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[Locked] No perpetual licenses are you serious?

Explorer ,
May 06, 2013 May 06, 2013

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I just head that Adobe was planning to abandon its perpetual license in favor of an on line only rental program. At first I thought that this must be a joke. I have been using adobe products for 18 years. Primarily Photoshop, Illustrator and Indesign. I am currently an owner of CS 6 Master collection and obviously do upgrade my products and have consistently done so over the years. I am not connected to the internet full time and in fact my work computer is never directly connected to the internet. So how does this work? Is adobe now forcing me to connect to the internet - it seems that this is the case.

In regards to upgrade cycles, I dont want to rent my software and be tied to a rental agreement. I want to upgrade when I choose, not rent my software like some kind of loaner program!

I want to purchase the software then not worry about it. For instance when I travel, I dont want to be bogged down with downloads and upgrades chewing up my bandwidth. I have traveled to many places where internet access is very limited. Downloading from a wireless card in China is painful, I dont want to be bogged down with no software or large megabyte downloads costing me a fortune on the other side of the planet.

Adobe I know that I am just one person and you will probably not listen to me but did someone ask? No one asked me about this. How simple could this be - I want to buy the software then use it when I want where I want, is this too much to ask?

Please let me continue to use this software in the way that I have used it for so long. If others wish to have the creative cloud then great! More power to them, don't alienate your other users. Please provide both alternatives.

Best regards - Matt

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replies 1886 Replies 1886
Engaged ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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I agree with you on the no CC part. I have never used Quark myself but I welcome that there is competition to Adobe. I just hoped Quark would actually start behaving in a normal manner towards customers. The last couple of years Quark seemed to be moving in the right direction as far as I could tell. Forced upgrades or be left behind does not fit my description of a customer oriented business. You do get to keep a perpetual license so there's that.

I'm baffled by Quarks sudden move; they were given a real opportunity to create a loyal following again. Opportunities like this don't come around too often and still you manage to screw up.

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Mentor ,
Jun 21, 2013 Jun 21, 2013

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Jeff_Know1 wrote:

So what? Let them work with software from the Stone Age, if it works it works. But if a user decides to upgrade to the latest version they should have that choice. Users should want to upgrade because a new version has value to them, not be forced to upgrade or lose the ability to do so in the future. Quark had a chance to win back customers and then they announce this strategy...

I agree. ^

I find it odd that Quark chose to so quickly go down the same path as Adobe's lie of "one upgrade back" right before the Creative Cloud Only decision. Unless Quark figures most current Indesign users have a copy of Quark 3.32 sitting around and will take the push to move back to Quark as an alternative, but in general I don't understand why Quark chose to do this given how many people already feel burnt by Adobe for the exact same thing, weird timing on Quarks part to do the same thing.

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Participant ,
Jun 21, 2013 Jun 21, 2013

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Jeff_Know1 wrote:

ValentinOcheda wrote:

I don't blame Quark for this... A lot of people work with versions from the 'stone age'...

So what? Let them work with software from the Stone Age, if it works it works. But if a user decides to upgrade to the latest version they should have that choice. Users should want to upgrade because a new version has value to them, not be forced to upgrade or lose the ability to do so in the future. Quark had a chance to win back customers and then they announce this strategy...

Really though the concept of a cheaper priced upgrade is a way to reward and create loyal customers. It does make sense to give larger discounts to people to continually give you money with every version and not as much to people who wait 6-10 years between upgrades.

On the other hand, it is really REALLY nice when companies like Sony Creative Software let you have the upgrade price from any previous version. I enjoy supporting a company like that much more than companies who act like they are afraid of going bankrupt or think they can coherce more money from me using negative reinforcement.

It's their software, they can offer a reduced upgrade price or none at all; they could even double the retail price and match the reduced upgrade price to the previous retail rate. It's all a perception thing. Cutting off special upgrade pricing more than one version back will definitely create a poor image. They would do better to bump the retail and upgrade price by 10-25% and continue to let version skippers keep the special rates.

But of course I don't like higher prices.  Best option is to lower prices and get more quantiy.

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Engaged ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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jbjones wrote:
Really though the concept of a cheaper priced upgrade is a way to reward and create loyal customers. It does make sense to give larger discounts to people to continually give you money with every version and not as much to people who wait 6-10 years between upgrades.

I agree that a loyal customer being rewarded is a good idea. But having only one upgrade path from one version behind is not what I call rewarding loyal customers. But I get what you're saying.

I personally like Xara's approach. I have upgraded every year from Xara X (released in 2000) up to the latest version which at the moment is called Xara Designer Pro X (v8).

When a new version is released there is a grace period where you can get the upgrade at a discount price (€93 instead of €129).

