Inspiring

Question

Boycott Creative Cloud?

Forum|Forum|12 years ago
May 7, 2013
43 replies
100438 views

If you haven't heard, CS6 is the last CS version. From now on, you have to rent your applications via the Creative Cloud. I don't like the new subscription model. I have bought every CS upgrade since version 1, but it looks like CS6 is the end for me, even if it means keeping an old computer around just to run CS6 applications.

Perhaps Adobe would change its mind in a few months if most everyone avoided signing up for the subscription. In any case, they've created a real opportunity for competitors.

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Ed.Macke

Inspiring

A couple of random thoughts:

After many years on the "Elements" versions, I finally saved my pennies to buy the real deal Production Premium CS6. Just a couple of months after I did, they pulled this Cloud stunt - my luck never works out like that! Usually I'd be the schmoe who saves up enough to buy it only to have Adobe say "Buy? Did you mean 'Rent'?"
If Adobe is going to send me a monthly bill for a monopoly product that they'll shut off when I don't pay, shouldn't they be regulated like other utility companies?
Do you remember years ago when the brilliant minds at Coke said "hey, since we've got the single-best selling beverage in the history of the planet, you know what would be a good idea...New Coke! It's kind of the same as Old Coke, except for the fact that people don't really like it. But no matter, you know what would be an even better idea? Let's stop making the Old Coke! Ha! We'll all be rich!!". Just sayin'... were the Adobe folks all sleeping the day they went over that Case Study Of Corporate Stupidity in their business classes?
I like learning new things, so I suppose one silver lining with the Cloud model is every few months I will have the opportunity to re-learn something with the new version!
To the poster who said instead of "Photoshop CC" they should have called it "Photoshop FU"... ha! I want to have a beer with you!
I could definitely see a precedent being set where other software companies start salivating over Adobe's endless cash cow model. I kind of shudder at the thought of having to pay a monthly bill for all of the software I currently own. Maybe they could make it easier and we could just have our paychecks electronically transferred to a software clearinghouse to pay for all of our cloud subscriptions. I just wish they'd buy us dinner first, if you know what I mean...

Having said all that, I'm not entirely opposed to a cloud subscription. In terms of value, to pay $50/month for essentially the Master Collection doesn't seem that awful when you compare it to my freaking $250/month cell phone bill that gives me access to Google maps and Angry Birds. Of course, I'd only be paying the $20/month because I didn't have kids just to mow the lawn, I also had them so I could get Academic Pricing.

Mike_Ornellas

Participating Frequently

Good points -

You may want to read this.

http://www.clarkstonconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/a-tangled-web.pdf

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uhanepono

Participating Frequently

So. From reading your linked article I garner that ..... there is a future where a version of the "internet" itself becomes a "gated community" where one must pay to enter and remain, loosing access once one leave the gate,

Those locked out will not linger at the gate long, begging to get in. They will move on to create the next new innovative, creative environment.

Corporate thinking finds the "rent" model attractive. It helps them maintain hegemony by limiting choice. Beaurocrats may find it fatefully inevitable; one more thing they must abide by. But the end user always has the final say. The same phenom (of customers creating choice where it is felt lacking) will innevitably follow. It is in the nature of change itself.

Mike Ornellas wrote:

Good points -
You may want to read this.
http://www.clarkstonconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/a-tangle d-web.pdf

M

msqrddd

Participant

No sane (or, rather, competent) business owner would sign a contractual agreement for a service that has this in its Terms of Service:

6. Use of Service and Materials

[...]

6.4 Adobe may modify or discontinue, temporarily or permanently, the Services or Materials, or any portion thereof, with or without notice. You agree that Adobe shall not be liable to you or anyone else if we do so.

This reminds me of the "HumancentIpad" episode of South Park: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZ23kosLFec

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Greg_Bohn

Participating Frequently

It's amazing what many companies have in their click-through "user agreements". Some are outrageous. I believe one had a purposely outrageous section saying you gave them your soul to see if anyone noticed...

But if you really read them, you have to wonder what they plan on doing to require your acceptance of such outrageous terms.

