Adobe, Linux Support, and the Linux Foundation.

Report · Apr 08, 2019

While generally I've only lurked the Adobe forums I've finally worked up guts to post this. I also know that about every 1-2 months this question is asked but I think it deserves a another go around.

My premises is this:

Adobe joined the Linux Foundation in 2008 for a focus on Linux for Web 2.0 Applications like Adobe® Flash® Player and Adobe AIR™. Currently Adobe holds a silver membership status with the Linux Foundation. So why in the world do they not have any Creative Cloud Programs available in Linux without the need for WINE and other such workarounds. I think it's a sucky move to support the Linux Foundation and use Linux in the back-end while not doing anything to support actual Linux users who have for at least a decade requested Adobe desktop products on Linux. Sure it's going to take a lot of manpower, financial resources, etc. But to truly support Linux and the Linux Foundation I think it's necessary that y'all do make things like Photoshop and Lightroom available for the Linux desktop. In any regards the wider Linux community would most likely help with testing and debugging programs. We're used to it.

Report · Jun 27, 2013

Adobe makes software for hobbyists and academics, as well as businesses.

Not for hobbyists.

Microsoft and Apple are, both, very different companies relative to Adobe.

In what way? They are all in the business of making money. They are not making software for the sake of pleasure and enjoyment of their employees and users. They want to make money. If CC is not successful, I bet the desktop versions will be back on the agenda for Adobe and Microsoft (for their cloud products).

Businesses could want to move to Linux if they are upset with Apple (Final Cut/Mac Pro debacle) and Microsoft (Windows 8), provided that their workflow does not need to change too much... especially if they have more confidence that Linux will not pull a sharp-turn that Microsoft and Apple are capable of and have recently demonstrated they, both, may do at any point.

People have been saying this for decades but nothing has changed. Windows' market share keeps going up and up. There is nothing wrong with Windows 8; The people are lazy to learn new ways of doing things. If windows was designed like Windows 8 way back in 1980s then people won't be reluctant to adopt it as their main OS. In any case they said the same thing about Windows XP, and Windows 7 but these two OSs have been the most popular ever.

Anyway I have finished saying what I wanted to say and I'll leave this with you to continue with this thread because I am sure there are many people here who are Linux fanatics like you.

Report · Jun 27, 2013

mytaxsite.co.uk wrote:
Adobe makes software for hobbyists and academics, as well as businesses.
Not for hobbyists.
Microsoft and Apple are, both, very different companies relative to Adobe.
In what way? They are all in the business of making money. They are not making software for the sake of pleasure and enjoyment of their employees and users. They want to make money. If CC is not successful, I bet the desktop versions will be back on the agenda for Adobe and Microsoft (for their cloud products).
Businesses could want to move to Linux if they are upset with Apple (Final Cut/Mac Pro debacle) and Microsoft (Windows 8), provided that their workflow does not need to change too much... especially if they have more confidence that Linux will not pull a sharp-turn that Microsoft and Apple are capable of and have recently demonstrated they, both, may do at any point.
People have been saying this for decades but nothing has changed. Windows' market share keeps going up and up. There is nothing wrong with Windows 8; The people are lazy to learn new ways of doing things. If windows was designed like Windows 8 way back in 1980s then people won't be reluctant to adopt it as their main OS. In any case they said the same thing about Windows XP, and Windows 7 but these two OSs have been the most popular ever.
Anyway I have finished saying what I wanted to say and I'll leave this with you to continue with this thread because I am sure there are many people here who are Linux fanatics like you.

Why do you think they dropped the price to a recurring $50, with options for month to month? Hobbyists and Freelancers who work inconsistently (and are unsatisfied with Elements, another Adobe + Hobbyist example).
Adobe sells development tools primarily, Microsoft and Apple sells platforms primarily. Even Air and Flash are free for consumers.
I actually kind-of like the Windows 8 interface. I was actually developing software for the Windows Store. I, then, saw the Windows Store certification requirements (and, of course, the similar Xbox Live Arcade requirements) and got scared off. Stuck (/sticking) with Windows 7, with plans to move my development workflow to Linux with Windows 7 virtual machines. Have not made the jump yet, still waiting for rumors of GPU-accelerated VM capabilities of NVIDIA's upcoming Maxwell architecture to become confirmed or denied.