You can still upgrade later in the year without the introduction upgrade price if you so desire. This way a loyal customer is rewarded in my opinion that always gets the new version right away.

You can also decide to skip a year or more if the new features aren't worth it for you. You can be FIVE versions behind and still get the same upgrade price as everyone else. I like that a lot compared to Adobe's and Quark's new policies.

If for some reason you think €93 is too much to pay every year for a new version then just upgrade every two years and cut your expenses in half, or even once every three years. This way it's the users who are in control of upgrading or not. I know this makes a lot of companies shudder just thinking about their users having choices.

When you treat your customers correctly they actually want to upgrade and get the latest features. They feel good about it. If you do not treat customers correctly they will move and start using other software. If you really manage to piss off your userbase they will even go out of their way to badmouth the company at every opportunity. There are still a lot of Quark people here from the old days who will never forget Quark's behaviour.

jbjones wrote:
On the other hand, it is really REALLY nice when companies like Sony Creative Software let you have the upgrade price from any previous version. I enjoy supporting a company like that much more than companies who act like they are afraid of going bankrupt or think they can coherce more money from me using negative reinforcement.

I fully agree. Once again taking Xara as an example, they have been very consistent over the years releasing one new version every year around the same time. No weird policy changes, no weird upgrade schemes. Just the same consistent customer support and pricing as always. You know what you get, when you get it, and what you pay for it. I'm fully behind companies who behave this way.

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Enthusiast ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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Jeff_Know1 I like what you are saying about Xara and went to take a look at their website. I think the software looks quite nice.

Can you tell me the key features I would miss from PS and AI if I decided to go the Xara route? Is there something that doesn't work very nicely if you are used to Illustrator and Photoshop?

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Valorous Hero ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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Andy, there is a new version out soon and I have no idea what the new features are going to be.

There are a couple things I absolutely love in Illy that are not in Xara. For 99% of everything I have ever designed, those differences mean nothing. Illy is so stuck in the past in how anything is done in it that you may breathe a sigh of relief doing those 99% (or whatever percent) of things in Xara.

Download the 30 day trial.

As for PS, I still use a bitmap editor for most image work rather than Xara. I have been using PhotoLine (available for Mac as well) for, well, since PS CS2. Its interface is dated. Some of the commands/menu names are definitely different than PS. PhotoLine has been around a whole lot of years--a good bit before I started using it. The two brothers that have been programming it are great about not only fixing bugs, but including feature updates during the whole version number updates. It is pretty cost effective to get into, upgrades are pretty cheap.

It also has a trial version.

Mike

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Participant ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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Watching the beginners videos, Xara has quite a few interesting drag-n-drop controls that I haven't seen from many other photo/drawing apps. Pretty cool.

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Valorous Hero ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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As well...to tack onto Jeff's post about Xara, they also offer competitive upgrades (side grades from competitive software). Always have. Just need to correspond with them, giving them the serial number to prove you have a license. That's how I began with Xara Designer Pro. It is my everyday vector (and a bunch of bitmap) editing software.

Mike

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Advisor ,
Jun 21, 2013 Jun 21, 2013

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SoilentGreen wrote:

Quark has now taken the first step.....

Dear Customer,

I’m personally writing to you in order to inform you about an important policy change and how this will impact you.

From July 1, 2013, Quark Software will only support upgrading from one previous version of QuarkXPress to the current version.

Blah.... Blahhhh.....  Etc.......


Yours sincerely,

Gavin Drake
Vice President of Marketing
Quark Software Inc.


While not the optimum step forward ... I would be much more agreeable to this method for a perpetual license than to be held hostage to a never ending subscription model ...

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Participant ,
Jun 21, 2013 Jun 21, 2013

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Butch_M wrote:

SoilentGreen wrote:

Quark has now taken the first step.....

Dear Customer,

I’m personally writing to you in order to inform you about an important policy change and how this will impact you.

From July 1, 2013, Quark Software will only support upgrading from one previous version of QuarkXPress to the current version.

Blah.... Blahhhh.....  Etc.......


Yours sincerely,

Gavin Drake
Vice President of Marketing
Quark Software Inc.


While not the optimum step forward ... I would be much more agreeable to this method for a perpetual license than to be held hostage to a never ending subscription model ...

Me too. And... I have the newest version already.
I will stay as long as they don´t take step 2... "Slavery"

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Contributor ,
Jun 22, 2013 Jun 22, 2013

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> While not the optimum step forward ... I would be much more agreeable to  this method for

> a perpetual license than to be held hostage to a never  ending subscription model ..

  It's a sad day when people are debating which type of recent 'bad' development is preferable...

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 23, 2013 Jun 23, 2013

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Drinking the company koolaid I see Daryl. Enjoy your new environment of a guild cage.

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