media encoder does not have preset for ProRes 4k or UHD, only has for Avid

[dariap2345]

I want to transcode my 4k (actually UHD) MXF originals from sony x70 to ProRes for editing in PP 2015 but even the new update has no ProRes 4k presets.  There are plenty frame size presets for  DNxHR MXF OP1a (for Avid) but nothing for 4k ProRes for PP editing.  Is there a preset? I do know you can drop the originals into PP but hear that the H264 wrapper of originals is not good for editing re demands on system . So I want to transcode to proRes but keep UHD frame size. I've been told that data rates vary by frame size and frame rate, so Adobe  should have ProRes settings you can download. Anyone know?

[excited_Genie16B8 · Accepted solution]

Couple of things.  First, the presets are just a shortcut to a group of settings that you might use over and over.  You can always make your own if you don't see one you need.

Second, give Cineform a try.  The quality is every bit as good as ProRes and it edits smooth as silk.  Plus, there's already a preset for it.

[dariap2345]

J Simonthanks I will look at Cineform preset, thought it was for

goPro. Question-- if I use that on all UHD footage, but other older

footage is ProRes 1080, will i have trouble in same sequence. I don't mean

about frame size, I mean about combining Pro Res and Cineform

[excited_Genie16B8]

I never use ProRes, but I would not expect there to be any issues combining both.

[dariap2345]

I contacted Adobe support and various and contradictory explanations finally did get some help creating the Pro Res YHD preset.  They never mentioned Cineform but i will certain try it. 

[stefan_gru]

Darla, here is more info on the CineForm codec: GoPro CineForm intermediate codec support in Premiere Pro | Adobe Premiere Pro CC tutorials

Watch the embedded video towards the bottom of the page too.

[dariap2345]

I went to link and watched the tutorial. Only question is-- they feature it as an export codec in that tutorial, but you and others here  use it as editing codec, correct, and think it's better or equal to Pro Res, correct?

[dhelmly]

Just a couple of points to help clarify.

We typically only create Presets that work cross-platform. By Apple design, Apple ProRes encode  is OSX/Mac only which is why there is no preset. You can decode on Mac & Windows (read the file on the timeline)

You can easily create a Preset either in Premiere's Export Dialog or Media Encoder  -  Use Quicktime as the format and then click on the video tab and choose the correct ProRes Codec (422, 422LT, 4444) and frame size/rate. Then click on the Disk Icon where you selected Quicktime and give it name and save it. This Preset will be available in Media Encoder or Premiere. You can also export the Preset and save it in another folder and re-import it. We did create presets for Mac users a few years ago - Link : Adobe - Adobe Media Encoder : For Macintosh : AME CC ProRes presets (Mac only)

As Stefan mentioned, GoPro Cineform is excellent high-end codec choice for a working codec and is also cross-platform when needed.

On the Cineform tutorial we show how to Export it but fully support reimporting it was well which is a very common workflow.In short any codec we export we can also import as a working codec and work with it on the timeline. Not all codecs make good choices for working codecs. Try to avoid H264/mp4 codecs as working codecs. While they are supported, generational  loss of quality can happen on each export/import/export. Codecs like GoPro Cineform, ProRes (Mac only),DNxHD, and a few others are better choices.

I hope this helps..

[R Neil Haugen]

There are a fair number here who definitely prefer it to ProRes & DNxHD (the comparable Mac & Pc codecs) as it does edit smoothly even with a lot of effects, it's less compressed & its manner of compression "fits" the computers quite well. It's so high-quality it is a good export codec also. J. Simon notes he transcodes all his mov/mp4 and other such stuff involving a rename that 'sticks' on both the original clips & the transcoded clips. The Cineform files are much bigger, so after editing he deletes those & puts the exact-named original clips in the folder in place of them for archiving.

Neil

[excited_Genie16B8]

The Cineform files are much bigger

That's not always the case.  I shoot on a hacked GH2, recording bitrates up to 150 Mb/s (I-frame only).  I convert to Cineform at the Film Scan 1 setting (quality of 4 out of 5) and sometimes the converted files are actually smaller than the originals.

One thing I really like about the Cineform codec is that it's a CQ (constant quality) codec.  That means a frame will use whatever bits it needs to meet that quality setting.  So if it only needs 10, it won't use 20 and waste space.  But if it needs 30, it won't get stuck at 20 and compromise on quality.  Both Prores and DNxHD/DNxHR can suffer from those issues.

[R Neil Haugen]

That last bit is something I didn't know ... thanks for the info, J ...

Neil

[dariap2345]

I've taken your advice and I'm transcoding original MXF UHD (mostly from Sony SX-70) to Cineform rather than ProRes and you mentioned that sometimes your transcodes are actually  smaller than original. But My originals are always much much smaller than transcodes both to ProRes or Cineform  Example Original MXF is 16.75 GB.  The ProRes422 is 128GB;  Cineform is 137GB (setting was at 4)  Does this seem right or am i missing something?

Another question:  best way to relink to the new cineforms  At this point I've experimented with various transcodes which are in separate folders, but with unwieldy names  _1.mov _1_1 and so on

Should I rename the original to match the transcode or rename the transcode to match the original or rename the files themselves on the  mediadrive.  Or leave all files names alone and go offline and then relink between disparate names?

thanks

[excited_Genie16B8]

I use a hacked camera that records up to 150 Mb/s, which creates files significantly larger than most cameras.  That's why mine sometimes get smaller after conversion.

The Cineform to ProRes ratio seems about right.

When you do the trancoding, the new files should have the same name as the originals.  Doing otherwise will only add confusion.  Save them to a new folder when you do the transcoding.  Never rename, delete or otherwise alter the originals.

This process is best completed before editing.  There is a bug with 2015.1 that will make doing it after the fact more tedious.  (You will have to replace the files one at a time, instead of all at once.)