Just sending this flare as I continue to work on the issue... Have any of you successfully run TCS or even just FrameMaker on an M1 Mac? Here's the situation I'm encountering: Microsoft no longer provides a Windows 10 image for ARM-based processors. You can only install Windows 11 (BTW, which Microsoft claims provides full backwards application compatibility with Windows 10). It's no longer possible to install Internet Explorer on Windows 11. Only Microsoft Edge is supported. Here's what I'm seeing thus far (in a Windows 11 VM under Parallels): The TCS installer initially terminated on launch, with message "Your browser or operating system is no longer supported. You may need to install the latest updates to your operating system". Applying the Adobe registry modifications for bypassing the IE 11 requirement appeared to fix this problem. FrameMaker terminates on launch with "The code execution cannot proceed because atmlib.dll was not found. Reinstalling the program may fix this problem". I've also searched for a copy of 'atmlib.dll' on my Windows 10 filesystem, without success. (I've attempted multiple re-installs from both the TCS and stand-alone FrameMaker installers). If anybody can report success and/or provide a path forward, I would be grateful to learn of it! -Alan Houser

Alan Houser

Community Expert

Answered

Any success running TCS/FrameMaker on M1 Mac? (LOCKED)

Forum|Forum|4 years ago
November 6, 2021
18 replies
15110 views

Just sending this flare as I continue to work on the issue...

Have any of you successfully run TCS or even just FrameMaker on an M1 Mac? Here's the situation I'm encountering:

Microsoft no longer provides a Windows 10 image for ARM-based processors. You can only install Windows 11 (BTW, which Microsoft claims provides full backwards application compatibility with Windows 10).
It's no longer possible to install Internet Explorer on Windows 11. Only Microsoft Edge is supported.

Here's what I'm seeing thus far (in a Windows 11 VM under Parallels):

The TCS installer initially terminated on launch, with message "Your browser or operating system is no longer supported. You may need to install the latest updates to your operating system". Applying the Adobe registry modifications for bypassing the IE 11 requirement appeared to fix this problem.
FrameMaker terminates on launch with "The code execution cannot proceed because atmlib.dll was not found. Reinstalling the program may fix this problem". I've also searched for a copy of 'atmlib.dll' on my Windows 10 filesystem, without success. (I've attempted multiple re-installs from both the TCS and stand-alone FrameMaker installers).

If anybody can report success and/or provide a path forward, I would be grateful to learn of it!

-Alan Houser

Correct answer Stefan Gentz

At all: Please note that FrameMaker is currently only certified for Windows 10. There is no official support for FrameMaker on Windows 11 yet. Stay tuned for our updates on official Windows 11 support 😉

Also, when it comes to running FrameMaker on a new Mac built around "Apple Silicon," like the M1, please note that Apple currently does not support BootCamp and has currently no plans to do so anytime soon.

That is: You can NOT install or run any Windows 10 or 11 version that you can officially buy natively on a Mac. That is, no version of the "normal" Windows for the x64 Architecture. The reason is, that the M1 is an ARM-based processor. This is a completely different architecture than Intel's 64 architecture.

Consequently, you can only install and run "Windows on ARM" on a Mac. Currently, and to my best knowledge, this is only possible through Parallels Desktop. Note that "Windows" and "Windows on ARM" are different products. While you can simply go and buy "Windows," Microsoft does not sell "Windows on ARM." WoA is only licensed to OEM Partners for preinstallation on laptops, tablets, etc. As of today and to my best knowledge, Microsoft has not made any announcements if this will ever change. (My personal guess: It will.)

Currently, the only chance you have is to become a member of the Microsoft Insider program and then download the Windows 11 on ARM Insider Preview. This one you can install in Parallels Desktop on a Mac with M1.

I'm running Windows on ARM on my M1 MacBook, and it works quite fine. However, when it comes to FrameMaker: Currently, FrameMaker only supports the "normal" Windows on x64 Intel/AMD processors. FrameMaker does not support Windows on ARM.

I have copied & pasted an existing FrameMaker 2020 installation on x64 Windows to my Windows on ARM in Parallels + at least one other file (the already mentioned atmlib.dll). Maybe also a few other files, but I cannot tell for sure (it has been a few weeks now). Most things seem to work fine, but for example, I could not get PDF Publishing running.

Also, note that FrameMaker runs on Windows on ARM through Microsofts x64 Windows on Windows Emulator (WoW64). So, expect to run FrameMaker 2019/2020 which was built for the x64 Windows architecture in an emulation on Windows on ARM in a VM (parallels) on an M1 Mac.

