audio effects side chain

[Jim Curtis]

For those of us on Pr CC 18 that has no "Essential" audio ducking, I'd like to be able to use a third party audio compressor/limiter with side-chain input to accomplish the same task, if it's possible.

I can't find anything in the third party or Pr documentation how to do this.

Any ideas?  Possible in Premiere?

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi Jim,

For those of us on Pr CC 18 that has no "Essential" audio ducking

That came in with 12.1, so you likely have it. No?

I'd like to be able to use a third party audio compressor/limiter with side-chain input to accomplish the same task, if it's possible.

You can achieve side chaining in Audition. Check it out.

Thanks,
Kevin

[Jim Curtis]

Hi Kevin,

I stand corrected on my error about ducking in CC18.  For some reason, I thought ducking wasn't introduced until CC19.  My apology.

So, let me restate my challenge.  I tried Pr ducking before, and wasn't getting the results I wanted quick enough.  The keyframing aspect isn't ideal.  I'd prefer a real-time response that's adjustable as the sequence plays with immediate results being audible.  That's where side-chaining would be handy.

I don't care for how using Au means I have to re-write the audio files.  I'd love Pr to get to the point where Au is built into Pr so that Dynamic Link and re-writing files isn't necessary.  You guys have already made Speed Grade obsolete.  You're not that far off with Pr's audio mixing capabilities.  I love how in Pr CC19 we can finally drag insert effects, and copy-drag, etc.  Long overdue, IMO.  I hope you keep improving it while making it a stable app without bugs.

Thanks for your reply.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hey Jim,

I stand corrected on my error about ducking in CC18.  For some reason, I thought ducking wasn't introduced until CC19.  My apology.

Great.

I tried Pr ducking before, and wasn't getting the results I wanted quick enough.  The keyframing aspect isn't ideal.  I'd prefer a real-time response that's adjustable as the sequence plays with immediate results being audible.  That's where side-chaining would be handy.

You really don't need side chaining when you've got ducking. You may need to alter the way you use ducking though.

I had a really good experience with ducking by changing the way I edited audio in Rush, now I edit my audio the same way in Premiere Pro. I simply avoid using audio keyframes all together. I place an add edit on every audio edit I'd need to duck. Raising and lowering audio is very nimble performance wise. Try it, I think it works great. Not only that, but it was insanely easy to adjust large sections while avoiding tweaking keyframes. At most, I'd have to roll an edit a wee bit. But fade control is pretty accurate in the ESP and you can control the speed of those fades very easily.

I hope you keep improving it while making it a stable app without bugs.

I'd love to but asking me to "improve the app" is similar to me yelling at the upstairs neighbor to stop stepping on the creaky board rather than yelling at my landlord to fix the creaky board. Yelling at the landlord actually may work while yelling at the ol' dude upstairs only upsets the old dude. So, go yell at the landlord (on User Voice).

Just a joke there, but never sure it comes through.
I'll +1 any issue I can get behind.

Regards,
Kevin

[Jim Curtis]

Haha.  I meant "you: Adobe," not "you: Kevin."

As I'm experienced with side chaining in my DAW, Digital Performer, I can attest it's a LOT easier and faster than keyframing or adding a bunch of edits to track.  But, I appreciate the offer of help.

Adding edits and changing clip gain was the old school way of riding gain in Avid before they added keyframe support.  Remember, I'm old.  I was the official Avid guru, the Kevin Monahan, Employee #99 for the south and mid west US when they were new on the market in the early 90s.  There's not much about NLEs that I haven't suffered through already.

I'd like to petition you to get behind, +1 adding side chain support to plug-ins in Premiere.  I understand that your engineering crew would have some work do to to enable your native audio dynamics effects to work with side chaining, but since you (Adobe) are dedicated to improving the product, that's an area that could use it, IMO.  I'll mosey over to the suggestion page at some point and make it there, too, because I know that's your next suggestion to me.

Thanks for the conversation.

[Kevin-Monahan]

because I know that's your next suggestion to me.

Thanks for the conversation.

Yep. I'd help you advocate for such a request.

KM

[JonahOS]

Any update?

1. If I could use trackspacer/soothe-(with sidechain functionalist) in premiere than I can literally carve out just the frequences I need to from one audio track based on the dominant frequencies of another audio track. This results in a more natural ducking sound, where the voice is clear, but you don't hear the music changing volume, which can be distracting. 

2. Yes, I can do this in Audition. However, then I have to render out the audio. I could render out just the music, sure, but projects are always changing, its not helpful if I have to wait until the project is locked, or if I have to redo it over and over again. I don't believe that Audition maintins a live link the way After Effects does (not to mention that dynamic linking seems to cause issues). 

Premiere does seem to have sidechain looking buttons, but they don't do anything. This would be a great functionality to have. Or just add frequency unmasking / carving to the ducking feature that's already built in. Or let other plugins grab the incoming audio from the ducking feature while bypassing its processing. 

Thank you! 
Jonah

[defaultdd0ocoumwhzh]

YES YES YES! I would love have trackspacer and soothe in premiere. 

The audio workflow really doesn't work for modern editing.

In elden days, sure you could cut visuals and then send it over for some audio editing/mixing.

These days with one-man-band editors doing it all on Youtube/soc med, it really doesn't make sense that visual editing and powerful audio editing are so seperated. 

[tinkthank av berlin]

To bump this post up again... another three years have passed and there is no sidechaining in VST. Automatic EQ's have become pretty much a standard in audio production (Neutron, Trackspacer, there are even free sidechaning EQ's like Nova etc). but Adobe hasn't apparently understood the importance of this idea. 

We are NOT talking only sidechain COMPRESSION here, which you might compare to the horrible "Auto Ducking" feature in "Essential Sound" ..  we are talking sidechain equalizing, which totally makes sense, is technically possible for a long time and is a very useful feature in AV production. 

In case anyone needs to understand the importance of it: lets imagine you have Audio Track 1 with music and Audio Track 2 with Overvoice. Sure, you can lower the entire volume of Track 1 to make Track 2 comprehensible (Auto Ducking, Sidechain Compression) but you can also just lower the FREQUENCIES occuring in Track 2 from Track 1 to make the voice cut through the music.

To be able to use this, we need sidechaining in Adobe Premiere. Honestly i cannot believe it is still not there...

[Andrew28662457m5ct]

I second this request. Sidechaining is an imperactive part of mixing and it would be great if Premiere would incorporate it. Same goes for other basic functionality like Time Strething or compressing dialogue. There's no reason we should need to open Auditon for very simple things like that where you already have the technology. I've had very little success with the ducking feature. 

[njc596s]

Upvote times 10,000.

[DJP2014]

We've got fade handles - be great, Adobe, if Premiere could steal Audition's side chaining too!

As other posters have correctly pointed out, roundtripping just isn't an option these days.

[Sharyn36619623fs4v]

Here's another vote for sidechaining in Premiere!

Resolve just added the audio ducking plugin - I find the premiere audio ducking with keyframes just doesn't work for me.

It gets very messy with lots of keyframes and changes the other keyframes I have set up prior to the ducking.

I'd really love something like resolve 19's new audio ducking plugin, or something awesome as well would be sidechaining and I could do it myself with compressors !! I make lots of videos and doing all the mixing in premiere without going into audition is really great and the only thing missing is an improved ducking feature.

Please please please and thank you!