Looking at my Cell phone contract I think it basically said that I agreed that (in effect) if one of their salespersons purposely beat me to within an inch of my life with my cell phone, they were only obligated to pay at most $25.00 in compensation .

It really has sections that explicitly say that I agree not to hold them responsible for willful fraud on their part.

It seems in many cases they hope you'll just agree to anything they put in front of you, expecially if you have little choice. It's only later that they come to harvest your organs... .

Z

zippity do da

Participating Frequently

It really has sections that explicitly say that I agree not to hold them responsible for willful fraud on their part.

Well if you dont like the phone and they are beating you up get a new phone. Where do we get a new photoshop?

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vh_5150

Participant

If Adobe wants us to believe, or if in fact it is true, that there are all of these thousands of users already on board the Creative Cloud, then their revenue stream is already beyond belief. Therefore, the Creative Cloud subscription, if Adobe will not go back on it, is reasonable ONLY if the price for the suite of products drops dramatically. Here is what could be considered reasonable, given if what Adobe says is true about its user base: Offer the entire suite of products (as in the CS6 Master Collection) for a flat $199/year fee. Yes, that's right—$199. That, Adobe, I would go for. Until then, you have alienated scores of users and corrupted yourself.

I would also argue that it would be fair to offer a perpetual license for what would be, say, every second-to-third version or so of what would be a traditional new release. However, since there is no such thing anymore as the applications are updated so regularly through the Cloud, there would have to be a determination as to what constitutes a new version release. Perhaps every 2 years? Why not keep offering the download with perpetual license with the option to upgrade your perpetual license say, 2 years after the users' install date?

Bottom line, Adobe, there are fair ways to go about doing business.

BKKDon

Inspiring

Hi,

The question here, as a photographer, is do we want Adobe to restrict access to our creative efforts .... yes we may well use Lightroom and Photoshop to finalise the creations but the IP is ours.

If we have to use the CC at some point in time our subscription runs out and we have no access to our finished product in order to edit and change unless we renew the subscription. Part of this has been bought about by the fact that Adobe is subject to massive piracy of software ... but, especially on windows this is their own fault as if you have access to a legitimate ID you can redirect the HOSTS file to a the localhost and never have your serial checked.

This is ADOBE's problem and won't be solved by the CC! And there are many professionals whose advice on this forum is undeniably so valuable to us who simply use the features to improve our photography in the digital darkroom ... but they also make a living from addons to Photoshop so there is a general trend towards saying there should be a photographers suite in the CC.

There is NO WAY WE WANT A PHOTOGRAPHERS SUITE/PRICING in the CC ... we want to control our own IP not to have it "owned" by Adobe.

Might I remind Adobe of a statement using their words:

“We believe in fighting piracy of software by making the right software for the right people at the right price,” said Adobe’s David Wadhwani.

Well Adobe LISTEN! And remember these words ... get your security right and give us what we want ... the right to choose our own destiny because, mark my words, another software developer will step into the breach.

Remember we know, from various people who develop addins for PSE like Elements XXL, that you can provide what we need and turn off the bloatware.

Regards, Don

_

__paul123

Participant

I do aggree but who exactly would the competitors be? I have not found anything that eorks as well as Photoshop. So sad.

Paul

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uhanepono

Participating Frequently

Who indeed, Paul. The future looks bright for open source development if the big corps keep playing us so. Ubuntu and gimp are not as well developed as, say, OSX or adobe for the simple reason that more people use OSX and adobe. If ubuntu and gimp had more users, albeit casual ones at first, and therefore, more developers, there would be more development in those areas and that would be open source development, not corporate. It should not be a question of what is available "now". If we stay with that thinking we will be shortchanging our tech environment's futures. I will say it again; Marx was right when he said the worker must own the means of producion to flourish creatively (paraphrase). All else is fuedalism. The age of corporate capitol is past it's peak. This desperate act of total control of those means of production only proves that. Developments are ALWAYS happening in all directions, not only with adobe (whose most recent "Upgrades" don't impress me anyway and are available via 3rd party plugins and other apps that open PSDs, tiffs and other formats and shake is adressed with new stabalizing lenses). There are already apps that do a much better job on some tasks than adobe. I only know about ps related tasks so, in farness, I can't say that across the whole suite. Anyway. It is important to keep this dialog going and getting as many as will out from under these fatalistic, depressive and victimized feelings and into a more positive and inventive mood so that, no matter what adbe (sic) does or not, creatives and casuals WILL OWN highly developed and awesome tools that assist them in making brillaint and breathtaking works of wonder. This is the moment to inovate, not capitulate! Worker rule is NOT dead!

