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What? So basically you're saying that NOW that Adobe has their audience, they can now extort money because they have their userbase? Now that they've "arrived" they can now stop adding features to their software and "dial it down."
"extort" ? They are forcing people to use the software?
But NOW that Adobe has that captive audience, what incentive do they have to keep improving the software?
Improvements have always been a hit or miss sort of thing.....EVENTUALLY you upgraded, assuming you did not wait TOO long (couldn't go from Premiere 2 to CS5 for instance)......yes, now you will pay all along, but it is a lower cost spread out...as I laid out in my math above, up to 5 years it is a wash ASSUMING you upgrade every couple years. If you never upgrade, then yes, the new way will cost you more if you already own the software. But Adobe isn't interested in keeping non-paying customers. People using the same software for a decade isn't what will keep their doors open and their developers employed, any more than if an auto manufacturer made a car that never wore out and worked forever.....why would anyone buy a new car?
Those on CC can't stop using it if they want to open and edit their files, so essentially Adobe doesn't really have to do anything to keep people addicted.
"if they want to open and edit their files"...aka, USING THE SOFTWARE. You either ARE using the software or you are NOT using it regularly IMHO. And how often are you opening old files, really? There are ways around this "problem", old school ways...laying off sub masters and storing alternate file types of graphics etc. for easy rebuild later......that usedto be the ONLY way......many people using the software now are too young to remember those old ways....LOL Is it as convenient as opening up a workfile from 10 years ago and it just works? No. But then, if you want that ability you can keep your CURRENT CS6 or older software in perpetuity on a machine and have that work just fine. I have opened up CS6 files on CS5.....the newer features will not work....but I can access the files. you want 100% easy portability and infinite "storability" then yes, now you will have to pay for it versus it being an assumed freebie.
The solution, again, is to cut bait now......keep your CS6 or older files for future use, keep an old machine loaded with CS^ or older and switch to another editing platform that you feel will be future proof going forward.
Good luck finding "futureproof" anything in this biz.
there were various suites that catered to different groups of people. As I recall... Web Designer, Production Premium and Master Collection. MOST... did not opt for the Master Collection. MOST were Production Premium and Web Designer - but NOW we don't have that choice - it's essentially one or all. And it's a waste for most.
I do concede that the "single app or all apps" model is a bit constricting. There could be a medium ground. But then again, many of us are dabbling in each of the disciplines that were previously very clearly demarcated, so having the tools handy is cool. If you look at the pricing structures of the previous bundles, you still paid a healthy fee for the licensing compared to the "full blown" packages......right now CS6 is $2600 for the master collection and $1900 for the production premium. That $700 is not that much a discount really, is it and for that $700 you get much more that could be useful to you. Or maybe not.
You do know that the upgrade for each Creative Suite was less than the cost of CC for 18 months? And at the end of that 18 months you still had an ASSET that you could sell. And if you decided to move to another piece of software, you could still retain your old Adobe software AND open those old files.NE
The CC PS and LB bundle is only $10 a month....$120 a year. Photoshop CS6 is $700. And if you are a CS user already, the full bundle is only $359 a year. That is less than the price of a normal paid update.
Yes, a little more. So Adobe is not allowed to raise their rates for upgrades?
Someone can play with the numbers on either side of this discussion and "wag the dog".....many many MANY scenarios involved and there are pros/cons on either side. Overall, the initial price of entry is MUCH MUCH lower and that will attract new customers. Many people do not CARE about "having access to their files" for 10 years.....many people do a project and move on. With the crazy advances in technology and software every day, falling back on an old work file is rapidly becoming a moot point. I have Adobe workfiles. If you decide that you want to cancel CC TODAY, then yes -- anything you created yesterday will be unuseable......but that is more a business decision on "when" to cut bait.
ANYONE who thinks that RENTAL-ONLY software is a good thing is simply incredibly naive OR an Adobe fanboy.
No need to go personal with this. having a difference of opinion on this doesn't make someone a sell out , a cronie or naive any more than opposing the changes makes you a pirate, education-license cheater or a cheapskate.
it's the removal of CHOICE to a rental-only method that is the problem.
