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Question

masking

Forum|Forum|5 years ago
December 28, 2020
7 replies
2244 views

For the last time... I have SO had it up to hear [picture me with my hand up above my head] with mask layers. I can understand everything about layers, but to make a mask layer??? It is simply WAY beyond anything I have ever experienced, in that it is the most unstable, unusable, and most illogical process I have ever seen in post processing. For those folks who can make masks work for you, then may the gods bless you and keep you busy with that. I only see it as a product of an insane software developer who whole intention was to create the equivalent of a 120 word crossword with one word clues written in Latin.

I just cant see myself every understanding a process that brings me to the very edge of understanding more times than I can remember, only to suddenly have me plunge back into ZERO function.

How to

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Draco55Author

Known Participant

so... just to bring up everyone up to speed once again. First of all thank you again for your help, but it was only a very insignificant victory.

I actually was able to mask, apply mask and merge to a final image, albeit rough, just so that I could see the process work. I took a break for a couple of days; came back today to try something else. I was able to apply the mask to a given image, and right there everything went south again with nothing but the original image when I attempted to merge the masked image with another image. SO I am going to "leave the building" on this process. I have given up on this. I will stay with the tried and true process of make a selection on a duplicate image; cut it out and merge with another image. I am obviously never going to fully understand the process no matter what anyone tells me to do, or whatever I attempt to do. Once again to those folks who have mastered this, I applaud you. You have managed to accomplished what my brain just CANNOT understand. Once again I appeciate the effort from everyone but this is the end of that road for me.

Ian

Ro Hackett

Inspiring

You're back! 🤣

I don't believe you Draco55...

Either you didnt actually apply the mask ... OR... you still somewhere had the original image on another layer maybe that got mixed back in with the merge

You should really try share some screenshots .... you have to do things a few times before they click! 🤔 🤔

Greg_S.

Community Expert

I have read through this entire thread and can say that there is not a single technique or tool that has been shown to @Draco55 that is not available in Photoshop Elements. As far as masking goes, you don't even need an add-on like Elements+. So, I will not agree with his conspiracy theories. But like the other fine members of this community above, I refuse to give up on a teaching moment. So here goes:

@Draco55 said:

I open an image, I duplicate it, then I click on the mask symbol to create a layer mask. Now I select a brush. Then I select, black or a reduced opacity, and start using the brush to remove what I want. AT THIS MOMENT, I have sucessfully removed or reduced the opacity of the area I have "brushed".

Finally when I use merge visible, merge down, or flatten all layers, in the hundreds of times I have tried this , I have gone back to nothing other than the original image.

If this is an accurate description of what you are doing, I think I can explain your error. Consider layers to be acetate transparencies as demonstrated in this Adobe Help article. You have created two layers with the same content. If you cut a hole in the top layer, the identical bottom layer will show through. When you merge them, they will be just one layer showing the image you started off with. I have asked you in your other thread (to which I responded before seeing this thread) what effect you are trying to establish. When we get a clear answer to that question, we will be able to help you get all of these difficulties behind you.

Draco55Author

Known Participant

I really hate to admit the following.... but I will.

First of all let me use the analogy of the stone arch bridge. If you dont have a key stone fitted properly the bridge will always collapse.

Same applies here. I have heard som really wild stories from sources I hesitate to trust, and I have read some very logical and undeniable examples from all you guys here on this forum.

let me go back to the "stone bridge". I have been thinking about what everyone has been saying and a 'light bulb ' did come on. For a moment I sat there and was dumfounded at how after all this time, I have always missed the one constant that I have always ignored.

HIDE the layers except the masked layer and merge ONLY the masked layer.

My stupidity is as embarrassing as it is obvious.

Now to see if the correct "keystone" works.

If it does... you will hear about it.... if it does not...well you will all still hear about it.

Place you bets everyone.... here goes a frikking revelation... or nothing... we will see.

