InDesign falsely claims a font is missing

[OsakaWebbie]

I added several Adobe fonts from the family AgencyFB, and then used three of them (Bold, BoldWide, and BlackWide) in an InDesign document. A day or so later, InDesign started claiming that the Bold version is missing, but it's definitely not. I removed and re-added it on the Adobe Fonts page, but there was no change in InDesign. I can still choose that font variation in the pulldown, and InDesign will render it properly and even embed it in exported PDFs, while continuing to claim it's missing! I did notice that in the list of embedded fonts in the PDF, Bold is rumored to be TrueType while BoldWide and BlackWide are Type 1 Open Type - it seems unlikely that different fonts in the same family would be different types, so that got my attention. In InDesign's Find/Replace Font dialog, the More Info area says the font is supposed to be OpenType CFF, not TrueType, so that's definitely odd. What should I do to try and fix this?

Here are three screenshots to support what I just wrote: (1) a view in InDesign showing the font pulldown and one of the pieces of text being displayed by InDesign in classic "I can't find this font" pink, (2) Find/Replace Fonts with the full info showing, and (3) the relevant part of the font list in an exported PDF.

[Mike Witherell]

Hi Osaka,

I have strange things like this happen to me occasionally. Here are some things I try:

I use a file utility to search for all instances of that font and delete them (or move them to some neutral place).

I use the CC App (fonts tab) to remove all the fonts in question.

I visit fonts.adobe.com to make sure it doesn't think I have those fonts loaded.

I then sign out of my CC account, reboot, then sign back in.

This way I can try to begin the process again, probably by visiting fonts.adobe.com to install the font family.

Optionally, I usually also go to the CC App and install the same font so I can use it in any and all apps.

PS: Don't forget to check for the font in some "Document fonts" folder (and delete them from there, too)

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

What platform - Windows? 

What OS and InDesign versions? 

If you've updated recently to 20.3 - try downgrading to 20.2 or lower. 

[OsakaWebbie]

Windows 11. InDesign 20.3, but I'm pretty sure I was already on that version before I added the fonts at all.

[rob day]

Hi @OsakaWebbie , Also, check your Creative Clound>Apps>Managed fonts window and make sure AgencyFB is listed and active:

And if you go to the Adobe Fonts site, search for AgencyFB and make sure the Add font button has changed to Remove, which indicates it is active on your account:

[OsakaWebbie]

I had already confirmed both those things. I even took screenshots of them, but I didn't bother including them in my initial post because it was already really long.

[rob day]

Variations on this problem are starting to be common on the forum, and I think in all cases they involve conflicts between fonts activated at Adobe Type, and fonts with the same name installed in the local system’s font folders. In the end it will be better not to mix local and cloud fonts with the same name and different version numbers.

When I opened your example file there were no missing fonts because I don’t have a local version of Agency FB installed in my system, and I have InDesign setup to auto activate Adobe Fonts as needed:

[Brad @ Roaring Mouse · Accepted solution]

There is literally no mechanism in InDesign to change a font from OpenType CFF to TrueType when creating a PDF. That means there must be a version of Agency FB Bold in TT format somewhere on your system that is conflicting.

Since it appears you are on Windows, just know Windows/Office apps include AgencyFB Regular and Bold in TrueType; I suspect that is causing your issues, so if you want to use the expanded family from Adobe Fonts, you will need to deactivate the TT version that Windows supplies. e.g. check your C:\Windows|Fonts folder or C:Users\**Username**\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\Fonts

[OsakaWebbie]

Aha! This is probably related, but it's not solved yet. Yes, you are correct - Bold and Regular are in C:\Windows\Fonts. Although the CC app claims the Adobe versions are installed (for Adobe apps only), apparently there is interference between them or something.

Interestingly, Windows claims the designer/foundry is The Font Bureau, whereas Adobe Fonts says it's David Berlow/Monotype. It seems unlikely to be a name coincidence, but anyway, onward we go trying to solve it.

I removed the Adobe versions of Bold and Regular using the CC app, and then looked again at InDesign, hoping I could just use the Windows font. InDesign then indicated it as "[Bold]" instead of just "Bold". Then I changed the paragraph style to something else, saved, and closed/re-opened InDesign. At that point, Bold (and Regular) were no longer choices at all. Then with InDesign closed, I added Adobe's Bold again, and opened InDesign. I'm back where I started - Bold is a choice (not in brackets) and I can select it, but the text becomes pink and Find/Replace Font reports it as missing.

It's possible that it would clear up if I uninstalled the two Windows fonts, and presumably OpenType CFF is a better font format than TrueType (at least it's newer), but I hesitate to uninstall fonts that came with Windows - I don't know what other effects that might have.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

@OsakaWebbie

Can you share a sample document? 

