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Participating Frequently
October 31, 2007
Question

Photoshop CS3 color management "Save for Web" problem

  • October 31, 2007
  • 680 replies
  • 62092 views
This problem is getting the best of me.......

After spending 3 full days researching this problem, I am no closer to finding an answer than when I started. I still cannot produce a usable image through the "Save for Web" feature of Photoshop CS3. I have read web page after web page of "Tips, Tricks and Recommendations" from dozens of experts, some from this forum, and still I have no solution... I am exhausted and frustrated to say the least. Here's the simple facts that I know at this point.

I have a web design project that was started in PS CS1. All artwork was created in photoshop and exported to JPG format by using "Save for Web". Every image displays correctly in these browsers (Safari, Camino, FireFox and even Internet Explorer on a PC).

I have recently upgraded to PS CS3 and now cannot get any newly JPG'd image to display correctly. My original settings in CS1 were of no concern to me at the time, because it always just worked, and so I do not know what they were. I have opened a few of my previous images in CS3 and found that sRGB-2.1 displays them more or less accurately. I am using sRGB 2.1 working space. Upon openning these previous image files, I get the "Missing Profile" message and of course I select "Leave as is. Do Not color manage". CS3 assumes sRGB-2.1 working space, opens the file, and all is well.

The problem is when I go to "Save for Web", the saturation goes up, and the colors change. The opposite of what most people are reporting. Here's another important point... new artwork created in CS3 does exactly the same thing, so it's not because of the older CS1 files.

I have tried every combination of "uncompensated color", "Convert to sRGB", "ICC Profile", etc. while saving. I have Converted to sRGB before saving, and my monitor is calibrated correctly.
I have tried setting the "Save for Web" page on 2-up and the "original" on the left is already color shifted before I even hit the "Save" button. Of course, the "Optimized" image on the right looks perfect because I am cheating by selecting the "Use Document Color Profile" item. Why do they even have this feature if doesn't work, or misleads you?

Does anyone have any ideas what could be happening here? Why is this all so screwed up?
CS1 worked fine out of the box.

Final note: I do have an image file I could send along that demonstrates how it is possible to display an image exactly the same in all 4 of the browsers I mentioned with no color differences. It is untagged RGB and somehow it just works.

I am very frustrated with all of this and any suggestions will be appreciated

Thanks,
Pete
    This topic has been closed for replies.

    680 replies

    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007

    >the system should assume sRGB not MonitorRGB when displaying untagged images, IMO.

    and what happens when the monitor - sum dumb dude -just bought - and it can't even represent sRGB color - what then?

    What shall the happy monkeys do with the flying turds?

    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    This has all been a very strange journey. I don't really understand why any particular monitor with a different color interpretation should be able to cause so much trouble. I guess it does in reality, and that just tells me that the system in place for handling these differences really sucks. Why should everyone be required to have the same monitor specs? I always thought that's what profiles were for, but I guess not.

    And when browsers and other non-color managed apps make incorrect assumptions, something needs to be changed... the system should assume sRGB not MonitorRGB when displaying untagged images, IMO.

    I am not happy about this realization, but I am happy that I do not have to fight this any longer. I give up and I am going with a different monitor. I have been forced to consider many concepts throughout the course of this thread and I'm sure others here have too... whether they wanted to or not.

    So a different monitor will make all these troubles go away... well I guess my safest choice then would be an Apple Cinema Display?
    Inspiring
    November 27, 2007
    For ____________'s sake.
    This should have ended at post 29.
    Omke Oudeman
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    >Let's start a new thread... we'll call it "Come here first before you buy anything, EVER!"

    Only if you promise to limit that one to 10 posts!

    >I found a dead pixel.

    If my opponent had a chance of 1 to 2.304.000 to win I would start that fight also...
    November 27, 2007
    I had to fight with Apple after owning the 23" monitor for one day and I found a dead pixel.
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    >So now that I have a second chance to make my life easier, and since I am not made of money, but I am VERY picky about color, as you may have noticed, what should i buy!!!!???

    life insurance.
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    UPDATE - NEWS FLASH!

    I have had my Dell 2407wfp-HC monitor since the end of August, so 3 months of screwing around with profiles, tweaks, nervous breakdowns, etc. I called Dell Tech support, they switched me to Customer Care, and... here it comes... Granted a FULL RETURN!!!!!!! Well, I do have to pay shipping because technically there's nothing wrong with the monitor, but JOY, JOY, JOY!!!! They were awesome... I recommend Dell to everyone reading this (shameless plug) !!!

    So now that I have a second chance to make my life easier, and since I am not made of money, but I am VERY picky about color, as you may have noticed, what monitor should i buy!!!!???

    I want to thank everyone that has participated in this ordeal and thanks for all the advice and explanations, and patience!!! Let's start a new thread... we'll call it "Come here first before you buy anything, EVER!"
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    This all makes perfect sense. Thanks for the input. I just wish there were a better solution for my monitor/profile combo.

    So basically, I just have to trust that although things look a bit funny on my monitor when viewing unTagged sRGB images in browsers, for example, others are probably seeing things a bit closer to reality than I am... because of my monitor/profile combination being outside the norm shall we say.

    If browsers assumed/assigned sRGB rather than MonitorRGB, I would think color consistency would be greatly improved, since sRGB is what everyone is shooting for anyway... I hope I have this point correct...?
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    Try this. You have one monitor profile. Make another version, but change it slightly so it's a bit out of whack. We can pretend that this second monitor profile represents how your monitor may drift over it's life.
    Now open an image in photoshop, let's make it an adobeRGB image, make a duplicate and convert one of the images to one monitor profile, and the duplicate to your other monitor profile. You will now have two different images consisting of different rgb numbers. Open them in your browser and view the difference. Or you can stay in photoshop, and "assign" sRGB to both of them to simulate what most people will be seeing in their non-colour-managed browsers.
    Now try it a different way. Using your first monitor profile, convert the adobeRGB image to sRGB. Switch to your other monitor profile that's whacked out, and convert the duplicate adobeRGB image to sRGB. View them in a browser. They will look the same. This is what you are trying to achieve by converting to a known standard.
    Now you're going to say, "but wait a minute, my whacked out profile actually made the image look different. If I'm trying to match an image to a printed sample, I would end up having to change the rgb numbers, which would make my image different." True, and this is where the importance of calibration comes in! You calibrate your monitor so that the colour is NOT whacked out of place. This ensures consistency. This, coupled with converting to a known standard, will give you the consistent images for the web that you really want.
    If you follow the advice given, the next time you open, say, one of the images for your series of identically-coloured blue navigation buttons to change the text on it from "home" to "homepage", the colour of the button will still match the others because you were always converting to an unchanging standard.
    Participating Frequently
    November 27, 2007
    "Never the less, Photoshop is changing my images when saving for web because viewing on other machines, Mac and PC, reveal somewhat increased saturation also. I sure hope photoshop is not assuming my setup is typical of other machines and adjusting my images based on my monitor profile. "

    Photoshop is NOT changing your images when you do a SFW, other than converting to sRGB if you have that checked. If your untagged images look saturated on other machines, it only means that THOSE monitors are not sRGB either.