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Pat_Garret
Participating Frequently
February 26, 2021
Answered

Widescreen Footage on external 16:9 monitor always shows up distorted

  • February 26, 2021
  • 11 replies
  • 6190 views

Hi there,

can't image that I'm the only one with this question but still could not find any posts regarding this issue.

 

I'm using Premiere for years now and until totay could not find any solution for the following problem:

Working with widescreen footage (RED,...) and editing it into a 16:9 sequence the video is correctly displayed on my external 16:9-reference monitor connected via Black Magic Ultra Studio Express.

 

But when opened in the Viewer window, the widescreen clip is always displayed distorted on the external display,

ALLTHOUGH Scale-Down-option within Premiere is activated in Preferences/Playback/Blackmagic Design Setup.

 

Avid offers the option, to add letterboxes to widesreen clips so that they are displayed correctly on an external 16:9 screen.

 

Any ideas? Thanks a lot!

 

Christoph

 

This topic has been closed for replies.
Correct answer Warren Heaton

Hi Pat/Christoph:

 

Here's an approach that's worked for me in the past:

  1. Create a 1:78 Sequence for your 2:35 source footage that conforms to a frame size supported your Blackmagic hardware.  Name the Sequence something like projectname_year-month-day_000 (I use "000" to indicate that the Sequence is for viewing rather than assembly).  For example, "cosmos_2021-03-17_000".
  2. Add all of your 2:35 source footage to this 1:78 Sequence and scale it to fit the width.
  3. Create a second 1:78 Sequence for your assmembly.   Name it projectname_year-month-day_001 for version one of your edit.  For example, "cosmos_2021-03-17_001".
  4. Open Sequence "cosmos_2021-03-17_000" in the Source Monitor (right-click and choose Open in Source Monitor or drag and drop from the Project tab to the Source tab).
  5. Open Sequence "cosmos_2021-03-17_001" in the Timeline (doule-click or right-click and choose Open in Timeline).
  6. In the Timeline, set the "Insert or overwrite sequence as nests or individual clips" button to individual clips (it should be light gray instead of blue).
  7. Place In Marks and Out Marks in your Source Monitor as you might normaly and then use Insert or Overwrite to add the souce footage in the 000 Sequence to the 001 Seequence (it won't next as long as "individual clips" is set).  You can still use Up Arrow and Down Arrow in the Source Monitor to jump to Previous Edit or Next Edit to find the Media Start and Media End of your source clips in your 000 Sequence.

 

It's not ideal, but it works to keep your 2:35 footage letterboxed on the reference monitor connected to your Blackmagic hardware.  If you use Match Frame (f) from the 001 Sequence, you'll bring up the source clip in the Source Monitor and you'll have to swtich back to having the 000 Sequence in the Source Monitor at some point.

 

When you lock picture, let's say Sequence "cosmos_2021-10-12_127", you can go to the Sequence Settings and change it from your 16:9 frame size to your 2:35 frame size for finishing. maybe nesting the 2:35 127 Sequence into another 16:9 Sequence for viewing on the Blackmagic hardware as you color correct or do other finishing tasks, maybe called "cosmos_2021-10-12_127_for_BM".

 

I hope this makes sense.

 

 

 

-Warren

11 replies

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Richard23394131sqn1
Inspiring
October 7, 2022

I have an Ultrastudio monitor and can confirm that adobe premiere/black magic cannot send a simple 16:9 scale of 3840 x 2160 down to 1920 x 1080 to a Flanders Scientific CM170 broadcast monitor. This is a simple half resolution down scaling. Either Premiere or Black Magic changes it to a 2K output (which the FSI reads and displays) but it is stretched out 2k is 2048 x 1080. When I go to the BM video setup and change the output to 1920 x 1080, no matter what flavor, it always reverts to 2K after playing back from Premiere Pro. BM UltraStudio appears to be doing whatever Premiere tells it and the FSI reports the same thing. Someone at Adobe likes 2k over regular 1080 and they just left it in there as the default display for Transmit. PITA.  I wonder if it's the same person who decided to make the proxy presets 2k as well. You're just driving us over to Resolve, Adobe. This is only happening on downscaling with the BM box. Regular 1080 looks fine. Can't just give us a half scaled image?

