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Organic Dave
Participant
September 7, 2021
Answered

Export tiff with no layer and save as a copy – different file size, why?

  • September 7, 2021
  • 5 replies
  • 15809 views

Hi!

 

I'm looking for an answer why same file has different file size.

I have an image with only one layer "layer 0". If I save it as a tiff I get around 3 times bigger file size then if I save the exact same file with the option "save as a copy" with "no layers" box checked. Why?

I would, of course understand if I had several layers thrown away by saving with "no layers". But I have "merge visible" before saving so the file just have "layer 0" left. No extra chanels or path does not exist either.

Correct answer D Fosse

Flattening a file discards a great deal of information. A flat file is nowhere near the same as one with a floating layer, even if it's just one layer.

 

For instance, you may have "hidden" data outside the canvas boundary. Flattening the file throws that out.

5 replies

K
kenGo
Participating Frequently
May 15, 2024

Not a solution, but a work around for this is to add a layer of solid white as your top layer in the photoshop file. This will make the layered PSD/PSB file smaller in size. We use Tiff a lot in our proprietry applications and we work with images of up to 100,000 pixels square and that white layer saves a few GB of disc space

O
Organic DaveAuthor
Participant
September 9, 2021

Just to be clear - when working with the image I use PSD. When I export the image to the designers I export as a Tiff. But that was not my question. I'm asking if someone knows why an exported Tiff file size is bigger if I export it with "layers" box checked when saving compered with "save as a copy" that discard the layers, when the original file do not have any layers? I would of course understand why, if I saved with layers and I had layers but the original file do not have layers, path or extra chanels. What is the extra info saved by "saving with layers" compered with "save as a copy" (from a file without layers)?

D Fosse
Community Expert
D FosseCommunity Expert
Community Expert
September 9, 2021

And I answered that question. A flat file is not the same as a single floating layer.

 

A floating layer has the whole structure of anything that is supported in Photoshop.

 

A flat file is an array of pixels and nothing more.

O
Organic DaveAuthor
Participant
September 9, 2021

What is the difference? I have posted two files for a test. I cannot see any difference except the file size.

By using "Flatten image" and "save as a copy" do not make the same effect. Flatten image make the layer to a background and deleting the transparency, save as a copy do not delete the transparency or make the layer to a background.

D Fosse
Community Expert
D FosseCommunity ExpertCorrect answer
Community Expert
September 7, 2021

Flattening a file discards a great deal of information. A flat file is nowhere near the same as one with a floating layer, even if it's just one layer.

 

For instance, you may have "hidden" data outside the canvas boundary. Flattening the file throws that out.

    Alexandre Becquet
    Community Expert
    Alexandre BecquetCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    September 7, 2021

    Hello, like @PECourtejoie and i would like to ask why Tiff because it's a very old format and not really good for actual work. You should try PSD or PSB, depend on the size.

    If i not wrong Tiff is on the version 6.0 since 1992, no update since this year.

      TheDigitalDog
      TheDigitalDog
      Inspiring
      September 7, 2021
      @Alexandre Becquet wrote:

      Hello, like @PECourtejoie and i would like to ask why Tiff because it's a very old format and not really good for actual work.

       

      Actually, unless you do a lot of work in InDesign, the ideal file format is TIFF! TIFF supports everything you need that a PSD can and is more future proof, openly documented, supported in more products etc.

      http://digitaldog.net/files/TIFFvsPSD.pdf

      From Jeff Schewe:

       

      Wrong...PSD is now a bastardized file format that is NOT a good idea to use. Even the Photoshop engineers will tell you that PSD is no longer the Photoshop "native" file format. It has no advantages and many disadvantages over TIFF.

      TIFF is publicly documented, PSD is not. That makes TIFF a preferred file format for the long term conservation of digital files.

      TIFF uses ZIP compression for max compression, PSD uses RLE which if you save without the Max compatibility will be a bit smaller, but at the risk of not being able to be used by apps, like Lightroom.

      TIFF can save EVERYTHING a PSD can save including layers, paths, channels, transparency, annotations and can go up to 4 GIGS in file size. TIFF can save all the color spaces PSD can. The ONLY thing I can think of that PSD can save that currently TIFF can't save is if you Save out of Camera Raw a cropped PSD, you can uncrop the PSD in Photoshop CS, CS2 or 3. That's one tiny obscure thing that PSD can do that TIFF currently doesn't. How many people even knew that let alone use it?

      PSD used to be the preferred file format back before Adobe bastardized it for the Creative Suite. The moment that happened, PSD ceased to be a Photoshop "native" file format. PSB is the new Photoshop "native" file format for images beyond 30,000 pixels. And , at the moment, only Photoshop can open a PSB.

      Getting back to the fist point, Adobe can do anything including stopping support for PSD because it's a proprietary  file format. TIFF is public, even if it's owned by Adobe (by virtue of the Aldus purchase). Even if Adobe went belly up tomorrow, TIFF would continue.

      And, let me be blunt, anybody who thinks PSD is "better" than TIFF is ignorant of the facts. If Adobe would let them, the Photoshop engineers would tell you to quit using PSD. Lightroom for the first beta did NOT support PSD and Hamburg fought tooth and nail to prevent having to accept PSD. He blinked, but you still can't import a PSD without Max compat enabled-which basically makes it a TIFF with a PSD extension.
      Look, I'll make it REAL simple...
      TIFF = Good
      PSD = Bad

      Ok?

       

       

       

      Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"
        Park Street Printers
        Park Street Printers
        Known Participant
        May 15, 2024

        I always save all full-resolution files as a tif for these reasons. I am so grateful that someone else champions this!

        PECourtejoie
        Community Expert
        PECourtejoieCommunity Expert
        Community Expert
        September 7, 2021

        Hello, you should do a flatten image, otherwise, an extra preview image (composite) of the result of the merging of all the layers is included, even if there is only one layer, as it might have transparency, for instance.

          Jumpenjax
          Community Expert
          JumpenjaxCommunity Expert
          Community Expert
          September 7, 2021

          I agree with PECourtejoie, but one more thought save your file as a .psd file first before you flatten. Then you have a backup for any changes you may need in future.

          Lee- Graphic Designer, Print Specialist, Photographer
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