Report · Jun 27, 2013

There is no justification to create a department to develop Linux Applications

except the fact that this one request has had overwhelming support, to the point that their request channels got clogged, they outsourced it, and we clogged THOSE channels to.

Nix boxes are mostly used by hobbyists and academics.

WOW. I'd like to see you come up with anything at all supporting that claim. You many not be comfortable using it, but its actually hugely popular with the tech-literate crowd. Programmers, CS folks, etc etc. Win/Mac are really entry level OS's, and you are absolutely correct when you say

people are lazy to learn new ways of doing things

I'm pretty sure that is the Windows busness model in a nutshell. There's a free, more secure, more stable, more usable, more customizable OS just hanging on the tree waiting for you to take one, and yet folks are too lazy to do it cause its "new", so they plop down huge cash for the latest win-crap. You know, theres a reason why Apple caved in and based their modern OS's on Unix. Windows 8, by the way, is one of the leading forces driving the rise of Ubuntu adoption, and before you point out the 1.3% market share, let me remind you that Apple only has 7% and you consider it to be signifigant. No, linix is not the fashionista OS, or the 'Look, I made it on my mac!" os, its the OS of professionals and people who know what a computer is and what to do with it. Thats why my company, and many others, made a company wide switch. The ONLY thing holding us back is adobe insisting on winmac for designers, and thats just not enough reason anymore.

Windows' market share keeps going up and up

On the desktop. But, then, so do Ubuntu's. On mobile / tablet its ALL linux / unix, and on servers windows is a falling minority. (for good reason to). I know, CS is mainly USED on desktops, but Adobe keeps coming out with mobile apps and a huge portion of content being made is FOR mobile. Yup, IOS is still a biggie in mobile, but again, falling like a rock. 85% of sales were android, so that market lead of Apple's is old, decaying devices. Android has more apps available, and more made every day than IOS. Trend polls of highschool / college kids have repeatedly and consistantly returned the opinion 'Apple is dead' for two years now. PCMag, a historically pro-windows rag, suggests going ubuntu instead of win8, and Dell is even offering Ubuntu on it's laptops.

Final note: IMO Adobe should make a linux version not because there are legeons of new subscribers on linux unable to sign up, but because there are legions of non-linux using Adobe subscribers who are desperate to switch to Linux but are held back by Adobe. If this many of your customers want a new version, you would be stupid not to comply. Thats why Blizzard, Skype,

Report · Jul 07, 2013

Add us to the list of members wanting to switch to Ubuntu OS but Adobe CC will make us keep windows.

Web developers would love to have Adobe tools run native in Linux as it is great for coding and site testing.

Even Dell now sells computers pre loaded with the Ubuntu OS and it is only getting bigger as more and more people get exposed to Linux through the Android OS.

If Adobe products can run on a Mac based system running tweaked Linux, then I don't see how much more of an issue it would be to get it to run on Ubuntu.

Please Adobe, help give your user base more options in their OS 🙂

Report · Jul 08, 2013

"

It is oxymoron to ask for CC for Linux because by definition, and by concept, most things are free in Linux and Adobe is not in that sort of business.

It is non-starter here."

"because Nix boxes are mostly used by hobbyists and academics"

Hardly. Are you aware that the Unix/Linux based OS is what primarily runs the internet? There's a reason for that. It's because both the Unix and Linux kernels are more robust, easier to handle and don't claim all of your expensive RAM and Processor just to run themselves.

Linux is, by it's very nature, a more professional system than Windows or Mac.

Imagine you have two video cameras in front of you. One is a consumer camera and the other is a professional camera. Both will produce HD video and in most respects, both will achieve the end means of capturing motion images. But that's where it ends. The consumer camera, for starters, will have a lot of automatic functions, a fixed lens, and be nearly impossible to disassemble or upgrade. The professional camera will have mainly manual functions, a universal lens mount to use professional lenses with and will easily be disassembled or upgraded.

