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Participating Frequently
October 31, 2007
Question

Photoshop CS3 color management "Save for Web" problem

  • October 31, 2007
  • 680 replies
  • 62091 views
This problem is getting the best of me.......

After spending 3 full days researching this problem, I am no closer to finding an answer than when I started. I still cannot produce a usable image through the "Save for Web" feature of Photoshop CS3. I have read web page after web page of "Tips, Tricks and Recommendations" from dozens of experts, some from this forum, and still I have no solution... I am exhausted and frustrated to say the least. Here's the simple facts that I know at this point.

I have a web design project that was started in PS CS1. All artwork was created in photoshop and exported to JPG format by using "Save for Web". Every image displays correctly in these browsers (Safari, Camino, FireFox and even Internet Explorer on a PC).

I have recently upgraded to PS CS3 and now cannot get any newly JPG'd image to display correctly. My original settings in CS1 were of no concern to me at the time, because it always just worked, and so I do not know what they were. I have opened a few of my previous images in CS3 and found that sRGB-2.1 displays them more or less accurately. I am using sRGB 2.1 working space. Upon openning these previous image files, I get the "Missing Profile" message and of course I select "Leave as is. Do Not color manage". CS3 assumes sRGB-2.1 working space, opens the file, and all is well.

The problem is when I go to "Save for Web", the saturation goes up, and the colors change. The opposite of what most people are reporting. Here's another important point... new artwork created in CS3 does exactly the same thing, so it's not because of the older CS1 files.

I have tried every combination of "uncompensated color", "Convert to sRGB", "ICC Profile", etc. while saving. I have Converted to sRGB before saving, and my monitor is calibrated correctly.
I have tried setting the "Save for Web" page on 2-up and the "original" on the left is already color shifted before I even hit the "Save" button. Of course, the "Optimized" image on the right looks perfect because I am cheating by selecting the "Use Document Color Profile" item. Why do they even have this feature if doesn't work, or misleads you?

Does anyone have any ideas what could be happening here? Why is this all so screwed up?
CS1 worked fine out of the box.

Final note: I do have an image file I could send along that demonstrates how it is possible to display an image exactly the same in all 4 of the browsers I mentioned with no color differences. It is untagged RGB and somehow it just works.

I am very frustrated with all of this and any suggestions will be appreciated

Thanks,
Pete
    This topic has been closed for replies.

    680 replies

    November 28, 2007
    Lundberg, or others...can you shed some light on this question: If most monitors, including these Dells, are not capable of displaying Adobe RGB, what are we seeing when we take an sRGB image and assign Adobe RGB? (The colours get a boost.) I don't mean this as a challenge, it is a genuine question.
    Inspiring
    November 28, 2007
    I very much doubt that Dell has managed to achieve Adobe RGB. Unless their new monitors have three color LED lights, still very expensive.
    Could be, but I doubt it, and I think the author of that forum post is deluded. He needs to show the actual gamut.
    Participating Frequently
    November 28, 2007
    "Peter, you are saying that for CRT monitors. I never had a problem calibrating a CRT monitor to a match proof, and I did without any calibration device. LCD's are a different thing but I'm sure if you do it the right way there should be no problem. In the past I just worked in too many places doing pre press using their crappy monitors. "

    CRTs, LCDs, it doesn't make a difference really. Good hardware calibration combined with good profiles and viewing conditions will give you the screen to print match you're looking for. Of course, the hardware, both monitor and calibration device can make a difference, but there's no inherent reason that you won't have similar results on either type of monitor.
    Ramón G Castañeda
    Inspiring
    November 28, 2007
    Peter,

    If the file is untagged, the colors are meaningless numbers. In order for a color managed application to display the colors properly it has to be told what "language" the numbers are in so they can be interpreted correctly.

    To understand profiles, think of your image as text, and of the profile as a tag that indicates what language the text is in.

    If you see text that says GIFT, you need to know whether it's in English or in German. If in German, the word means "poison", if in English, it means a present.

    Other examples: ONCE means "eleven" in Spanish but "one time" in English.

    MOST means "Bridge" in Russian but "greatest in amount, extent, or degree" in English and "fruit juice" in German.

    If you change the language (profile) by ASSIGNING, you change the meaning of the text (appearance of the image). The numbers representing the colors in your image will remain the same, but the colors will change because the same numbers now mean something else (as the meaning of the text will change if you now read the same letters in a different language).

    CONVERTING to a profile will preserve the colors while the numbers change, in the same manner as the text will retain its meaning if you TRANSLATE it into a different language, changing the letters but preserving the meaning.

    If you don't tag an image file, it's bound to be misinterpreted. Period.
    Participating Frequently
    November 28, 2007
    Participating Frequently
    November 28, 2007
    Never Mind
    November 28, 2007

    "Try to get over to Luckenback while you're in Fredricksburg"

    I won't able to do that on this trip. I'm in charge of a bunch of WWII Vets in their 80's and 90's. They'll be wondering why we are taking a detour. I'll keep it in mind for the next time around :-)

    November 28, 2007

    "I'm not sure why this seems like such a special thing."

    Peter, you are saying that for CRT monitors. I never had a problem calibrating a CRT monitor to a match proof, and I did without any calibration device. LCD's are a different thing but I'm sure if you do it the right way there should be no problem. In the past I just worked in too many places doing pre press using their crappy monitors.

    Participating Frequently
    November 28, 2007
    "Tim... Kerrville, Texas. My wife had to fly there a few times last year for business meetings. I'll be in Fredricksburg on March 13th at the Nimitz museum for a plaque dedication. Nice little town... "

    Try to get over to Luckenback while you're in Fredricksburg. It was made famous by Willie Nelson and Jerry Jeff Walker. I photographed Robert Earl Keen there in '94 and had a blast tripping around the hill country between Bandera, San Marcos and Luckenbach. Definitely armadillo country...
    Participating Frequently
    November 28, 2007
    "Did someone say in an earlier post that their Dell 2407WFP was calibrated so that what you see on the monitor (CMYK Image) matched the the printed proof? I would never give up that monitor..."

    I'm not sure why this seems like such a special thing. I've been doing this for ten years now with hardware calibrated monitors starting with the venerable Radius Pressview combined with Linocolor CMYK profiles on through the Barco and Sony Artisan with custom ProfieMaker profiles. All you need to make this happen are good calibration, good profiles and good viewing conditions. It really is not hard to do.