Warren Heaton
Community Expert
Warren HeatonCommunity ExpertCorrect answer
Community Expert
March 17, 2021

Hi Pat/Christoph:

 

Here's an approach that's worked for me in the past:

  1. Create a 1:78 Sequence for your 2:35 source footage that conforms to a frame size supported your Blackmagic hardware.  Name the Sequence something like projectname_year-month-day_000 (I use "000" to indicate that the Sequence is for viewing rather than assembly).  For example, "cosmos_2021-03-17_000".
  2. Add all of your 2:35 source footage to this 1:78 Sequence and scale it to fit the width.
  3. Create a second 1:78 Sequence for your assmembly.   Name it projectname_year-month-day_001 for version one of your edit.  For example, "cosmos_2021-03-17_001".
  4. Open Sequence "cosmos_2021-03-17_000" in the Source Monitor (right-click and choose Open in Source Monitor or drag and drop from the Project tab to the Source tab).
  5. Open Sequence "cosmos_2021-03-17_001" in the Timeline (doule-click or right-click and choose Open in Timeline).
  6. In the Timeline, set the "Insert or overwrite sequence as nests or individual clips" button to individual clips (it should be light gray instead of blue).
  7. Place In Marks and Out Marks in your Source Monitor as you might normaly and then use Insert or Overwrite to add the souce footage in the 000 Sequence to the 001 Seequence (it won't next as long as "individual clips" is set).  You can still use Up Arrow and Down Arrow in the Source Monitor to jump to Previous Edit or Next Edit to find the Media Start and Media End of your source clips in your 000 Sequence.

 

It's not ideal, but it works to keep your 2:35 footage letterboxed on the reference monitor connected to your Blackmagic hardware.  If you use Match Frame (f) from the 001 Sequence, you'll bring up the source clip in the Source Monitor and you'll have to swtich back to having the 000 Sequence in the Source Monitor at some point.

 

When you lock picture, let's say Sequence "cosmos_2021-10-12_127", you can go to the Sequence Settings and change it from your 16:9 frame size to your 2:35 frame size for finishing. maybe nesting the 2:35 127 Sequence into another 16:9 Sequence for viewing on the Blackmagic hardware as you color correct or do other finishing tasks, maybe called "cosmos_2021-10-12_127_for_BM".

 

I hope this makes sense.

 

 

 

-Warren

S
salvo34
Inspiring
March 15, 2021

Warren, thanks for breath of fresh air, but I wish people wouldn't bury messages into sub sections... and just add to the end of the thread. But who cares...I'm outta here as my head will explode soon.

The poster died and will never come back and doesn't know how to uncheck scale down in BM control and nobody knows what the heck is going on here... so I'm gonna walk the dog in the snow...and wish you all luck.

 

hehe,..

 

S
salvo34
Inspiring
March 15, 2021

there's something wrong with this forum cause I get messages way later than BEFORE I reply to what I see when I read the forum... another words, the continuity of messages ( posts) is totally screwed up.

Anyway, Andy, just so you know.. I grew up in film biz and despite criticism today I will love you with all my heart tomorrow !  See you on the red carpet !

🙂

 

A
Andy 1968
Inspiring
March 18, 2021

Salvo34,

This forum should list who the responses are for automaticaly. It would make things less confusing.

S
salvo34
Inspiring
March 14, 2021

SC. 30

INT / DAY

CONTROL TO ROVER

Tight clean single

 

ROBODOG

                               Houston to Mars Rover, do you read me ?

                   (Static, no response)

S
salvo34
Inspiring
March 14, 2021

Andy, I wish I was as smart as you are....

This is what I got for hero video 1080 monitor

 

BM DECKLINK 4K FOR PCI

Video Output Connectors 1 x BNC (6G-SDI)

Output Video Format SDI (10-Bit 4:4:4/4:2:2)
PAL (768 x 576): 50 fps
NTSC: 59.94 fps
720p: 50/59.94/60 fps
1080p: 23.98/24/25/30/50/59.94/60 fps
1080PsF: 23.98/24/25/29.97/30 fps
1080i: 50/59.94/60 fps
UHD 4K: 23.98/24/25/29.97/30 fps
DCI 4K: 23.98/24/25 fps
DCI 2K: 23.98/24/25 fps

 

does that mean I can't ever edit anamorphic using resolve or Ppro and see letterbox correctly for 2.4:1 ??

 

 

 

 

 

 

P
Pat_GarretAuthor
Participating Frequently
March 15, 2021

That is my question!

 

In fact it is possible to scale down the widescreen footage within Avid to get a letterboxed signal out of it. And Resolve automatically provides this process. Only Premiere and Final Cut seem to be unable to send a letterboxed signal when files are opened within Source monitor.

