewing output compared to Premiere Pro.

[logan_mcnay]

Thanks for the reply, that's too bad, Adobe can be quite frustrating in that regard, I think I'll be returning my Decklink card 

[TonySal2]

Logan,  

 Before you return your Decklink card consider testing out the free version of Davinci Resolve. Which Decklink model are you using?

Below is the answer I received from Blackmagic tech support regarding Premiere Pro not outputting from source panel w/ Blackmagic Decklink SDI 4K.

"Premiere pro will not downscale because our card reports the ability to output the UHD and UHD 4K to the host. If you had a UHD/4K monitor connected then you would see the image. As far as I am aware premiere pro does not shape the output from the Source viewer to the format of the timeline, and such output is always at the format of the original source footage scaled down to the ability of the card.

If you had HD only Blackmagic Design I/O device, then you would see the image as it would be scaled down to the HD raster, it is the highest supported resolution of the device.

In your case, consider using a classic approach of a string-out timeline/master footage timeline. This way you are able to review the footage before adding it to your working timeline.

Resolve and AVID perform internal scaling, based of the output settings before sending it to the I/O device."

[logan_mcnay]

Thank you,  

I'm using the decklink mini monitor 4k with my 1080p flanders DM241. I have the same issue of being able to see 1080p footage but any UHD footage shows "no signal" through SDI, & I also see it stretches compositions in timelines that aren't 16:9 like on open gate alexa mini footage or anamorphic footage.  I can see it works on Davinci which is good, although I use AE & PrPro mostly with compositing. I'd be willing to upgrade to a different card or Ultra studio 4k mini if I knew it would perform correctly downscaling footage to accurately display what the timeline shows

[TonySal2]

I now own a Ultrastudio 4K Mini but I cancelled my Premiere Pro subscription.  I will try to test out the Ultrastudio 4K Mini on a client workstation which has a current subscription to PPro.  I will get back to you with an update.  

[logan_mcnay]

Wow thank you, I appreciate it