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Participant
May 8, 2013
Question

Quark and Corel make a comeback

  • May 8, 2013
  • 9 replies
  • 25118 views

Having purchased and used Adobe products in our creative agencies for almost 20 years, I cannot emphasize how incensed the CC only model makes me. Yes, I know that CS6 is still available, but I guarantee that once the storm over CC has settled that too will go the way of the dinosaur - call me cynical but I have a feeling it has only been retained temporarily to provide the forum staff something to quote in an attempt to appease the rightly infuriated masses.

The creative cloud software and delivery system is buggy and glitchy - just check the other Adobe forums - we cannot have 'downtime' where our software does not or will not function due to logins / incessant updates / accessibility.

The cost for 'leasing' access to the Adobe software is considerably higher in the long run - $X per month forever and never own anything, rather than $X as a one time cost of ownership and a reduced cost upgrade path.

You can guarantee that the price will increase once 'box' versions are no longer available / updated / supported and the masses have been forced to convert. Especially as the longest 'pre-pay' term is currently only 12 months.

Many people do not need all access to all of Adobe's software applications, which is why they offered various versions of the Creative Suite in the first place.

We do not need cloud services, we work with massive files, have multiple backups - and have remote file access where necessary - the last thing we need is CC monopolizing our available bandwidth.

In other words, we will not go the way of the cloud.

Adobe have always made great software, but the CC business model may yet bite back.  At one point in time QuarkXpress was No.1 and all but unassailable - and then due to reknowned poor service and an overwhelmingly arrogant attitude to its customers they suffered huge market share losses to InDesign.

History repeating?

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    9 replies

    Axiom DeSigns
    Participating Frequently
    September 27, 2013

    After caving in and subscribing to CS6 I thought it wouldn't be too bad having access to "state of the art" Adobe offerings.

    Then came CC and though I was a bit excited for more 64bit goodness, it ended there.

    The CC versions are glitchy, inaccurate, and features I used regularly were removed sequentially from each app with each update.
    Dreamweaver CC, Bridge CC, discontinuation of Fireworks, four Edge apps for cookie cutter designing (which don't even come close to Dreamweaver's capabilities)

    But thankfully, Aptana was a good free replacement though - albiet no "live preview" but hey Dreamweaver CC wsiwyg wasn't too great anyway, so whatev's.


    No consistency between interfaces, no ability to change font or icon sizing (for all apps - "some" doesn't count - and only "acommodates" retina, not "any size"), removal after removal of features, and tighter and tighter integration into cloud based privacy invading "features" that have nothing to do with production work flows


    Photoshop does video? What? Lightroom can't be shared - and does video? What?
    Bridge can't do exports? Illustrator STILL only has 220" max document sizes?

    Illustrator STILL has no document recovery?

    Ai CC crashes so much that it would have been nice to not have to start over - and the weak reply from Staff and FanBoys of manual or auto save every few minutes - no really?

    I'm stupid and never thought of that, but it kills your undo's and do you only make a document change every two minutes?
    When you're flying through a design "on a roll" you can make dozens of changes in two minutes and "BOOP" crash at 1:58.

    So it turns out "bleeding edge" software offerings is stupid. So Okay, I'll wait a month and THEN update.. but wait, why am I paying monthly again?

    Oh right, it's for the "benefit" of constantly new software. But now the onus is on me to check the forums for issues and problems with every update right? But I have to wait a month for other poor subscribers to be our live production - and yet - beta testers. Harsh.

    So...
    Aptana is a great replacement for dreamweaver gurus who require php and asp and mysql and and and and - but don't require wysiwyg

    oh wait, it's free and uses 1/5th of the resources.

    Turns out windows Explorer (or the Finder) work as well as Bridge CC does, and actually the built in OS has more features.

    Lightroom 4.4 I may keep since it's still offered as a box product with a standard license.


    Does anyone really even understand just what the hell like a million apps of "edge" is for?"
    Chripes, make it all one app already - oh wait, you did, dreamweaver, but uh, Okay.

    Ps, AI, are getting replaced with Corel, I'm just working through the learning curve. (i like that i can customize the interface on any resolution monitor - and it uses native windows protocols that adobe in other threads says it simply cannot do?) - and document sizes are "unlimited" - it renders significantly faster than Ai, and PS.
    Did I mention you can own it?

    and Indesign? Yup, working with Quark 10 now and it's pretty nifty. Does everything I need - just have to verify if it can do data importing.

    Did I mention you can own it?

    Count the days Adobe, after 20 years or being an Adobe slave, and knuckling under your consistent removal of everything I need to have a smooth workflow, my purchase and rental of your garbage is numbered.

    I'm sick of paying more for less, getting buggy updates, being held hostage by a softwware company, and getting more and more features of fluff that have nothing to do with core quality and efficiency. It's bizare that you soak resources to reinvent the wheels you already have instead of making them better, faster...

    Adobe,

    You used to be so very awesome. You essentially killed your competition.
    Then you became jerks to everyone, and now you're at the as*hole level.

    And guess what?
    Your competition lives, and is gaining market share - and me.
    So good luck with Edge, and FrankenShop.

    I so very badly want a refund. But thanks to your new model - I have nothing to refund.
    I wish I could run my business like that - but then again, if I did?
    I'd have no clients.

    Xeon64
    Known Participant
    September 27, 2013

    Microsoft thought they were too big to fail as well. Look at them now. Scrambling to stay alive in the personal consumer market place. Do not even try to work with Text in Photoshop CC. It is so buggy it will have your tearing your hairout and these bugs have been there Since CS6.

    becusaAuthor
    Participant
    October 30, 2013

    MycCoalescence wrote:


    Both imediatlys said it was so adobe could make more money.

