Working on different computers

[boxman2784]

I started a project on my 2016 Macpro tower, using Premiere Pro 2017, latest update. I have to travel a lot for so I keep all edit files on a lacie hard drive so I can take the edit with me, when I then open the project on my Macboo Pro 2017, with the same updates and my tower, same luts in the same folders etc, the colour of the project is different, I've even take screen shots sent to the other device while having them next to each other, when I open and compare the files from the macbook pro are red shifted slightly. I know its not a hardware problem as ive compared frame exports and screen shots and they're different depending on the machine I use.

how am I supposed to produce consistent grades etc?

[David Arbor]

By using a professionally calibrated display. Every single monitor is different and calibrating them with a special tool (I'm not talking about the built-in one on the OS) is the bare minimum you can do. Having a calibrated broadcast monitor is your best option for producing a consistent grade. I'm not saying you should go out and spend thousands of dollars and buy one or two, but something like the X-Rite ColorMunki is a useful tool.

[boxman2784]

youre misunderstanding, the premieres om the different machines are exporting them different even though they have the same settings. So ive Exported a frame on the MacBook and sent it to my macpro, which does have a secondary calibrated broadcast monitor, then when I compare the exported still from the MacBook to the still exported on the Macpro, does that make sense?

to test I've viewed a still took on my 5D, they look the same on the MacBook and the Macpro.

what I'm saying is the software on each machine is exporting the image with different colours, even though ALL settings are the same. There's only a slight difference in contrast and tone but its enough

[David Arbor]

At any point are you connecting the broadcast monitor to the MacBook Pro?

Unless I'm misunderstanding it sounds like you're color correcting on the MacBook Pro, exporting a frame, sending it to the MacPro and viewing it on the broadcast monitor and then comparing the same frame to the MacBook Pro display. Is that correct?

[boxman2784]

no

imagine I have two frames:

frame A is graded on machine 1

frame B is graded on machine 2

both machines have the exact same software, same LUT and changes in Lumetri, exact same export settings

if I view frame A and B next to each other on either machine, the look different, so two frames, graded the same, exported the same, look different when placed next to each other, regardless of what monitor they are viewed on

the monitors I have viewed both frames on are

Macbook Pro screen

Apple 21inch screen

calibrated broadcast monitor

above are the two frames from this particular project. The frame on the left is from the Macpro, the frame on the right from the Macbook both exported from the latest version of premiere, with the same LUTs and grade, exported with the same settings, regardless of the screen they're viewed on, they are different.

1: the red/pink hue in the skin tones

2: difference in contrast

3: different in over all white point

[David Arbor]

Thank you for the clarification. In that case I would look to the GPU to see if that's causing the problem.

Switch both projects to Mercury Playback Engine Software Only in your Project Settings and export the frames again. If they're the same then you know the GPU is the culprit, as it often can be, but then it gets harder to figure out what to do about it.

[boxman2784]

I've tried all the obvious things like that, which is why I'm posting on here

[David Arbor]

Well you haven't told me what diagnosing steps you have taken other than export frames on both machines, so I have to start somewhere since I don't know anything other than the information you're writing here.

Even so, what was the result of switching to Software Only mode? Are you still seeing a color shift?

[boxman2784]

Look, I appreciate your help I really do but I feel like all the things you're suggesting are pretty obvious things. Im a full time professional editor with a solid history behind me and im literally stumped at whats going on here, normally I can logic my way through issues but I have no idea what to so.

apologies if im not being clear on what I've tried, ive basically tried every settings option available, even to the point where ive deleted all the LUTs and looks from the macbook and copied and pasted the LUTs/looks from the macpro into the relevant folders on the macbook.

I've tried every possible export setting/codec etc and regardless of what I do im getting the same colour changes

[chrisw44157881]

Premiere actually does grade you-get-what-you-see in sRGB if your monitor is also calibrated sRGB. premiere will ignore any other color profiles. quicktime is not sRGB(0-255 gamma 2.2). quicktime(depending on the version), RGB values are 16-235 with various gamma styles like 1.8 or 2.4.

Furthermore, if you colorgrade in Premiere and your monitor is not sRGB, (like P3 or adobe RGB for instance), you will get incorrect grades because you are grading in the wrong native color profile. VLC can match premiere perfectly if you set its options-prefs-video output to OpenGL. Also, nvidia control panel needs to be set to 0-255 so that your gfx card doesn't change your RGB values in media playback.

