selecting an object that is behind another object

[_pmollica_]

Is there a keyboard command for selecting objects that are behind other objects in the stacking order? or is the only way to select them from layers menu? i'm always selecting the object that is on top of what I want to select, and wonder if there is a keyboard command to "click down" to the object i'm aiming for
thanks!

[Mario Arizmendi]

In Ai CS3 select an object then

command+option+[ goes backward,

command+option+] goes forward

......cool! this way you can go all objects on the document.

[rmgman]

I find it helpful to switch to wireframe (outlines) view to select objects underneath each other. Command+Y is the keyboard command to view in Outlines mode.

[Scott Falkner]

>wonder if there is a keyboard command to "click down" to the object i'm aiming for

Shamefully, no. You can right-click to get a contextual menu and Select > Next Object Below, but that's a pain, too. Most of tired and defeated vets just lock the topmost item, then click again to get the one we want.

[_pmollica_]

i can't believe illustrator doesn't have that capability! indesign does, so quarkxpress

thanks for clarifying

[_Kevin_Perera_]

Wow - Thanks Mario. Twenty years of working in Illustrator and I only find out about this now! I always used the workaround of successively locking the top objects until I got down to the part of the stack I wanted to manipulate.

[_pmollica_]

thats a good tip to know, but i was referring to the objects that are positioned behind the object you are trying to select, but can't because everytime you click on it, the one above it gets selected. I was referring to placement rather than stacking order. sometimes the one you are trying to get to is many levels below, in a different layer, not stacked directly below it.
but thanks for that tip!

[Guest]

Mario speaks the truth. Except that command-option-[ does not necessarily select the object DIRECTLY behind (underneath) a given object as pmollica indicates above.

The next object below command selects literally the next object down in the stack (as displayed, for example, in the layers panel) no matter where it is on the artboard. This is less useful. The more useful command would select an object directly underneath another object that's HIDING or partially hiding it. If the object behind a given one is in fact the NEXT object down in the stack, then Mario's command will work this way. But in complex artwork that situation may not be the case at all.

The command that Scott mentions - the one accessed by control-clicking directly on the object above one that you want to select, then choosing Select>Next Object Below actually does it more usefully. But as Scott says, that's such a painful convolution. Easier to use the layers panel.

[_pmollica_]

i have a bunch of layers of type all stacked on top of each other and for some reason when i use either the keyboard commands or the menu options to get the next object below in the stacking order, it does nothing. maybe it does not work for type unless it is turned into outlines?

[Steve Fairbairn]

command+option+[ sounds useful, but where are the square brackets on your keyboards?
Haven't got them on my Icelandic one. I've been using Illy since eighty-something and never hit on this trick.

[Kurt Gold]

Steve,

on many international keyboard layouts the default shortcut does not work. You'll have to change it to something reasonable that works on your system.

[Mario Arizmendi]

on my keyboard it is exactly next to the letter "P"

[Wade S Zimmerman]

Let me ask you guys a question or two would you think an search buy layer in the layers panel or by object name might be as useful in this regard. Or a scrollable drop down list with either right or control click so you could get to that object in one shot?

Not that I do not see the need to be able to dig down manually until you find and object which you really have to visually identify.

Just wondering i it might be useful.

[Kurt Gold]

It might be useful.

[_zulbat_]

What I do to select objects below others, and have been for years is Hide the objects above. The short cut I have permanently etched in my muscle memory is >Command + 3. To bring all the objects back >Command + Option + 3.

[Klаus]

Steve wrote:
> command+option+[ sounds useful, but where are the square brackets on your keyboards? Haven't got them on my Icelandic one.

You may want to check in the main menu bar on top of your window: Select>Next Object Above or Select>Next Object Below to find the shortcuts valid for your keyboard layout. On my German one its ⌥⌘) and ⌥⌘/.