    Well, we certainly wouldn't want any company to make money.  That would just be wrong.

    -Noel


    I have no problem with a company making money - I do have a problem paying so much more for a less secure, less stable, inferior product sold by a opportunistic monopoly who are leveraging their customers safe in the knowledge that they have few alternatives.

    Surprised at a few of the somewhat snarky comments on here.

    Participant
    May 31, 2013

    I upgraded Quark 6.5 to version 9 a year ago in anticipation of where a Adobe was headed, as a backup. You can upgrade any version of Quark from version 3 onwards for a limited time for sum of $279.20… and version 10… all new from the ground up is just around the corner!

    http://shop.quark.com/pa/p-6-quarkxpress-9-pacific-asia-and-africa-edition.aspx

    Participant
    June 10, 2013

    Can anyone tell me... is the new QuarkXP supported by the Macbook Pro "retina display"? Anyone know?

    Participant
    June 10, 2013

    System requirements here: http://forums.quark.com/t/21811.aspx

    May 16, 2013

    THE COREL TEST

    STEP 1: COLOR MANAGEMENT in Parallels Win7 on Mac

    So maybe Corel-Suite is an option.

    Therefore I have to know if my Mac color management will work in Parallels Desktop with Windows 7.

    Dual screen in fullscreen mode is also a requirement.

    And guess what?

    IT WORKS LIKE A CHARM

    after 15 minutes of trying.

    My hardware calibrated NEC LCD2690 shows exactly the same perfect print colors in Win7 and OS X simultaneously in fullscreen and coherence mode.

    full size: http://s1.directupload.net/images/130516/glpkjvmj.jpg

    Ready for

    Step 2: Testing if Corel can establish a professional print publishing workflow.

    Maybe in two to three weeks I will test that :-)

    Silvercat22
    Participating Frequently
    May 14, 2013

    I've been an Adobe customer since the 1980's and I have been upgrading every year or two since then.

    But I refuse to work with the Cloud...   and the latest announcement re offering future updates to Creative Suite only via the Cloud/subscription model has got me considering jumping ship...  Adobe has me backed into a corner, so I'm seriously considering going back to Quark XPress and/or other alternatives.

    Adobe seems to disregard loyal customer's workflow and buying habits, and, in recent years has had TERRIBLE customer service.

    It feels like a business case sorta like JC Penney... looks like they might learn the hard way. I sure hope it doesn't come to that.

    Participating Frequently
    May 12, 2013

    Have been eyeing the Corel site many times since this Adobe nonsense. Looks like CorelDRAW Graphics Suite X6 might be my new friend.

    Participating Frequently
    May 10, 2013

    I've been a loyal customer since CS3 Master Collection and have upgraded every year. Adobe said mater of fact "change is painful." Let me tell you how disgusted I am with Adobe. I can't even stand the sight of their name and logo right now. I never thought I would hate a software company but I am thoroughly disgusted with Adobe. I am willing to buy substandard software than rent Adobe software.

    Inspiring
    May 9, 2013

    I always liked Corel's graphics suite.  I would have stayed with it, but I had to move to Adobe products for college since they were the industry standard.  I have upgraded all the software I use to CS6 and don't intend to upgrade after this because I figure perpetual software is on its way out.  The only Adobe software I would continue to upgrade is Acrobat.  Switching to CC is not an option for me because I don't profit from Adobe software and I'm not paying for software I don't own.  The same goes for Microsoft Office.  I'm still using the 2007 version and I plan to stay with it until it no longer works.

    Phillip M  Jones
    Inspiring
    May 9, 2013

    Check with MS. there model is different than Adobe's. You may have to pay more but for the forseeable future you can still get Office as a DVD or Download. And unlike Adobe Office365 is $99 per year not Month. That includes Word, Excel, PowerPoint and Outlook.  If I were you I would upgrade to 2013  that way you can go many years to come without the Rubber wearing of the tires.

    Participating Frequently
    May 9, 2013

    Philip - I agree with your point about $99/year.  While that would be more than what I typically pay for my Adobe Tax (usually upgrade about every 2 years, so arount $50/year I think), it would still be reasonable.  $240 per year for my Adobe Tax just doesn't seem worthwhile - and it's almost 5 times what I've been paying in the past.

    Xeon64
    Known Participant
    May 8, 2013

    Funny I just check to see of Corel and Quark are still around. Thank You Adobe for making me look at your former rivals who will soon be gaining market share again thanks to the CC. Anyone know a good replacement for Photoshop?

    Phillip M  Jones
    Inspiring
    May 9, 2013

    If you’re a PC user. ADC (formerly Deneba Software makes something)  Corel Probably does  but Mac is limited.

    OldBob1957
    Inspiring
    May 9, 2013

    Phillip Jones wrote:

    but Mac is limited.

    Not really. Mac has many options for running Windows software. Head over to the Corel forums (for just one example) and see how many users are running that "Windows only" software on  Mac systems. And quite successfully too. The software for doing so has come a long way in a few years.

    --OB

    Participating Frequently
    May 8, 2013

    You can already imagine what the future with this subscription only Adobe Creative Cloud aka The Adobe Price Gouging Smoke Screen has to offer: It goes like this. Adobe updates programs with a few new features (some totally useless) then decides these features warrant them raising the monthly fees by $5-10 every update cycle. Adobe has not guaranteed a maximum subscription fee limit it will charge on future updates in writing. It has only said $49.99/month in online quotes. Where is the guarantee in writing that this price will not increase?

    Phillip M  Jones
    Inspiring
    May 8, 2013

    But that is only for the first year its an introductory offer plus its doesn't say what that is for whether its for one or two items, or every creative suit application that exist.

    becusaAuthor
    Participant
    May 8, 2013

    If we don't make a noise, Adobe won't hear it.