A
Andy 1968
Inspiring
March 15, 2021

The BMD products to do not letter box and pillar box odd aspect rations. The Avid might do it through software. I wish Premiere Pro had that option. That being said can you post an image of Avid and DR doing a proper letter box?

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salvo34
Inspiring
March 13, 2021

I'm still mystified.... when you say your source is scope footage, what do you mean ? I never heard that before....do you have some kind of more descriptive stuff to say what your source footage is ??

 

I googled some stuff. Think I got it figured out a little bit.

when you say scope ( or scopie ) you mean cinemascope, or anamorphic, and it's 2.4:1 aspect ratio ( not 16:9 ). That 2.4:1 could include other ratios, like 1.39:1 etc or whatever ...but who cares exactly what you have as source as I am not personally troubled.

 

An associate ( aquaintance ) was shooting god friended me anamorphic with alexa cameras for the sole purpose of getting the horizontal flare 'look' for artistic reasons ( made popular via some famous star trek director or somthing ). production and cbs didn't want to broadcast letterboxed so post lopped off the sides on export for broadcast. Here's a sample flare barely visible near chin.

 

 

With pro cameras there are safety frames ( lines in viewfinder and so on ) for full hd and so on, so you can keep stuff out of frame when lighting and stuff ( lots of stuff just outside of frame you see on TV or movie screen ).  So they just lopped off the sides and no letterbox on TV.

 

What is the purpose of shooting anamorphic for you ?  It apparently isn't working right so why bother ?

 

 

P
Pat_GarretAuthor
Participating Frequently
March 15, 2021

Many of the common professional cameras (for instance RED) deliver so called widescreen footage, which means that their native aspect ration is not 16:9 but 1:2,39, 1:2,4, etc.

A
Andy 1968
Inspiring
March 15, 2021

My video demonstrates how to get a letter box effects when using Premiere Pro with 21:9 video on a 16:9 monitor. I highly recommend you watch my video agian becuase  my video was made for someoe just like you. I repeat my video was made for you  :  )

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salvo34
Inspiring
March 12, 2021

I'm still mystified.... when you say your source is scope footage, what do you mean ? I never heard that before....do you have some kind of more descriptive stuff to say what your source footage is ??

 

S
salvo34
Inspiring
February 26, 2021

the one thing confusing me a little is the word 'viewer' and then 'external monitor'...I have 3 with only the full image from bm card on hero video monitor. There is no program UI on the video... just vitc and full image. On my primary from nvidia I have a source monitor and a program monitor.  even with calibrated eizo primary those colors and tones are slightly different than the hero, which is why I use the hero.

 

In your case I get the impression you only have ONE monitor and when you see source footage in the source window it looks one way and when you look at program window that's where you see the distortion...  but like I said, it's just trying to wrap my head around what viewer and external monitor mean vs. what the UI is showing you, etc.

 

 

P
Pat_GarretAuthor
Participating Frequently
March 12, 2021

Thanks a lot for your replies!

 

The video above unfortunately only deals with the problem when working within a timeline.

But thats not the case! Scope footage put to my HD 16-9-timeline is correctly dsplayed on my reference monitor.

 

My problem is, that I want to see the Scope footage that I open in the Source / Viewer Window in Premiere Pro

is also correctly displayed on my external reference display (connected via Blackmagic Ultra Studio Express).

 

You know what I mean?

A
Andy 1968
Inspiring
March 13, 2021

Exactly - but the source footage is SCOPE.


I aleady told you the Blackmagic Design products only work with broadcast compliant aspect ratios, frame rates and resolutions. It cannot letter box 21:9 on to a 16:9 monitor correctly. You cannot make use of an adjustment layer with cropping filtes when playing 21:9 aspect ratios in the souce monitor of Premiere Pro. Things will look OK in the source monitor if you output to 21:9 monitor using the BMD products. The BMD products do not compensate for odd aspect ratios. It is that simple.

S
salvo34
Inspiring
February 26, 2021

that's a lot better info. thanks. Unfortunately someone else will have to chime in on this cause some use mac and many format sources, monitor setups, etc.

I assume you already did the obvious ( uncheck scale in your bm playback settings to let the software do the job instead .... might be the card is trying to fill the hd screen ( opposite of what you want ) ??

I only use cs6 and resolve, and pc with bm card in pci slot of mobo... so I'm no good for you.

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