Text is jumping in placement after finished with field?

[akcadobe]

Hello -

I've recorded the issue because it's hard to describe - basically I have a form with a ton of fields and they are all correct in placement in Adobe Acrobat. When I preview or fill it out there, it is fine. When I open it with Preview or the web through Safari or on the web, he text placement changes. After you finish typing, it jumps up a slight bit - making everything out of place. I know that doesn't sound like a big deal but there a lot of fields here in a small amount of space.

The font is set at a particular height - it is not variable, so that's not the issue. I've disabled multiline. How do I prevent this so that when they type, the text stays exactly where it should be?  Is there a way that I can anchor the text to stay at the bottom of the field vs the top, if that's the issue?

Or is this just a Mac quirk that I have to live with?

Here is the form live - (ugly link, b/c it's just for y'all)

https://www.archwaygenealogy.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/ArchwayGenealogy_PedigreeChart_editable_...

Thank you for your help

- alexa

[Bernd Alheit]

Don't use Apple Preview.

[akcadobe]

fantastically not helpful, thanks.  I obviously cannot control what PDF reader people will use when they download and complete the form. Is your point that there is no way to fix this?

[try67]

It is helpful. Apple Preview is a buggy application that corrupts PDF forms.

You should instruct your users not to open the file with it. If they do (which you can't fully control) they should expect problems.

[akcadobe]

I understand what y’all are trying to say. My clients are not technically savvy and if they have a Mac, they will likely open the form from the website into Safari or download it and it will autopen in Preview.

I can put all the caveats I want about suggested other browsers and using Acrobat, but that’s really still not getting at my issue.

Other than writing off all the Mac applications, is there any suggestions to try to maintain the layout?

[try67]

No, sorry. If the file is viewed in a non-compliant (or downright destructive) PDF viewer all bets are off.

[Bernd Alheit]

You can try a HTML form.

[Test Screen Name]

If you are not in a position to insist people use software that works - and few people are - I advise you to reconsider PDF forms. I believe they are in their last days, killed by the success of PDF.

[Bevi Chagnon - PubCom.com]

I advise you to reconsider PDF forms. I believe they are in their last days, killed by the success of PDF.

Say wha?

[Test Screen Name]

Levi, Adobe invented PDF then gave it to the world to play with. As long as only Adobe made software they could control the quality and features. But PDF is now universal, a huge SUCCESS. But most of the other people making software have given a very low priority to forms. Some software ignores forms; some show existing filled in forms without filling features; some have a go at filling features but have serious errors and omissions. Adobe also let the ball drop big time on mobile devices.

Now, very few of us are in a position to demand people use Adobe software (and only on a Mac or Windows). The IRS are in that position, for example. Others will find users say "I can already read PDF, why would I install something else". Commonly, too, people install Reader but don't understand this does not fix their other apps. This inconsistent experience means for me, PDF forms are a very poor choice for general distribution. Hence, PDF forms were killed by the success of PDF.

[johnb68146259]

Question along these lines...

My goal is to get a set form field out and get the data back in a printable format. iOS is so wide spread that avoiding it altogether is virtually impossible.

What recommended route is left to take? Just send an Excel sheet? Which people can mess up as easily (or easier) than using Preview to fill pdf forms. I saw a recommendation for HTML forms. Assuming the end user does not have net access (out here in the oil fields, net access is not always assured), how would they go about saving something like that in a formatted manner? Even if it dumped to a csv that could be used to repopulate the form on my end, is there a platform in place for something like that?

I realize this is getting away from the heart of this forum, but if Adobe and Apple can't make something like pdf forms play well together than this is a 100% dead format. And there is no reason to keep paying for this software which is honestly making my job harder. I will just start distributing hard copies of the tickets and manually entering the data when the techs send pictures of their notes.

If net access were assured, I would love to setup a php/python script which populates a mySQL table. I could work with that all day long.

[try67]

This is honestly Apple's fault, not Adobe's. They simply created a defective application that is ruining the PDF files it opens, despite having all the information required to do it correctly (the PDF format is a publicly-available ISO standard).

One has to wonder why they haven't fixed these issues, even though they have been around for years now...

Anyway, if you don't need the end-users to actually edit the text in the fields then just flatten the files before sending them out and the issue will be solved.

[johnb68146259]

I completely understand this is an Apple issue. No argument of any kind. But, since they are basically the largest platform/ecosystem on the planet, I kind of have to adjust. I don't want to, it is by necessity.

I am considering issuing all our techs cheap Android tablets and then employing a strict configuration on them which I believe would solve most of my problems.

[akcadobe]

Thank you try67​ but unfortunately the whole point is to give them the ability to edit the fields. There are thousands of flat charts like this out there - and frankly filling it out in a non-digital way is a waste of someone’s time in this day and age.

The type of person I’m providing it to isn’t really tech savvy enough to then ADD fields to it. Or just using text boxes for every one of these fields would be a nightmare. 

There are also other fillable versions out there, but I don’t want to distribute one with my brand that has a poor user experience where the text ends up all sloppy if you are the large portion of peoole who use native Mac tools.