#$paul123 wrote:
I do aggree but who exactly would the competitors be? I have not found anything that eorks as well as Photoshop. So sad.
Paul

Hudechrome

Known Participant

My answer:

Ignoramus

Illegitimate

noncarborundum

justintk

Participant

Personally, I see two types of customers who are going to benefit from the CC. People who use an Adobe program every day and students who only need it for a few months while in school. If you did update to EVERY version of CS, then it's still going to benefit you. Even at normal rates, it's more affordable, and more attainable than ever. Like they said, "It’s less than a cup of coffee a day." As a college employee, I'm in a good spot. The thing that really sucks is that it's a monthly bank account leach.

So in conclusion, I don’t believe the CC is going to fail. I like everything it has to offer. Though for a monthly fee, I really wish the starting rate for the whole CC was $20 a month, not $40. And that Teacher/student rates where $10 a month.

C

charles badland

Inspiring

...students who only need it for a few months while in school.

Actually art/design students had it much better off with the CS perpetual model. They could buy the software to install on their personal computer at an extreme discount off retail. And it had no restrictions on use (other than selling an Academic license) So, once out of school that could keep using the academically priced suite to make commercial work as long as they wanted. AND they could use their their academic license to upgrade to the next CS version. A sweet deal.

Now with CC, students after graduation will have to start paying the standard CC subscription fee.

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uhanepono

Participating Frequently

This is a repost-

Here is a very interesting link to a blog on tumblr about adobe boycott

http://adobe2014.tumblr.com/

I guess adobe is gambling on a certain amount of subs. in 6 months (5 now) to meet some goal that says "see? good, no?" to someone in finance-landia they need to influence. So if we can hold off for 6 months and choke that revenue stream till then. We might get them to realize who butters the the bread.

So boycott ahoy!

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dave_keller

Participant

Dear Adobe,

I have used, promoted and yes, even loved your products over the years. I am sorry that you are forcing our divorce. I have not yet found my new love, and unfortunately I will probably always compare her to you, But I can't continue my relationship with someone who has forgotten a relationship takes two.

Dave

M

mzocoh

Participating Frequently

This is not an isolated issue. By changing to this deplorable subscription model, Adobe is setting a precedent. If we accept this move, we should also be prepared to rent every other piece of software we hope to use, and eventually our OS, whatever it may be. We need to contest this in a big way. I will NEVER rent software, as a matter of principle. The so called "cloud" is a storm cloud and our computing future is a dim one if we allow this. Yes, I do believe we should boycott & simply go on using CS6 until Adobe has no choice but to offer an in-the-box alternative.

Hudechrome

Known Participant

...or you have no choice because the new camera you just bought is not supported in CS6.

A photographers only version is to be highly desired.

A

Alan3984

Participant

I think all of you are nuts. You complain about the price, but now anyone can have PS for 20 bucks a month. You say you don't want to pay Adobe for the rest of your careers, but you already do that now. I think this will open the door for more users who can't afford the full cost, but would gladly pay a monthly fee. Go find another app. I've used PS since version 3, and I've never found anything to compare. So good luck finding something better.

station_two

Inspiring

Alan3984 wrote:
I think all of you are nuts…

Well, I think you are stupid. So, there!

A

Alan3984

Participant

Take your hands off your hips, and quit pouting. It makes you look silly.

Z

zippity do da

Participating Frequently

Im not on board with this forced creative cloud Adobe move. I cant say much more or any better than anyone else has posted.

Shame on you Adobe. Im sure that my scalding review will make them change there stance.

Not they dont care.

Trevor.Dennis

Community Expert

Noel is not the only one who thinks the CC is a good deal. Not only will it save me money, but it will give me access to other Adobe apps I can hardly wait to get my hands on. And that's without the added value like getting updates as they happen, without waiting to the next version to be released. There are alternatives to Photoshop if you ar prepared to learn a new app. Lightroom has the same RAW processing engine at a fraction of the cost. A Lightroom fanatic buddy of mine is now swearing by Photo Ninja for his RAW processing. He says it is noticably better thamt LR and ACR, but I have not tried it yet.