[OsakaWebbie]

Sure - see attached. But since it's an issue specific to my system, you might not be able to reproduce it. In the process of creating this document, I re-added Regular and fully expected it to behave like Bold, but it didn't! The two flavors of Regular are content to coexist, for some mysterious reason. (I don't need Regular for my current project, but it's useful for troubleshooting this.) And as you can see in the attached PDF, the OpenType version of Regular is used.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

@OsakaWebbie 

When I'm opening your file - I get this:

[OsakaWebbie]

I got that dialog whenever I opened my real document before I removed the MS version of the font. (I would click Skip, and it would not substitute but just display the text in pink.) I don't remember if there was an Activate choice, but since the Adobe font was already activated, that would presumably wouldn't have made any difference.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

I got that dialog whenever I opened my real document before I removed the MS version of the font. (I would click Skip, and it would not substitute but just display the text in pink.) I don't remember if there was an Activate choice, but since the Adobe font was already activated, that would presumably wouldn't have made any difference.

By @OsakaWebbie

My point is rather - it doesn't recognise font USED in your document as available in the Adobe Fonts collection?

[OsakaWebbie]

I don't know that detail - as I said, I don't remember if that Missing Fonts warning offered an Activate button, and I didn't take a screenshot of that popup. I did take a screenshot of the Find/Replace Font dialog, if that tells you anything - see the second image in my initial post. But I'd rather not re-install the MS font just to experiment - my problem is solved, so I'm ready to move on.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

[...]  my problem is solved, so I'm ready to move on.

By @OsakaWebbie

 👍

[OsakaWebbie]

I just noticed you wrote "...deactivate the TT version that Windows supplies." Can I deactivate it without uninstalling/deleting it completely?

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

I just noticed you wrote "...deactivate the TT version that Windows supplies." Can I deactivate it without uninstalling/deleting it completely?

By @OsakaWebbie

Move / copy file to a different folder = make a backup copy. 

Then you can uninstall and bring back if needed. 

[OsakaWebbie]

Okay, I did that (and removed and re-added the Adobe font for good measure) and now it appears to be behaving. If I need the Windows font later, I'll probably never remember where I saved it, but oh well - sometimes we have to live with workarounds instead of real fixes. It's bizarre that Regular didn't have any problem at all, but only Bold.

[Brad @ Roaring Mouse]

The fonts are the same designer... it's just that Monotype owns the Font Bureau fonts now. As far as having both loaded at the same time, it definitely creates a conflict, and they tend to be handled on a "first come" basis in terms of how they are loaded in your System. Even so, this can happen differently on a different computer or at different times.. Plus the font caches can get messed up. Despite being different formats, the internal Postscript Name is the same, e.g. "AgencyFB-Bold", so InDesign sees that and says, okay, got it! So despite you loading the fonts from Adobe Fonts, the Bold weight is ignored as it's seen as "already there" and won't allow both to be loaded. This is a System level thing, not InDesign.

It may not be enough to deactivate the TT versions. Once you have done that and confirmed the Adobe Cloud versions are loaded, you may have to literally do a find and replace in your document to replace the "missing" AgencyFB-Bold with the "loaded" AgencyFB-Bold for it to clear up (making sure to modify styles at the same time).

Like most people that use a lot of fonts, I use a Font Manager which makes it helpul to see what fonts are loaded at any time. In my case here, I have AgencyFB Bold loaded already from Adobe Cloud Fonts, but it will not let me activate the TrueType version stored locally on my computer at the same time. If, howver, i had loaded the Adobe Fonts AFTER starting with the TT version in my system, it would load all the Adobe weights EXCEPT Bold.

 

[Brad @ Roaring Mouse]

The other thing to consider is the the newer Office apps have Cloud fonts of their own, and might have automatically downloaded and activated a "secret" instance of AgencyFB you don't know about.

[OsakaWebbie]

What seems the most strange (besides the fact that Regular worked but Bold didn't) is that I couldn't have simply decided the TT font is good enough and removed the Adobe version - if the Adobe font was not present, InDesign would not offer me any AgencyFB Bold. But when both were installed, it would offer a Bold choice, then complain that it was missing, then use the TT one anyway. In theory I could have just ignored the errors and pink text, but that's not good practice. Anyway, you and Robert have somewhat reassured me that it's okay to remove the TT font, so I will now press on. Thanks for all your help and info!

[Brad @ Roaring Mouse]

It's not a good idea to mix TT and PS fonts of the same family. Much like the issue with open source fonts "changing all the time", there are other technical differences that can affect your layouts, despite the fact the letter forms are essentially identical.

".... reassured me that it's okay to remove the TT font"

Totally.

I'm mostly a Mac guy, but when I do work in Windows, I have my Win fonts folders stripped down to the bare essentials.

Cheers.

[dberlow]

Thanks to Brad for your help on these format and designer issues!

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

[...] If I need the Windows font later, I'll probably never remember where I saved it, [...] 

By @OsakaWebbie

Just rename it to ".bak" or something 😉 

Windows won't use a file as a font, just because it's in the folder 😉 

Or you can always create a new folder - "Fonts BAK" - at the same level / next to "Fonts" folder - and move your font files there.