Since there hasn’t been any actual suggestions towards the specific settings, my takeaway is that I can’t correct it in a meaningful way from Adobe. I am going to try creating it in a native Apple form software to see if it stays in place when filling out the form. Yep, that sucks but if that’s the situation, I’m not staying high and mighty to stick any particular software. I just want the form to work.      ‍♀️

[try67]

Correct, there's nothing that can be done in Adobe's applications to fix the bugs in Apple's software. Nor should there be.

[johnb68146259]

I couldn't agree more. Still, it makes the Acrobat Pro a seriously over priced piece of software when the most commonly used viewer on the market destroys my very simple forms.

[try67]

johnb68146259  wrote

I couldn't agree more. Still, it makes the Acrobat Pro a seriously over priced piece of software when the most commonly used viewer on the market destroys my very simple forms.

The most commonly used PDF viewer is Adobe Reader.

[johnb68146259]

The margin of superiority is shrinking quickly. While it could be said that "the most commonly used PDF viewer is Adobe Reader," and that statement is probably technically accurate, it does not paint a true picture.

If you were to take a snapshot of data at any one time during a work day, there is a good chance that Adobe Reader would not reign supreme. Technically Android is the widest used mobile platform on the planet (the margin is so large that there is no room for argument unless you also believe the Earth is flat), but a good percentage of true Android users are known to avoid "corporate" software like Adobe's Reader in favor of a more "indie" Chrome plug in (or whatnot) [yes, I do understand the stupidity of this statement but that makes it no less true]. And even the ones that don't actively avoid Adobe apps probably never consider installing one because "I can already read pdf files, why do I need to install something else?"

So, while maybe true that Reader is still the most commonly used, it is not by as big a margin as it once was, assuming it honestly is still the most widely used. However, if we were to qualify that statement with "...on desktop / laptop computers" then I would feel confident about it's validity. But considering the mobile market at this time, I think Adobe has most likely fallen off the pinnacle.

[akcadobe]

Hmmmm... well, to those whose guidance is to write off anything Mac bc it’s their problem, I would love to live in a world where we don’t have to design taking into account the possibility of challenges in other platforms and designing to make sure the product still acts as it should. Still works perfectly. Seems like a whole lot of product development would be easier. All that time I waste making sure marketing emails have the correct formatting cross all the different email platforms - phew, I’d get that back bc I could just say to myself, “Well, too bad for you. You’re an idiot for using that super popular platform that happens to tweak this email for some reason.”

For that matter, I would love to apply that to all things in life - being able to just cut out and ignore anything that doesn’t work exactly like I say it should and not plan for the contingencies... well, good luck with that.

[akcadobe]

FWIW, I am not having any issues with the text shifting in placement on iOS (on my phone, tablet or laptop) with the Readdle PDF Expert product. Just passing it on for anyone reading in the future.

[johnb68146259]

I'm not sure exactly what you are referring too, have you had the iOS issue on the actual iOS devices? My forms look and appear to function normally on the iOS devices but after they send them back and we try to update or even sometimes print them is when the problems start to arise.

[akcadobe]

This is exactly my issue.  The goal is to provide a format for the user to use over and over on their end where the data is entered easily in a clean format.

This isn’t about data capture for me. A table doesn’t do the the job of the format of a Pedigree Chart - it is a set format.

Excel would be a nightmare for this - it can’t be just data straight across because i need the genealogical format.

Even if I create an html form and then create a printable output, it can’t be updated (I’m not retaining their information - they are.) These types of charts are filled in or edited when new information is found and that could be over decades. So your MySQL situation doesn’t totally apply bc in the end,I want them to have the ability to work on completinf their pedigree charts on their own.

It‘s frustrating because all I need is a way to anchor the text to an exact point, no matter the platform on which it‘s viewed and/or completed.

I don’t believe the answer can practically be to avoid an entire platform that has tremendous market. I’m going to test some other form creation tools to see If I have any better luck.

[Test Screen Name]

You need it to work on iOS too? Even Adobe's form filling is flaky on iPhones and iPads. Do you mean Mac OS?

[johnb68146259]

Unfortunately, iOS / OSX are in the same boat as far as Preview is concerned.

[Bevi Chagnon - PubCom.com]

Other than writing off all the Mac applications, is there any suggestions to try to maintain the layout?

This is a problem with Apple Preview; there is nothing that can be done in Adobe Acrobat to make the form workable in Apple Preview.

Suggestion: File a bug on the Apple Preview forum, not the Adobe Acrobat Forum.

Background: Although Adobe created it, the PDF file format is now an international standard open to anyone in the world to create software that reads, edits, or generates PDFs. Apple could correct Preview to follow the standard better, but it's their choice, not yours, mine, or Adobe's.

You're right: we can't control what our users do, which software is launched. But we can forewarn them and guide them to use an Adobe product.

When we make PDFs available on websites, especially interactive PDFs like forms, we add a disclaimer right next to the download link "Best viewed with Adobe Acrobat. Get the free Reader here:"

You can download the "Get Adobe Reader" logo from Adobe's website: Icons and web logo guidelines | Adobe

Otherwise, as long as the form is usable, I wouldn't put much more into finding a fix for this, other than posting on Apple's forum to correct the bug.

Remember, your users who by default use Preview have been subjected to this all along; your form won't appear any different to them than the many others they've viewed on their Macs. That erroneous behavior is their "norm."