I wouldn't like to have to get my design apps piecemeal from different vendors, because of the huge advantage Dynamic Link gives you, and I am happy to pay $50/month for that convenience and power. Adobe are not going to change their minds, so what's the point of the endless whinging? Sighn up, stay with CS6, or look elsewhere. It ain't rocket scince.

Hey! I wonder if rocket scientists use Adobe products? Imagine how terrible it would be if they came to this forum making a fuss about CC, and you couldn't use the analogy from the last paragraph. Wow, I've gone all a quiver worrying in case it happens!

*Photonic

Known Participant

Trevor.Dennis wrote:
...A Lightroom fanatic buddy of mine is now swearing by Photo Ninja for his RAW processing. He says it is noticably better thamt LR and ACR, but I have not tried it yet.

Thanks Dennis. Just checked out Photo Ninja and it looks impressive as a "professional-grade" RAW processor. Lot's of positive feedback. And it's only in version 1.0.5 so far, with 1.1 coming out soon. These guys put out Noise Ninja several years ago which was the premier noise reduction app in the day. They are very innovative.

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erase-the-silence

Participant

I really hope Adobe changes their minds.
Not everyone is rich and can afford to spend so much money a year just to use a program.

I hate the idea of having to subscribe just to use a program and spend $20 a month...

I currently have Photoshop CS4 and I was saving up money to buy the upgrade for CS6, which would only cost me $200, and i went on here to buy it.. to find out i can't i have to spend $700 to buy the full program.. I was annoyed and I thought maybe they had a problem, so i talked to someone and they suggested the cloud. NO i don't want that. So i accepted the fact i have to buy the full program again... I just want to spend $700+ once to own the full program and not have to spend $20 a month just to use it.. I'm not a professional, so i can't afford that. I would love to be able to update CS6 when it becomes outdated.. but now I can't and I really do not like that. I tried using other programs and they are just not as great.

I get they're trying to stop people from stealing their program, but this is not going to work for the people that just want to buy the program once, and that is a huge population that cant' afford the Cloud thing.

U

uhanepono

Participating Frequently

YOU CAN still upgrade..!! really, truly.

http://www.adobe.com/products/catalog/cs6._sl_id-contentfilter_sl_cata log_sl_software_sl_creativesuite6.html?start=10

In the Photoshop CS6 row, click the Buy link
"I want to buy:", click on the dropdown menu and select Upgrade
"I own", click on the dropdown and select the relevant product which you already own
Follow the prompts from there to complete the purchase

erase-the-silence wrote:
....I currently have Photoshop CS4 and I was saving up money to buy the upgrade for CS6, which would only cost me $200, and i went on here to buy it.. to find out i can't i have to spend $700 to buy the full program.. I was annoyed and I thought maybe they had a problem, so i talked to someone and they suggested the cloud. NO i don't want that. So i accepted the fact i have to buy the full program again... I just want to spend $700+...

E

erase-the-silence

Participant

I can't, I have tried that so many times. I own CS4, it only goes to CS5, which I don't have. Otherwise I would have done that a while ago.

uhanepono wrote:
YOU CAN still upgrade..!! really, truly.
http://www.adobe.com/products/catalog/cs6._sl_id-contentfilter_sl_cata log_sl_software_sl_creativesuite6.html?start=10
In the Photoshop CS6 row, click the Buy link
"I want to buy:", click on the dropdown menu and select Upgrade
"I own", click on the dropdown and select the relevant product which you already own
Follow the prompts from there to complete the purchase
erase-the-silence wrote:
....I currently have Photoshop CS4 and I was saving up money to buy the upgrade for CS6, which would only cost me $200, and i went on here to buy it.. to find out i can't i have to spend $700 to buy the full program.. I was annoyed and I thought maybe they had a problem, so i talked to someone and they suggested the cloud. NO i don't want that. So i accepted the fact i have to buy the full program again... I just want to spend $700+...

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