To say the least, Windows is the consummer operating system, full of automatic functions and sealed in plastic. This makes is great when I'm doing consumer stuff like buying stuff on ebay or playing a game, but when it comes down to performing and fitting my specific specialty needs, it fails.

If you've ever pushed any adobe product to it's limit (editing a 300dpi banner in Photoshop, or rendering a 4K video in Premiere or After Effects), you'd actually understand that Adobe running on Linux would be the professional's choice; hands down. For the professional, especially the video and visual effects editor, our computer isn't here to have a fancy toolbar, animated windows, a million "nanny" programs constantly popping up with some permission alert or update alert and another million "Services" running in the background that have absolutely nothing to do with our professional task at hand. My computer is here to run the Adobe Software, and the better it does that means a win for me and a win for Adobe.

Either way, Adobe is going to catch on and make Linux work for them, or a new contender is going to rise up and get the attention of indy filmmakers and those serious about using their computers as workhorses.

Report · Jul 12, 2013

I am a professional Designer. If Adobe made their software for Linux I would never use Windows or OS X again. I use both Windows and Mac OS X for design and OS X handles large files and runs Adobe Software way better than Windows. I supspect it is because of the UNIX core of OS X. I would expect it would run similar to OS X on Linux.

I suspect the real reason that Adobe will not make their software for Linux is because of Pressure from both Apple and Microsoft. Both of these companies have a lot of sway on other smaller companies. A similar situation was when Dell started to promote Linux machines and Michael Dell said he was intereste in selling Dells with OSX. Microsoft threatened Dell and would cut a lot of their business deals if Dell continued with Linux and persued the OSX option.

Report · Jul 26, 2013

I agree with the belief that Adobe programs would run better on Linux. I am doing just fine with the Creative Cloud installed programs on my Windows 8 OS and SSD, but I would love to switch over to Linux.

Report · Jul 31, 2013

Interesting. The staff didn't reply since over a year. It seems like they don't care about the Linux users because they will use Adobe on a VM or secondary computer with windows anyway.

I am looking for Adobe alternatives because of the Creative Cloud and I would like to change to Ubuntu after I read these posts I have got another argument why I should change away from Adobe!

Report · Jul 31, 2013

Trend polls of highschool / college kids have repeatedly and consistantly returned the opinion 'Apple is dead'

Report · Jul 31, 2013

It seems like they don't care about the Linux users

Yes, thats becoming extreamely clear, which is why we left as well. There is good and bad news. There are a lot of linux programs which are comparable to the CC stuff. Honestly, Id still rather CC for linux in a heart beat, for two reasons, but not enough to go back to windows. First, while you can google 'linux alternative to XYZ' and get good and easy results, its one program here, one program there. There isnt really another unified (ish) suite to make it nice and easy. Second, Im used to Adobe, and I (for the most part) really like Adobe.

I think youll find the linux alternatives way better than you might think. In many cases, once you get used to the differences (typically UI, not conceptual), most of the alternatives are as good as CC, some I would argue better. (and free). The designers I work with picked it up pretty quick, and after a fast weekend study were back up to speed on the new systems. I will say, however, that should Adobe take their head out of the sand we would still switch back. The cost of CC is not signifigant to a company, and I think it would remove the "you use what? i dont know that program" from hiring. (that said, GIMP, the PS alternative, is fairly well known).

Everyone has their own priorities, for us consistency in OS and cost reduction due to a more stable platform outweighed the comfort of Adobe, but IMO the one thing thats very clear is that there are legeons of people and companies who either want to switch to linux but dont because of Adobe, or who HAVE switched to linux, but would love to be able to still use CC.

