Why can't we just have separate log ins and be done with this nonsense?

[JayJhabrix]

As the topic says...

This common login is supposed to be one reason why Adobe can't implement NNTP. But what function does it serve? I've commented in another thread, and below is more or less, what i said there...

That, i think, was the most assinine idea anyone ever came up with. I see no reason for not having separate log ins for store and forums / downloads. In fact, i can't think of one good reason to combine the two.

If i were a user of the Adobe store, i would definitely prefer to have a separate login and password for that area. I think most people would. I see a lot of aliases in the forums. In the store, you'd want to use your real name for tax and audit purposes. Moreover, what's to stop people creating two identities anyway? So, the whole purpose of a common id is meaningless.

Am sure, that even at this stage, it wouldn't be too difficult to separate the two. For instance, whenever i open the forums i see a welcome at the top of the screen. Right above 'Home'. Yet, i still have to login to the forums... what give? Idiotic.

Adding to the above, doing away with this single log in would also mean an end to this frustration of suddenly getting logged off, randomly staying logged in, etc., etc.

[JayJhabrix]

Buko.

the other thing I got out of the video was Adobe is more concerned about looking pretty than having a functional fast working forum with all the experts that have left us.

Has Adobe had a recent top management change? That would explain all this excreta...

[Guest]

yes, but i think the issue goes back 2 CEOs not just this one... tehy started going downhill (from a user perspective, not a shareholder one) on bruce's watch.

ask disney and michael eisner what happens when you watch the bottom line to closely as opposed to giving people what they want. iger, jobs and lassiter "get it".

hey... my cursor is gone inside this reply box... <alice>curiouser and curiouser</alice>

[Guest]

dave milbut wrote:

hey... my cursor is gone inside this reply box... <alice>curiouser and curiouser</alice>

Already reported in the small nipple thread.

Toggle to HTML and back.

[Phillip_M_Jones]

Chris Cox wrote:

"In fact, i can't think of one good reason to combine the two."

Because you don't have all the facts, much less all the plans.

It makes sense.

NNTP has a few dozen things going against it, and login creditentials are the least of it's problems.

I frequent a NNTP Site annexcafe That requires the use of a UserName and password. On SeaMonkey It called in Server setting Request authenication in order to log in to this server.

In otherwords you can require a Username and Password just like in web forums.

[Jochem van Dieten]

Phillip Jones wrote on 2009-05-24 23:54:

I frequent a NNTP Site annexcafe That requires the use of a UserName and password. On SeaMonkey It called in Server setting Request authenication in order to log in to this server.

In otherwords you can require a Username and Password just like in web forums.

Sure you can require a username and password. The problem is that when

you supply them they will be sent to Jive, not to Adobe. Cryptographic

authentication protocols that support TTP login systems for NNTP are

very new and I don't know any large scale implementation, nor do I know

whether many clients support them.

And mind you, there are other issues besides the authentication.

Jochem

--

Jochem van Dieten

http://jochem.vandieten.net/

[Kath-H]

I just think it's going to prove too difficult/complicated/expensive to integrate the way Jive and Adobe handle log-ins in a way that people will perceive as acceptable.

[Kath-H]

Or ... I think a good compromise would be to have one ID/password for the whole of the Adobe site, but one separate one for the forums alone, since they are hosted elsewhere.

[Jochem van Dieten]

Kath-H wrote on 2009-05-26 07:15:

Or ... I think a good compromise would be to have one ID/password for the whole of the Adobe site, but one separate one for the forums alone, since they are hosted elsewhere.

The way the login system currently works (cookies) you will never be

able to do SSO for services that are not under *.adobe.com.

Jochem

--

Jochem van Dieten

http://jochem.vandieten.net/

[Kath-H]

'Useless whining' could also be interpreted as determined resistance. If those who are not happy continue to leave, that can and may force a rethink. Just because a policy decision is made, doesn't mean it can never be changed. Those who do not just silently leave are in fact doing Adobe a favour, since they are bothering to insist on and explain what is not acceptable.