In a nutshell: With "some" limitations you can get it running, but I would call it experimental. I can only recommend to buy a new MacBook with M1. These machines are just awesome and outperform every Windows laptop with a smile, while having massive, true all-day battery life. Not to forget that my M1 MacBook Air does not even have a fan - it just does not need one and never gets hot even under full load (like rendering a 4k video in Premiere).

As long as you have enough stuff to do on a Mac, it's definitvely worth the investment. If you can keep your windows laptop or old Intel-based MacBook for another year or so to run FrameMaker there, it's a no-brainer.

Of course, at Adobe we re looking into FrameMaker support for Windows on ARM, as it is not only relevant for Mac, but also a topic for all other ARM-based tablets and laptops (like Microsoft's Surface Pro X which also runs Windows on ARM). However, as of now, I cannot say anything about if and when FrameMaker will come as a native ARM app.

Jeff_Coatsworth

Community Expert

I'm getting the impression that this thread should be locked - there's nothing anybody can contribute to the issue now because none of us have any control over Adobe, Framemaker, Apple or Microsoft.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think this sums it up:

- Apple has gone to ARM processors - ARM processors don't run regular Windows in emulators
- Microsoft has a Win11 for ARM product (sorta)
- FM could theoretically run on this Win11 for ARM platform, but the installer flakes out & you can't create PDFs anyway
- FM seems to think there isn't enough market share in fixing this up; nothing we can do about that

Did I get this right? Should we just close this down?

M

mscmbl

New Participant

Close it

P

pdeitel

Known Participant

For any of you who did not see this posted:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/framemaker-discussions/private-beta-for-framemaker-on-arm-processor-based-systems/td-p/14456556

P

paul_6939

Participating Frequently

I was just notified that there will not be an ARM build for FrameMaker. Has anyone been able to successfully install FrameMaker in Windows 11 ARM on parallels recently with the newer Windows emulation updates?

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

paul: I was just notified that there will not be an ARM build for FrameMaker.

Can you share where that was communicated?
Not that I necessairly doubt it, after the Linux build of FM never made it out of βeta either.

Alan HouserAuthor

Community Expert

This thread is now more than two years old, but it seemed to be popular, so I thought I would check on any updates here.

I don't see any evidence that "Update 3 of FrameMaker (September 2022 release)" will install on Windows 11 running on an M1 Mac. When I attempt to run the installer, I get "Installer is corrupt. Please re-download the installer and try again". I do not believe the error message is correct.

Has anybody successfully installed FrameMaker 2022 on Windows 11 running on an M1 Mac? Thus far, I'm still running FrameMaker 2020, installed via the "atmlib.dll" hack mentioned previously.

Thanks in advance!

-Alan Houser

I

Isaac21880176y11e

New Participant

I tried to install Framemaker on M1 running the latest parallel and windows 11 and got the same error as Houser. Any new ideas ?

Barb Binder

Community Expert

Thank you, @Stefan Gentz. I am going to continue waiting patiently for you to change that answer to a yes. 😉

~Barb

~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

So for Mac, Adobe might do:

Reanimate the native MacOS API port of FM, and hope that Apple stops churning the ISAs.
Officially support current x86 FM in a Windows/x86 VM in Parallels.
Port FM to Windows/ARM, and officially support that via Windows/ARM in Parallels.
Offer FM as a cloud service, so it runs anywhere that has a decent bandwidth and a suggested browser (with any luck, not exclusively Edge: due to various MS issues).

What platform to support next is a chronic question (Linux, perhaps?), and any single answer is going to leave a lot of potential customers unhappy.

As I recall, a couple of decades ago, Adobe had FM as running on the cloud as a demo. The main customer segment that wouldn't satisfy would be the air-gappers.

D

diver314

Participating Frequently

Thanks so much for the clarity in you message!

I am using parallels 18 on Apple M1. The Parallel emulates windows 11 for ARM (the license is from windows 11 inside) and it runs nicely office 365, and almost all Adobe programs. I am also running Framemaker on a pc win 64 (no arm) and win 10. However, I cannot install framemaker under parallel as it tells me I have a corrupt installer.

Can you specify in summary what do I need to do to make it work under this setting in terms of atmlib porting , IE inhibiting and so on that was recommended so its clear to all of us?