L

lc55472355

Inspiring

Hi Draco,

Bless your heart. Like all complex, powerful software programs, Photoshop is a never ending learning process. I understand your frustration because I've been there (with multiple of the program's features.) I had to make a concerted effort--researching how to use masks and taking pages of notes--not once, but three times over a 3-year period(!), before I finally nailed down all the steps and was able to use masks to accomplish a handful of tasks. And I still have to refer to my notes from time to time because there are so many ways to use different kinds of masks. It is a broad, labyrinth of a subject that almost guarantees frustration (or should I say "desperation?") 😉

My point is that you're in good company in your struggles and you don't have to be a genious or a pro to eventually figure this out. It is okay, even advisable, to give the whole darn subject a rest, fall back on your eraser tool and the techniques you understand to accomplish what a mask would do, and "live" to have another go down the road at mastering masks. Hopefully the great folks who are posting here will help you make the breakthrough, but if not this time, I have no doubt the day will come for you!

davescm

Community Expert

Hi

I have moved your post (and the answers) to the Photoshop Elements forum where you are more likely to get answers, and supporting screenshots, directly relevant to your version (Elements 12)

Dave

davescm

Community Expert

Masks are quite simple.

Where the mask is white - the pixels on the associated layer are visible.

Where the mask is black the pixels on the associated layer are transparent and the layer(s) underneath become visible.

If between black and white (i.e. gray) then the pixels on the associated layer become semitransparent.

That is it ... nothing technical .. nothing magical.

The screenshot below is Photoshop - but as mentioned early, most image editors work the same way

Dave

Ro Hackett

Inspiring

I would also add, don't use them on a background layer (background layers are locked and a mask will show through to whatever is set as the background colour). (Double click the background layer and hit OK which will make it a regular free layer).

Draco55Author

Known Participant

I appreciate your feedback Ro, but I have to conclude that given that I have read every guide, talked to many others and STILL have not been able to successfully achieve the goal, that this process is subject to missing steps if you are not a professional graphic artist. This keeps competition from amateurs saturating the market and keeps the professionals viable and employed

Ro Hackett

Inspiring

Draco55 Noooo! Don't throw in the towel yet! 😂😂

Trust me once you get it you won't forget it. You know maybe you have trouble fully understanding layers themselves? 🤔 🤔

Have a look at these screen shots to see how the basics work.

Open an image in photoshop it will open as a background layer. Here's some juicy apples.

Now you have one single apple so it is always a good idea to keep a copy of the original image on another layer that is locked and hidden, or to keep it saved as another file, because it is now gone from this one. 😎 😂

jane-e

Community Expert

Hi @Draco55

Let's say you have a photo that's been printed and a stencil of an apple or a flower or the number 5. You set the stencil on top of the photo and all you can see of the photo is what is in the part of the stencil that has been cut out. That's a mask.

If you wanted to re-cut the stencil (aka mask) or make a new one, you could use an Exacto knife.

In Photoshop, Layer Masks are more flexible, but the idea is the same. You can get a decent start by making a selection first, then create a layer mask, but it's not required. Then if it's not perfect, you paint on the mask with pure black and pure white to hide or show the image.

The other option is to delete what you don't want from the image. That's called destructive editing and is not recommended. Using a mask means you keep the entire image and just edit the mask (aka stencil) to show only the part of the image you want to.

When I started using PS, it didn't have Layer Masks. Now I can't imagine working without them.

~ Jane

Draco55Author

Known Participant

Jane, I totally understand what you are saying. And I have many times, actually got to the step in the process where I can remove sections of the photo with the brush tool as you explained. But when I attempt tomerge all the layers... it simply goes back to the original photo. I have tried this process on 4 different computers, 3 versions of photoshop, a number of teachers, in fact so many I dont remember; and I get the same result.

The inescapable fact is, that people like myself are NEVER going to understand this process through to completion. So my post is simply to state; yes PS is a wonderful tool, but for people like myself, and there are others out there who have said the same thing, it will never work for us, and the only option is to move on as if masks are simply not an option. Thank you again, and thank you Ro, for your willingness to help me, but that fact remains, their are people out there who will just NEVER get the connection bewteen process and final result.

Ro Hackett

Inspiring

Well if you ever feel you like to try it once more... when you have a mask you have made on an image... right click the mask layer and select 'apply layer mask'... now the mask is gone and the image is changed. Be careful merging ALL layers. Keep a copy layer of the original full image on a layer but hide it and lock it and instead select 'merge visible'

Ro Hackett

Inspiring

🤣🤣🤣 hilarious post. I think of a mask like erasing out part of the picture but its not actually erased only hidden so you can bring it back. And instead of simply painting out part of the picture u can use a specific shape as a mask. And you can also invert the mask so the shape can either hide or show the portion of the picture within it. (That would be called a clipping mask) They really are magical. 😌🤣

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