Never heard of the UK poll tax riots, eh, Jochem?

[Kath-H]

Not to mention opening all the "free points" topics.

Not currently guilty - but when the natives are really restless they do not always confine themselves to polite requests.

[Kath-H]

I think I am being nice when I call it whining. Because the answer has

been given, and is just not accepted.

With advance apologies for the horrible stereotyping, I think that view comes from a rather Scandinavian/Germanic-type mindset - what you are seeing is more of the European tear-up-the-paving-slabs and set-fire-to-things way of expressing dissent

[Guest]

Now Kath, the gentleman has told you; you have been given an answer and, coming from Adobe, that should be sufficient!

Go back to your place and write 100 times, "I will not argue with teacher".

[Jochem van Dieten]

Kath-H wrote on 2009-05-26 07:37:

>> I think I am being nice when I call it whining. Because the answer has

>> been given, and is just not accepted.

With advance apologies for the horrible stereotyping, I think that view comes from a rather Scandinavian/Germanic-type mindset - what you are seeing is more of the European tear-up-the-paving-slabs and set-fire-to-things way of expressing dissent

Relax. Take a deep breath. Write one reply to all I wrote. Get coffee.

Read your reply again. Edit it. Submit it. Because just because you feel

the need to cut up your reply in half a dozen messages doesn't mean I am

going to answer more then one.

Jochem

--

Jochem van Dieten

http://jochem.vandieten.net/

[Kath-H]

more then one.

AAAAaaaaaaggghhhhhhh! (Too much coffee ) - Dorothy, is that you????!!!!!!

[Guest]

Write one reply to all I wrote. Get coffee. Read your reply again. Edit it. Submit it. Get logged out by stoopid forum software, losing the message you worked on for 20 minutes. Forget all the details you wrote about passionately. Post "Me too." Move on.

there... fixed that for ya.

[S_D_A_]

That's a little offensive Kathy (hope you don't mind me using your name).

I'm neither and I find the constant whining to be just that; Whining.

Why does everyone that was on WebX think they're more important that the

users who were on Fusetalk ? All the constant complaining seems to be coming

from the supposedly more mature ex Webxers.

I'm not talking about the legitmate complaints <ie> browsing speed; But the

inane whining about the point system. Geezus who the hell cares about the

point system ?! "One doth protest too much" springs to mind.

[Ramón_G_Castañeda]

S.D.A. wrote:

I'm neither and I find the constant whining to be just that; Whining.

Ironically, that's all you do, S.D.A.:  whine.  Well, maybe not strictly all, since you also b¡tch and criticize, but it all comes under whining.

S.D.A. wrote:

All the constant complaining seems to be coming

from the supposedly more mature ex Webxers.

Sure, beacuse the FuseTalkers don't know any better.   For them, Jive may even be an improvement.

[Guest]

Okay, here are my thoughts on this:

1) where is the information stored with regards to the store login?

2) where is the information stored with regards to the forum login?

are they on the same server?  if yes, I sure don't want Jive having potential access to my private information!

I seldom visit the store.  I don't want any of my personal information accidently revealed because I have to be tied to the store when I am in the forum.

With regards to the various Adobe forums, it makes perfect sense to have one login for the forums.  NOT for the store and the forums simultaneously.

It was a bad decision.  It needs to be changed.

It's not whinning, it's common sense.

[Jochem van Dieten]

greenjumpyone wrote on 2009-05-26 16:45:

1) where is the information stored with regards to the store login?

2) where is the information stored with regards to the forum login?

are they on the same server?

Yes.

Jochem

--

Jochem van Dieten

http://jochem.vandieten.net/

[Guest]

jochemd wrote:

greenjumpyone wrote on 2009-05-26 16:45:

1) where is the information stored with regards to the store login?

2) where is the information stored with regards to the forum login?

are they on the same server?

Yes.