Thanks

Isaac

Barb Binder

Community Expert

@Bob_Niland and @Stefan Gentz:

Explain this like I'm five... can I now run FrameMaker on my M1 using Parallels?

https://www.computerworld.com/article/3688552/microsoft-officially-unleashes-windows-11-on-apple-silicon-macs.html

~Barb

~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training

S

Stefan Gentz

Community Manager

Short Answer:

No. At least not officially.

Long answer:

The article in Computerworld has a catchy, but missleading title:

Microsoft officially unleashes Windows 11 on Apple Silicon Macs

The correct title should have been: "Microsoft officially unleashes Windows on ARM 11 on Apple Silion Macs."

In fact they clarify that in the article itself later:

Parallels Desktop is finally an authorized solution for Arm versions of Windows 11 on Macs running M-series processors.

There are two versions of Windows:

Windows 11 ← Runs only on x68/x64-based processsors (usually Intel or AMD, including older MacBooks).

Windows on ARM 11 ← Runs only on ARM-based processors (like the M1/M2 processors on newer MacBooks).

The latest versions of FrameMaker officially only support "Windows", but not "Windows on Arm".

We are looking into this for a future update of FrameMaker.

P

pdeitel

Known Participant

When? M processors have been around for a while now and many of us run FrameMaker in VMs on Macs. My old Mac is SO UNBEARABLY SLOW that I might need to ditch FrameMaker just because Adobe still does not yet support ARM.

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

On a tech news site yesterday, I see “Windows 11 Is Now Officially Supported on Apple Silicon With Parallels”

As usual for modern so-called journalism, it leaves out key basic details, like what Windows ISA is being supported (x86 or ARM), but it does hint at various problems that might be expected:

$$ to Apple + $$$ to Microsoft (if they'll sell you a licence at all).
64-bit apps only (is all of modern FM installs 64b?)
various subsystems & perhaps APIs not present

S

Stefan Gentz

Community Manager

If it said “Windows 11 Is Now Officially Supported on Apple Silicon With Parallels” it does refer to ARM (“Apple Silicon” is ARM-based) and not x86.

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

Yes, MacOS/iARM is the host platform, but what ISA is being emulated by Parallels? Win/ARM or Win/x86. The answer may be obvious to Mac users, esp, Parallels users, but it's not clear to me.

C

Craig W. Carlson

New Participant

Is it true that Adobe still does not have a supported way of running Framemaker on as M1/M2 Mac?

Alan HouserAuthor

Community Expert

Maybe a pedantic distinction, but Adobe will never claim to provide a supported way to run FrameMaker on a MacOS platform. But many in the community (including some from Adobe) have done it successfully for years; running FM in a Windows virtual machine running on MacOS.

But ... Only Windows 11/ARM will run on M1/M2 MacOS virtual machines. And Framemaker is not supported on Windows 11 for ARM processors. In my testing, the FM2022 installer terminates when it detects Win11/ARM. 🙁

Adobe says that FM support for Windows 11/ARM is on the roadmap.

-Alan Houser

C

Craig W. Carlson

New Participant

What you are saying is true, but at least there was a supported path "Windows VM -> Framemaker" to run on the Intel macs. I've been doing it for years. It sounds like the only path on M1/M2 macs requires "tricking" the software to run/install (via copying fies or registry changes). Since I'm using Framemaker for professional reasons (i.e., I get a paycheck from it), I'm hesitant to use a "hack" to get this running on the M1/M2. Hopefully, there will be a supported path sometime down the road.

W

Wim iDTP

Participating Frequently

Hi Alan,

did you finally manage to run FM on the Mac? I'm encountering the same now, new Mac with Parallels and Windows 11. Can't install FM.

Wim

Alan HouserAuthor

Community Expert

Hi @Wim iDTP - I was able to install/run FrameMaker 2020 with the steps below, and have been using it successfully for several months.

A couple of issues/items of note:

- PDF workflows will not work (Save as PDF, or Publish>PDF). You will need to print to Postscript and generate PDF under MacOS (either Acrobat Distiller or MacOS Preview).

- The Extendscript Toolkit will not run (not supported on x64 architectures)

- When I try to install the new FrameMaker 2022 on Windows 11/ARM under Parallels, I get an immediate installer termination.

------

- Modify the Windows Registry to bypass the Internet Explorer dependency for the FrameMaker installer. (Windows 11 does provide or support Internet Explorer). Details under "Updated your browser or operating system but still see a warning or error?" at https://helpx.adobe.com/x-productkb/global/update-operating-system-and-browser.html

- From a Windows 10 installation, copy "C:\Windows\System32\atmlib.dll" to the same location on Windows 11. (Be sure to copy atmlib.dll from "System32", not the version in "SysWOW64").