Also,

external displays are still limited by adobe's mercury transmit protocol that is hard coded to rec. 709 so you'll need to match that too.

[boxman2784]

None of that addresses my actual issue though...

the footage was shot on a Sony Fs7- in slog 3. the RAW footage looks exactly the same, on either device,I then add the sameLUT then correct and grade in the exact the same way and the results are different.

Its nothing to to do with QuickTime or VLC, nothing to do with using the Adobe RGB or sRGB. It's  about not getting the right grade due to using the wrong settings etc. Even if I were using The wrong settings, I'd be using the wrong settings on both frames so they would still look the same, albeit wrong.

regardless of what montior, what players or anything else, I have two adobe premiere, with the same settings across the board, each one exporting differently... if I view the two frames simultaneously on:

a tv

a phone

and ipad

a broadcast monitor

an Apple monitor

an Apple laptop monitor screen

and they are different. The two frames I've posted above are from the different exports, even viewed on whatever device you're using they apear different.

[chrisw44157881]

aw, ok I think we're getting on the same wavelength. Do they differ in premiere's scopes if you import them both back in and compare them against each other in hsl, yuv?

are the luts in the same folder structure? as premiere, media encoder need the luts in the same places in their respective folders.

is import natively unchecked in media encoder?

[boxman2784]

as stupid as it sounds I didn't think to check them with the scopes! Ill give that a while and post results!

Yeah, I thought it might be a folder issue so I deleted all the lut folders from the macbook version and copied and pasted the folders from the macpro so they were all identical on both systems

[David Arbor]

Yes, I was suggesting some relatively obvious things that a professional editor with a solid history behind them might know (and even then, not everyone is technical). However, it wasn't until the 10th post that you said you were working with FS7 footage shot in SLog3, so now I understand where you stand. Whether or not I can help you is a different story, but as a professional editor you know how deep Premiere is and we only have the information you're providing, so when troubleshooting it's always best to start from the most basic level or to build on what what provided in your initial post.

What's really helpful to know is that the raw footage looks the same. Do you have another color correction plug-in like Colorista that you can try for troubleshooting purposes? What about taking Lumetri out of the equation and trying Levels or even the obsolete three-way color corrector. We have to find the problem first, and this is an easy way to find out if the problem is Lumetri. Or you could even try Lumetri without the LUT because that could be problematic (it also wouldn't be the first time I've seen a LUT be the problem). Technically, a LUT isn't necessary, although it might make it a hell of a lot harder to get your grade right, so it's worth a try.

What you also haven't mentioned is whether this is only happening on this project, with this specific footage, or only with FS7 footage; also whether this as always happened or if it just started recently or with a specific Premiere update. If it's only been happening in CC 2017 have you tried testing in CC 2015? Lots of things to try, lots of questions to ask, I don't know what you have or haven't tried and I'm don't want to assume anything.

[boxman2784]

Im not a big fan of LUTs in general as these days people use them like they're applying a filter in instgram, the LUT I used it literally just Gamma changes.

what camera the footage was shot on isn't really relevant in this situation.

ive always had the problem but its never been an issue as ive tended to edit on either system then only grade at home cus i prefer there, I have a three screen set up so grading is easier there than on a single display laptop.  In this situation its become a problem as ive already sent over the final edit which was graded on my home system but needed to do a few changes and im on the road and need to submit this edit before im back home so wont be able to export the cut on the machine which did the grade in the first place, does taht make sense?

[Andy Edwards]

Can you provide more details on your set up of both systems.

Exact Operating system version

Exact version of Premiere installed on both systems

What GPU's are in use on both systems?

Are you using CUDA, OPEN CL, Metal for rendering & Exporting? On both systems?

What LUT is in use on both systems?   Custom created LUT?  Bought 3rd party LUT?

If it was a Lumetri LUT, did you use it in an older version of Premiere (CC2015) and copy it forward to the new version (CC2017)?

Adobe changed the old way LUTS are used in between those versions and older LUTs from speed grade have issues when

brought forward into the new version of Premiere.

What are your sequence settings and preview render settings? Are you exporting with Previews enabled?

Are you applying the LUT to an Adjustment layer or the footage directly?

Are you applying the LUT in the export settings / effects menu?

Are you using the Video Limiter in the effects menu on export?

Are you checking Maximum render quality in your export dialogue box?

Hopefully filling in these details will reveal something that will help you solve this problem and get back to editing.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hello boxman,

Sorry for this issue. Did you ever find a solution? Please let us know if you have or if you still need help.

Thanks,

Kevin