Report · Aug 17, 2013

I remember using Adobe Photoshop 1.3 on SGI graphic workstations and Ultra Sun Stations back in the early 90s. I highly support Adobe CC to become non-platform specific. Definitely think of including your application suite to google drive. I think you will get not only additional market share; but you will also show many other advanced main-stream applications that cloud computing is here to stay. Being able to have a very very simple PC with high end graphics and using the cloud for primary computing and storage is here to stay. It has gone full cycle. From cloud to local and back to cloud. The cloud is the answer. Google knows it, apple knows it, MS knows it, and Adobe knows it. Let's not go half way and let's get to where the platform / device / OS that you are using doesn't limit your choices but rather bolsters them. I love your products and always have sine I started using computers. I will always use your products always but I would love if your products allowed more access to more users. Also, this new world should have more of the companies (namely Google, Microsoft, Apple, Samsung, and others) work in tandum rather in conflict. Service the clients and get into the niche where you excel without the corperate politcs.

Cheers,
Tamer

Report · Aug 17, 2013

Well, if you're talking about making a dumb-box version of CS I would be sceptical. Your either talking about running CS on adobe servers and basically screencasting which would have poor latency and require a constant and very consistent connection. Deal killers IMO. Even google is formatting their drive programs to function offline on chromebooks, so all they are really talking about is making everything browser based. But there's really no reason to do this for CS, though, as you are perfectly capable of runnin non-browser based software on chromebooks, and chromebooks are a chrome OS on top of......ubuntu! So, to all the naysayers our there, Not only has Ubuntu adoption more than doubled in the last few years, the TOP laptop seller on Amazon runs UBUNTU not win/mac. So, Adobe, its about time to actually do this. BTW, if you get in the chromebook / Ubuntu market you have the laptops with many times higher resolution than the win/mac croud, and if you dont think thats going to attract designers than you dont know your market. Also, consider that any touch screen laptop with a digitizer is going to allow stylus use right on the screen without some $3k wacom beast.

Report · Aug 18, 2013

I am looking for the apps to work on multiple platforms. Yes, I agree that having a completely dumb client and the processing occuring remotely will cause some issues. However, with the increasing availability of bandwidth; something in the middle would be workable for sure. Anyway, I agree wiith most of what you state and would really love if Adobe went after this demographic. My main machine that I use for developing is only running windblows because of the CC application platform. I would love to migrate that machine to Linux soon!

Report · Aug 21, 2013

I posted a new thread titled "Porting Adobe Products to Linux, will it happen now that CC is a service and not a product?" This was my initial post:

I know the linux community has been fighting for years to get Adobe to port their products, and it was understandable they never did based on their yearly product cycle, how much work it would take/cost and the amount of end-users who would pay for it. But since Adobe has now switched to a subscription based model, I don't see these same factors as holding them back from finally porting their products.

Being a front-end developer/designer, I find myself always wearing two sets of "toolbelts". I'd prefer a Linux OS for my local dev environment; but GIMP and Inkscape just don't match up to their Adobe counterparts. I've officially switched to a custom distro forked from Ubuntu called elementaryOS(http://elementaryos.org). It has the same attention to detail as Ubuntu in design, just more flexible and customizable. I imagine many Mac/Windows users in my same line of work would do the same if they could use their Adobe products.

After two weeks of trial and errors from a Windows virtual machine running on my pc(VMWare Unity Mode, RDP, Wine), I've decided to just have an additional "workspace" and keep windows on it fullscreen. It's the best I could come up with, but native integration would ideal.

--

Going a little off topic, I could ultimately see Adobe porting their apps to web apps before porting to linux. Is there any speculation or talk that this might happen?

Report · Aug 21, 2013

I can not see web based Abobe Applications working. Esp with Photoshop, Premier Pro, and other intensive applications. I am currently working on a PS file that is 500mb. I am not going to wait for a file to be uploaded and downloaded across the web. I have enought trouble working across a LAN. Plus there is the added Bandwidth need and a security issue. I work with trade sensitive information that I do not want on an Adobe server.

Not to get all tinfoil hat like but all the recent NSA spying on use Citizens should make anyone question cloud based storage and applications. Right now the CC is not really cloud based. It is local software that requires a remote check-in to work.