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

Alan Houser: When I try to install the new FrameMaker 2022 on Windows 11/ARM under Parallels, I get an immediate installer termination.

In the installation .zip for 17.0.0.226,
…\Adobe FrameMaker 2022\resources\winarm64\
is completely empty, so kaboom results would be unsurprising.
Also, in the presentations yesterday, there was no mention of ARM,
and when it arrives, it appears that it will be Win11/ARM and not MacOS/ARM.

Barb Binder

Community Expert

My question was summarized perfectly by Alan:

This is about support of FrameMaker on Windows 11, running in a virtual machine, that happens to be sitting on an ARM-based processor running MacOS.

-Alan Houser

And then, are we on the way to getting this resolved?

~Barb

~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training

Bob_Niland

Community Expert

At the risk of further drifting an already shaggy-dog thread, what's the end user expectation for how FM would run on a modern Mac?

Mac is now ARM-based, and of course MacOS has its own APIs for various system services, that are entirely different from Windows (but FM at one time was coded for them, on MC68K).

Let's leave aside for the moment a fresh re-port of FM to MacOS native, compilied for Apple ARM, which may or may not something in Adobe's crystal ball.

⎆ Would FM running in Windows on Mac suffice?
⎆ Would the Mac be providing an x86 VM (is it 64b)?
⎆ Or would this be really wierd; Windows ARM64EC running in a Mac ARM VM (is it 64b)?

Heck, does FM today install and run on native Windows ARM (using CHPE on Win10 or ARM64EC on Win11)? I suspect not, due to the 64b thing.

The possible levels of emulation are head-spinning.

Alan HouserAuthor

Community Expert

Hi Bob - IMO, the virtual machine platforms available on Windows (namely Parallels and VMWare) have made the intrigue of "native FrameMaker on MacOS" essentially moot. Performance of FrameMaker in these virtual machine environments is very good; and these platforms provide shared windowing environments and essentially seemless access between the Windows and MacOS filesystems. I've been using FrameMaker on Parallels/MacOS for at least 10 years.

The transition to ARM-based architectures has been bumpy. Microsoft pulled Windows 10 for ARM architectures, and only supports Windows 11 on ARM. And VMWare originally said essentially "There's no way we can legally support Windows 11 under Microsoft's EULA". (I see that VMWare just last week announced a "tech preview" version that supports Windows 11 on ARM-based Macs, so perhaps they've resolved this issue).

I have FrameMaker running under Parallels/Windows 11 on my M1 Mac. There are some limitations ... I can't open the ExtendScript "Script" window; and the PDF workflow does not work (I can print to PostScript and run Acrobat Distiller on my Mac). Otherwise all works as expected.

Barb Binder

Community Expert

Hi @Stefan Gentz:

Like @pdeitel, I would also dearly love an update on this situation. We know that some (all?) of the details are under NDA, but perhaps you can offer us a glimmer of hope that this may actually be resolved at some point?

~Barb

~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training

Dave Creamer of IDEAS

Community Expert

I would like to be surprised, however I still think it comes down to percentage of marketshare. Macs have about 8-10% of the market, but how many of those would be interested in purchasing FrameMaker? I think it's going to come down to cost-of-programming vs projected-number-of-sales.

I'm not a programmer, nor do I play one on TV, but I would think it would have been easier to (re)create a Mac version when both Windows and Mac used the Intel chips.

[Note: I'm not dissing Macs--I've been a Mac user since 1985 and an Authorized Apple Conslutant from 1990-2011.]

David Creamer: Community Expert (ACI and ACE 1995-2023)

Alan HouserAuthor

Community Expert

Oh, come on, David. This is not at all about the old, tired request to resurrect FrameMaker on MacOS. This is about support of FrameMaker on Windows 11, running in a virtual machine, that happens to be sitting on an ARM-based processor running MacOS. (ARM-based processors are also available for Windows platforms).

Several prominent people in the FrameMaker community run FrameMaker on a Windows virtual machine on a MacOS computer (and surely customers do as well), and have done so for years.

As Stefan mentioned, FrameMaker is not yet supported on Windows 11 (out a year this October). There are issues running FrameMaker even on native Windows 11 ARM-based processors.

All to say that Barb's and others' (including my) interest in this issue is perfectly reasonable. We've been using FrameMaker in this configuration for a decade or more.

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Microsoft officially unleashes Windows 11 on Apple Silicon Macs

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