Jochem

so what does that mean in terms of security?  If memory serves me, in the old system, the store and the forums were on two different servers and never the twain shall meet.  Isn't that a more secure setup?  Why would they change that?

[Kath-H]

S.D.A. wrote:

That's a little offensive Kathy

What's a little offensive?

(hope you don't mind me using your name).

You're welcome to use my name, that's what it's for - but please get it right, it's not Kathy.

I'm neither and I find the constant whining to be just that; Whining.

You are neither what nor what?

Why does everyone that was on WebX think they're more important that the users who were on Fusetalk ? All the constant complaining seems to be coming from the supposedly more mature ex Webxers.

People on Fusetalk had such lousy forums that most of them used NNTP instead, I think we know a bit more about what a decent forum looks like.

I'm not talking about the legitmate complaints browsing speed; But the inane whining about the point system. Geezus who the hell cares about the point system ?!

Who's 'whining' about points here - this is the thread about separate log-ins.

"One doth protest too much" springs to mind.

'One' could do with reading a post before criticising it, more like.

[Guest]

All the constant complaining seems to be coming from the supposedly more mature ex Webxers.

imo, maybe because of 2 things: 1st as kath said, it's probably an improvement to the ex-MMers using the fusetalk forums which were - to put it nicely - slower that glacial. and 2nd, the other group that would be complaining, the NNTP users have simply mostly chosen to leave quietly.

that's giving up, not helping to make things better by providing feedback. if no one complained, things would never change and adobe would assume all is right with the world. instead of looking at us as "whiners" maybe adobe should look at us as "harbingers".

[Guest]

Because you don't have all the facts, much less all the plans.

It makes sense.

gm chrystler chris. do you think we're stupid? do you think many of us don't know exactly what plans a big corporation might have for tying logins together? especially one that links the store to other areas?

[JayJhabrix]

Chris Cox wrote:

"In fact, i can't think of one good reason to combine the two."

Because you don't have all the facts, much less all the plans.

It makes sense.

NNTP has a few dozen things going against it, and login creditentials are the least of it's problems.

Jive ACE Adobe Arrogance to the fore again!

[Claudio_González1]

I normally don't like saying "I told you so", and I normally don't, but...

Shortly after Adobe stepped back from the last fiasco, we began hearing rumors about uniforming the looks of all the Adobe sites. Wanting to know what could be waiting for us, I began visiting the ex MM forums. To my surprise, I found that I had to log in them using my Adobe Store username and password, and I also found that I never remained logged in those forums for more than perhaphs a couple of hours (I never measured this time). I therefore came to the Suggestions for the New Forums thread (I don't recall by now the exact name of that now vanished thread), and wrote a message telling about this login problem, and strongly suggesting that the login procedure for the new forums was kept completely separtate from the Adobe Store one.

Some other people from "this side" (ex Adobe forums) also noticed this logout problem at "the other side" (Kath, I seem to remember you were one of them), but after many workrounds were posted, I finally remained as the one poster affected by it. Fearing that this could make my more important request to be forgotten, during the next months (more than a year?), I posted it several more times as a separate suggestion: please keep the login procedure to the new forums completely separate from the one of the Adobe Store. Unfortunately, and as so many excellent suggestions posted in that thread by many other people, it was not taken into account.

By the way, in those months I could also observe how the format of the Adobe Store site became more and more loaded with needless additions, like "fancy" gray backgrounds, large black boxes, and the like; and how many of these additions were carried over to "the other side". Which wouldn't have been so bad if loading times hadn't increased accordingly. My posts asking for the format of the new forums to be kept as simple as possible, though echoed by many, were also ignored, but then this is another story. Or is is?

To end this already too long post: during the test period, I was one of the many who warned repeatedly of the danger of losing many of the most valuable collaborators of these forums because of the incredible slowness  and poor functionallity of the new design. You may blame it on my aging memory if I am wrong, but I could swer that I read more than once semi official replies in the sense that this was a calculated risk of Adobe, and that any loses, however regretable, would soon be replaced by new users.