Report · Aug 21, 2013

I see here, and frequently on many boards, dismissal of linux because it only represents about a 3% marketshare on desktops. Its used as an attack, and often accepted by linux enthusiasts. Its wrong. Consider first that the Mac desktop marketshare is only 7%, yet adobe and everyone else is happy to build for it. Android is linux, and has the vast lionshare of the moble market. Chrome OS is Ubuntu is linux, and chromebooks are the fastest selling laptops on Amazon and other sites. Consider also that when you say marketshare, you mean sales. Aside from Android, ChromeOS, and the occasional (rare but increasing) laptop with an ubuntu pre-install, there are NO sales figures to base linux popularity on BECAUSE ITS NOT SOLD. Let me give you a real example. My wife and I own 2 cell phones, one tablet, 3 laptops and 4 computers. 2 computers were pieced together, 2 where bought with windows. All 3 laptops came with windows. 2 cell phones and 1 tablet came with Android. So, the sales figures say I own (and am assumed to use) 2 copies of windows and 3 copies of Android. NONE of them run windows, not one. In actuality I have 2 android cell phones, 1 android tabled, 4 Ubuntu desktops and 3 Ubuntu laptops. Get the picture? My company is even more misleading as every desktop and laptop there was bought with a pre-install of windows, and, again, NONE of them run windows, they are all Ubuntu machines. My company has 4 physical servers and, at the moment, 82 cloud based servers. ALL of them run..... yup, Ubuntu. Yet, if a company looked at all of this and determined the "market share" of my little circle it would be (roughly) 100% android on the mobile OS, around 98% windows on the desktop, 100% windows on laptops, and 100% linux on the servers.

If your thinking those numbers look familiar, its because thats pretty close to what the industry puts out as market share statistics each year now and claims to be actual USAGE statistics.

I recognize my case is probably atypical, but over and over on linux forums you have users ask "whats the linux market share at now?" and the answer is always "we dont have a market share because we dont sell it, we give it away, so theres really no way to measure it since one download could install to 100 computers, and theres no way to know if those are fresh builds or linux is replacing win / mac". The point is, the 3% quoted marketshare is likely so far from accurate that its really useless, and considering that macs have only 7% (and dropping like a rock) yet have been a profitable platform for Adobe, perhaps the issue deserves some attention.

As we speak, Im fighting my new laptop that just arrived. It has win8, and Im looking to drop Ubuntu on it, and then VMware so I can have a virtual windows install for adobe to run. Yes, its that rediculous. It gets worse. Win 8 comes with a nifty bios lock, making it more difficult to install any other OS on those machines. Most manufacturers no longer provide installation media (install CD), or activation codes for windows, so Ive got to work around all of this so that I can have adobe and still have a decent OS.

For all you non-believers, whats so bad about windows? Another topic, but Im not just some hater. I grew up on windows. Try Ubuntu, or Mint, just try it. Youll never go back (except to run Adobe for now)

Report · Aug 22, 2013

Consider first that the Mac desktop marketshare is only 7%, yet adobe and everyone else is happy to build for it.

Macs are used by business people while linux boxes are mainly used as servers. That's the difference.

No commercial software maker would waste time making software for linux boxes. It is completely waste of time and resources.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

I sure would love an alternative right now. I have been a Windows user for 10 years and before that a Mac User for 12 years. Windows 8 is horrendous. There is no way I can use it for work. Even with the 8.1 update. I need a professional workstation OS for power users. I am going to stick with Win 7 for as long as I can and have plans to slowly transition back to Mac OS X. I am waiting to see if Apple does the same as Microsoft and totaly destroy the desktop OS like MS did. Right now it does not look like they are. I just wish I had a third option and that it would be Linux. There needs to be more OS choices out there. Infact with Linux being open source Adobe could release their own version of Linux that way the CC runs great on it. They could make it and Ubuntu variation like so many do with little cost. Adobe Linux. Talk about a power users dream come true.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

I thnk you're absolutely correct there.

Incorporate all Adobe CC products into a GNU/Linux OS and sell it only as a subscription. No incompatibilities with the OS going forward. Seems like they could charge twice the monthly fee. Something like $99.00 a month would be more than reasonable. And just think on saving to the Adobe shareholders when the programers would not have to be chasing all the OS bugs that they now claim that causes all their bugs.

