Change the line spacing in the first line of paragraph

[Karen JR]

Dear all,

I'm using the font PSL Ornanong Pro (I think it's a default font in macOS?) for my paragraphs. Although I understand that each font has its own style, I want to know if there is a way I can decrease the space for the first line of the paragraph.

The screenshot shows that I placed the text box on my layout grid, and the first line is around 2.5mm away from the grid. Even after I changed the line spacing, it did not affect the first line in the text box. So I want to know if there is a way to make the text spacing fit with the grid layout. Or I can only manually adjust all the text boxes in my document? (I want to avoid manual adjustment cause the document is going to be more than 100 pages long (perhaps close to 200 pages).

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Karen

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

There are several settings that can affect that frame-top spacing, besides line spacing and font.

First, are you using a baseline grid, either in the document or in that text frame? I see a document grid but can't tell if a text baseline grid is also in use. Either turning baseline grid off or adjusting its parameters will let the text move to the top of the frame.

Second, do you have any inset spacing set for that text frame? Ctrl-B will bring up the text frame options; check there for both a local baseline grid that might been turned on, inset spacing at the top, or other spacing/text positioning settings.

Ask away if any of that's not clear enough to follow.

[Karen JR]

Hi @rob day 

This is a fantastic explanation! I think it was the baseline issue as when I changed to Cap Height, the new text frame made the text align with the top of the frame.

Unfortunately, the text frame that I made before I changed the setting didn't change accordingly, so I have to manually re-enter those. (But I'm just starting the document so it is fixable manually!!)

Hi @James Gifford—NitroPress 

Thanks for providing both solutions! The grid I was using was my own layout grid. Although I know there is a thing called baseline grid, I always turn it off so I didn't realize it was the issue! Also thanks for the kindly suggestion to check the text frame alignment - I always keep it on top as well!

Hi @Joel Cherney 

I didn't realize it was a free download font as it just appeared in my font book. (or maybe I installed it a long time ago? Although I couldn't really remember cause I mostly only download from Adobe Fonts not from other sites) Also didn't realize it is a Thai-ish font. Thank you for the clarification so I don't misunderstand where it is from!

This community is really helpful! Thank you all for helping me solve the issue!

Karen

[rob day]

Unfortunately, the text frame that I made before I changed the setting didn't change accordingly, so I have to manually re-enter those. (But I'm just starting the document so it is fixable manually!!)

Baseline Options can be included in an Object Style:

[Karen JR]

Thank you for the tips! I wasn't using any object style but I'll start using them from now!

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

BTW, I don't think that's a default font, although I'm not a Mac guy and can't check. It comes up under freeware downloads when I search. If it's a third-party font, it could simply be faulty in some way. Another check on all the above is simply to switch to another font to see if all the same settings allow it to touch the frame top. If nothing but a font change — override the whole paragraph so as not to change any style settings — causes the gap to come and go, the font is... not standard.

[Joel Cherney]

PSL Ornanong Pro doesn't ship with Mac OS, but you can install it from Apple servers using Font Book. I don't have a Mac right now, but Ornanong is a pretty Thai-sounding name (and a search for "Ornanong" only gets you pictures of Thai  folks), and so I'm willing to bet a fair bit that PSL Ornanong Pro is a Thai font.

I suspect that'd explain why its position in the text frame is so odd; if you whack Command + B for the Text Frame Options and look at the Baseline Options, it has some choices in the Offset dropdown that allow you to determine the distance between the top of the frame and the first baseline. The tallest possible Thai compound letters are much taller than a Latin-script capital letter, so using the Ascent value or the Leading value will often lead to this kind of gap.

It all depends on how the type designer chose to make room for all of that height: some will set the Ascent value to cap height, others will use the cap height plus a single diacritical mark, which of course won't work in languages like Thai or Lao or Vietnamese, which will often have tone marks on top of diacritical marks, as in the sample above. 

... and sometimes the type designer's Microsoft boss will say "No, you can't have that much room for Thai in the OS, we need a more squished-down font" which is why so many of your -complex-script support fonts on a Windows box have two variants, one being a UI variant:

Anyhow, I think that's why you have that gap, and you could resolve it by picking a different Offset value in the Baseline Options. 

[rob day · Accepted solution]

Hi @Karen JR , The Text Frame Options’ Baseline Options First Baseline Offset determines where the first baseline starts relative to the text frame. If I set it to Cap Height the first line’s caps align with the top of the text frame:

With x-Height the first line’s lowercase align with the top of the frame

Looks like you might have Leading set as the Offset—my text’s Leading is 14 pt, so the baseline of the first line is set at 14pts below the top of the frame: