Real-time playback in both Source and Program?

[aaronfross]

Hi,

I am trying to do something which is super easy in Vegas, but super difficult in Premiere. That is simply to apply an effect to a single track.

Since that is not possible, the only option is nesting sequences. That introduces its own problem, which is that it is impossible to edit the clips within a nested sequence. Well, to be precise, it is possible if "insert and overwrite as individual clips" is enabled, but that defeats the original purpose of applying an effect to all clips on a track.

So in order to workaround these limitations, I followed the instructions from one of the devs, to load the primary sequence into the Source Monitor, perform Reverse Match Frame, and then Gang the Source and Program. With this setup it is possible to edit clips within a sequence that is nested, while viewing the final output. The Program monitor displays the sub-sequence, and the Source monitor displays the primary sequence in which that sub-sequence is nested.

However, even after doing all of this, there is still a big limitation. The Source monitor does not update in real time. Press play in the sub-sequence timeline, and I see playback in the Program monitor. But the Source monitor, which is displaying the final, primary sequence, does not update until playback stops.

So, is there a way to see real-time playback of more than one thing at a time? I tried the Reference monitor window. I tried a separate physical display device. No matter what I do, only one window updates at a time.

Computers are so fast nowadays, there is really no reason why we can't play back two, or three, or any arbitrary number of streams simultaneously. Is there any hope for me? Will I actually be able to do my work, or will I spend all of my time on these forums trying to find ways to do simple things that aren't possible?

Thank you

[aaronfross]

BTW, I can scrub in the timeline, and both Source and Program windows update in real time. But apparently by design, playback in both windows is not permitted.

[PaulMurphy]

What effect are you applying to the nested sequence?

Cheers,,

Paul

[aaronfross]

I have several layers that need to be composited. Each layer is constructed from multiple takes/clips. On each layer, I need to apply global image adjustments across all clips in that layer... e.g. Proc Amp and Motion.  The global adjustments must only apply to that particular layer, and not to the layers below. The only way I could figure out how to do this is by nesting.

Primary sequence with nested sub-sequences

One of the sub-sequences.

And it works, although it's not a good workflow. The trick of using the Source monitor to display the final, primary, output sequence is super clunky. The sub-sequence is loaded into the timeline so I can edit. I have to remember to select that Source monitor window every single time before playing back the edited+composited final output. If the ganged Source window would just play back in real time, in sync with the Program monitor, this would be way easier. And there are also many other scenarios in which I would want to see playback in both monitors. I don't think either Comparison mode or Multicam mode will do what I want.

[PaulMurphy]

Hi Aaron,

I think an easier way to achieve this workflow is to use what's known as "pancake timelines." Here are the steps:

• Load your nested sequence in the Source Monitor.
• In the Source Monitor, click the wrench icon and choose Open Sequence in Timeline.
• Load your primary sequence in the timeline.
• Click the name of the primary sequence in the timeline and drag down to the bottom of the Timeline panel until you see a purple rhombus across the bottom. This will split the Timeline panel in two, with your nested (Source) sequence at the top and your primary (Program) sequence underneath.
• Move the playhead for each sequence to the point of sync, and then go to the Source Monitor wrench icon and choose Gang Source and Program.

Now you can work on both timelines at the same time. Only one monitor will playback at any given time, but you can easily switch between monitors by selecting each timeline.

Cheers,
Paul

[aaronfross]

Wow, fantastic, thank you Paul! I will try that!!!

[aaronfross]

OK, a simpler explanation of this is that the UI permits multiple simultaneous timelines. All that's needed is to undock or drag-n-drop a timeline panel so that both timelines are visible. Then sync the two timelines and enable Source monitor window > Gang Source and Program.

It isn't perfect, and it would still be really great to see simultaneous playback in both Source and Program windows. But this is very helpful, thanks again!

[aaronfross]

.

[aaronfross]

And the two timelines aren't zoomed/panned to the same region. Would be super helpful if there was an option to synchronize the UI DISPLAYS as well as gang the play heads.

[PaulMurphy]

I wonder if the simplest solution to all of this is to try out the new Properties panel in the current Beta. It allows you to select multiple clips and adjust their effects properties at the same time. That way, you can stay in the one sequence and not have to worry about juggling multiple timelines.

Cheers,
Paul

[aaronfross]

Thanks again Paul, that Properties panel sounds interesting. I will wait until it's actually released, though. Not going to take the risk of changing versions in the middle of a project. This one is nearing completion, and I've learned a lot in the process.

I haven't yet seen a properties panel in any program that can affect multiple selections. The problem of conflicting settings/parameters/effects across selections is a challenging one. E.g. if I apply different effects to clips, and then select those clips, the logic of what effects are displayed/editable in the properties panel gets complicated.

Really appreciate your help.

[R Neil Haugen]

I'm real curious what you're using the proc amp for?

[aaronfross]

I am doing abstract video art, the source is analog madness rescanned from a vector monitor. Very esoteric stuff. The levels need to be dealt with, specifically I have to crush the blacks a little to clean up the messy analog

[aaronfross]