Adobe may even want to consider offering Adobe CC/GNU/Linux on there own hardware for $750.00 to $1,000.00 a month to avoid any hardware incompatibilities and with a motherboard dongle if they are really serious about stopping piracy. Just think about that savings in R&D to be compatable with all the hardware varations out there, and the hardware could be assembled in China, and a hugh return for the shareholders then. A new Sun Spark workstation here we come.

After all it is all about profits anyhow.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

Priceless. Thank you for that.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

I just thought of one major road block to Adobe Linux. Microsoft Worshiping IT departments. The last three places I have worked the IT policy is basically if it is not Windows it is not getting on our network. It is really annoying that a lot IT people never look beyond MS. I already have a hard time getting the IT department to allow me to use the CC because it is not part of the "Standard Image" This would be a huge hurtle for ann Adobe OS.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

Adobe.Hacker wrote:
Consider first that the Mac desktop marketshare is only 7%, yet adobe and everyone else is happy to build for it.
Macs are used by business people while linux boxes are mainly used as servers. That's the difference.
No commercial software maker would waste time making software for linux boxes. It is completely waste of time and resources.

Actually Windows has the buisness market, always has. It actually has nearly all of the desktop market, but that's it. Linux has the vast majority share in phones, tablets, and servers, and a rapidly growing minor share in desktops. Apple, who has lost dominance in the designer demographic, in the youth demographic, phone market, tablet market, and never had it in the desktop or laptop market, simply has only a minor share in desktops which has been rapidly shinking.

The argument was that apple has been profitable and worth building for in Adobe's eyes despite having nearly no market left. Perhaps the second death of apple has just happened to quickly for Adobe to react to, but IMO if something as insignifigant as the modern Apple market is worthwhile then you cant really make the second statement like you did without sounding completely out of touch. Especially since it's not like Adobe would be the first "commercial software maker to waste time making software for linux boxes", they are practically one of the last.

And what exactly should the difference be between a desktop OS and a server OS? Linux has the server market because it outperformes the others, its more secure, its easy, and its free. Yes, that sounds horrible on a desktop.

Lastly, you dope, you use linux every day. Practically everyone does these days. Its in almost every electronic gadget laying around. Even your precious Apple gave up on making a decent OS of their own, took FREE linux, put a locked GUI on top, and sold it to you for half your income.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

Xeon64 wrote:
I just thought of one major road block to Adobe Linux. Microsoft Worshiping IT departments. The last three places I have worked the IT policy is basically if it is not Windows it is not getting on our network. It is really annoying that a lot IT people never look beyond MS. I already have a hard time getting the IT department to allow me to use the CC because it is not part of the "Standard Image" This would be a huge hurtle for ann Adobe OS.

well, nobody is taking about releasing CC ONLY on linux. If your IT guys insist on windows, use windows. Then go home and use whatever you want.

IT folks are like everyone else. They pick a side, then get comfortable with the tools they know, then everything else is not as good, or insecure, or whatever.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

That is why I think Adobe should have their own complete package, hardware and all totally controlled and administered by Adobe from the internet. Not much different that say a Fiery EX print server. Plug into the network and away you go. Now just how productive you could be with that setup!

Seems it would be a much better alternative then this subscription mess they currently have.

Report · Aug 22, 2013

I completely agree and as an IT consultant see that setup much more frequenty than most would think. True that the majority of Linux is living on servers. But consider this. With some easy xHosting functionality at even little graphics firm; you can setup a nice 4 way server running linux and xhost CC sessions on $200 dumb terminals. Anyway, it won't happen because most IT people out there were told that they have to pay $$$ for their Microsoft Network Engineer Cirtification and that they can charge more and make people pay more for MS IT infrastructure. Of course, they usually don't know how to use anything other than Micro$loth which might not eliminate their position right now; but they will eventually be obsolete.

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Adobe, Linux Support, and the Linux Foundation.

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