Klaus

[Michael_Brown12]

This is why I'm always asking for a selection lasso, as is found in every other graphics and CAD application I've ever seen. I use this all the time (in other apps) to select objects in a "pile." As long as you know about where it is just run your mouse around that general area. At worse you get a couple of things which you can temporarily group, isolate and then pin-point the object you want. Ninety-nine percent of the time I get the object I'm looking for on the first shot. The lack of a selection lasso is, in my opinion, the largest oversight in the application. Only people who have never used anything other than AI will not understand what I'm talking about.

MGuilfoile

[Wade S Zimmerman]

There is a selection lasso?

What are you talking about?

[Michael_Brown12]

A "lasso" selects what is completely inside it. AI does not have this tool.

[JETalmage]

MGuilfoile,

Illustrator has a Lasso tool. It's usefulness is rather limited due to the combination of these aspects of AI interface:

Insistence on Illustrator's tedious upside-down two-pointers scheme, making the so-called direct selection pointer the most important; but also making selection like trying to eat spagetti with a chopstick.

The Lasso is functionally a "direct selection" lasso. There is no "whole object selection" Lasso, nor any behavior option.

Illustrator's lack of a surround vs. touch marquee selection option.

There is a far better way to make selections lower in the stacking order. FreeHand's treatment is elegant, direct, simple: You press a modifier key and click. The selection cycles through the object stack where you click. Once a path is selected, FH reliably gives selection priority to that path's points and handles.

Far better than Illustrator's tedious cursor menu selections.

JET

[d0nut247]

Rhino does it in a nice way, you just 'click' where you think it is, and a little menu pops up with a list of items, then as you move your mouse down the list it highlight each object and you just select the one you are after.

i clicked in a different place each screen grab, but i think you can see the gist of it.

it highlights a list of anything directly 'under' where you click and highlights it for you to see which the item in the list refers to.

it will do the same with lines that sit one on top of the other too, so you can pick out a short line that sits directly in the same place as a longer one.

[Wade S Zimmerman]

>A "lasso" selects what is completely inside it.

You are correct but that does not mean it could not have it in the future. I m going to the page and feature request forum to make such a request

[Michael_Brown12]

You are correct, James, that AI has something called a "lasso" tool. It also has the characteristics you describe. It is, however, not a lasso tool. I can call an apple a brick, but that doesn't make it a brick. Its "appleness" is an absolute, not subject to definition. The word "lasso" predates Adobe in both its original and computer related meaning. It's pretty much the same if Adobe insisted on calling your mouse a keyboard. It'd still be your mouse.

Oh, yeah, Wade that's great that you can join me in this request. I've been asking for it for a while. I think Adobe actually listens to its users...it just takes a while.

MGuilfoile

[Wade S Zimmerman]

I have a question or two to ask before I make my request. So say the lasso tool that it has now continues to work the way it does but has options for instance the one you are most concern and i have often been stymied by this as well. First one option would to to select all items that fall completely in the selection area. Once select and while the lasso tool is still select if you control or right click on that selection would it be useful for there to be a drop down (contextual) menu that gives you all the objects selected regardless of the layer they are on. even if the object is completely hidden.

Two if there were a way to set the lasso tool to select only objects with certain prescribe characteristics such as stroke width and a particular type of effect would this be cumbersome or a shortcut.

I am thinking you can load the lasso tool by option clicking it on an appearance in the appearance panel or in a panel listing all the effects in the document.

Then making your selection with the lasso tool by holding down the option key while dragging. Would this be helpful or too much to think about and look at.

Of course I do not know if any of this can be done or if this totally off the wall but i thought i ask before I made a fool of myself on the feature page?

BTW do you think any of this is do-able?

[are18]

Does anyone know if CS4 addressed this issue? Especially now with multiple artboards, choosing "Next Object Below" from the Select menu is a very poor substitute for FreeHand's control click to select the object directly below. The "Next Object Below" may be on a completely different artboard! Is there a fix? I see no mention of this in any of the feature lists in Illustrator CS4.