As said, I agree that it would be nice to not have to get the full blown version...myself, I only "need" half the master collection.....and that is , I think, something that one could reasonably ask Adobe to consider.........then again, I feel that the cost is a wash when you consider regular updates. The subscription plan is something new to me too, so that will take some time to get used to when I finally jump, but it is what it is and it truly is the future of software I think. Adobe is looking to capitalize on their investment in these softwaresfrom over the last couple decades...and it has been a slow crawl for the first 2/3 of that.......Premiere, for instance, was never 100% solid for me...many a night was spent trying to get Premiere 3.0 to run at ALL without crashing.......but CS5 and 6 have been rock solid......well, as rock solid as software can be....that is in part due to the OS being perfected, and to new computer technology.......
People sitting back waiting to upgrade for 6 or 8 years, or using educational licenses far beyond their scope is no longer enough to pay Adobe's bills....those folks are not the target customer. They have the right to raise their prices or licensing tact as much as you have the right to choose another platform. Anyone with any business savvy will recognize this.
And I simply find it amazing that so many people continue to tout CC as so wonderful - what is really so great about having your choice of owning or renting removed? Do you know how many people were complaining when they first introduced CC? The answer is ZERO. There were no complaints because they "sold" CC alongside of perpetual licenses. BOTH can easily live side by side.
According to the Adobe site right now you can still buy CS6....so you have that choice. The difference is that if you want product IMPROVEMENTS you will need to go to the CC route. Having two different licensing methods would require double the manpower and resources to support...more, really because the old "perpetual licensing" method requires plans for upgrades for various older versions.....that takes time and money to devise and keep going......I do not blame Adobe for wanting to streamline their operations. They have the right to cut costs as much as you or I do. Again, we are free to go to a less expensive platform or one that we feel does the same stuff for the same or better money with perpetual licensing schemes still in place. What I do not get is why all the angst and bitterness. It is just a business decision. Vote with your wallet and move on and show Adobe who is boss or buy in to CC and do your work with a professional platform that you are used to. Easy peasey.
Unfortunately far too many DO drink the kool-aid and refuse to see the real problem or simply ignore it. Not to mention setting a terrible precedent that will ultimately end up with all of us renting ALL of our software instead of owning - JUST what the corporations want us to do. And how many of you are facilitating this?
LOL That is because not everyone sees this as a huge problem. My opinion is that CC is probably better in many ways ASSUMING Adobe continues with product improvements over time. It isnt drinking the koolaid -- it is a thoughtful business decision.
Adobe is not the only editing platform out there. If I do not like the new pricing structure then I am free to change gears and move on.....just like if I do not like a camera I am using I am free to sell it off and buy another. I think many many people will LIKE the CC structure.....it is easier to get into using the software at $600 spread out over a year versus $2,000+ up front......the whole "what if I want to quit Adobe CC and then be able to edit my files later" argument has a tiny bit of merit, but as said there are old school ways around it......and how many people REALLY need to go back and edit timelines or files from 5 years ago? If you do, then yes it is a decision you will need to make.
The real laugh here is that when I started in this business, having even a basic edit suite with basic functions was a venture that cost $20k+ initial investment and then constant upkeep $$$. Now I have an entire suite of professional tools for $600 a year. Sorry I find that mind blowing. Those newer to the field who started with having every professional tool they could want at their fingertips via educational licenses or pirated copies or even legit standard licensing will certainly have a different viewpoint....
It is expected I guess that Adobe will continue, forever, allowing abuse of its licensing or allow slow upgrade paths and will continue to be able to grow the products. I do not hold that view. If that makes me naive or a "adobe fan boy" in your eyes, I say "oh well.". 
Pirating, lack of customers buying regular upgrades on a timely basis and the economy have all factored in to this new CC structure. You want to complain about this, look to the people who use pirated copies of the software , use educational version "forever" long after they have ceased meeting the educational licensing requirements, and those who wait 6 years before deciding to upgrade. No business can continue for long having their products used that way CC solves those issues for Adobe. It also opens up the products to many more who could not afford the large up front costs previously. I think Adobe has made a calculated decision and feels there will be more customers gained for each one lost. Only long term will prove that right wrong.
Great discussion, really, and I think many good points on all sides. But again, it is what it is. Whining about it and accusing Adobe of being greedy, etc etc ain't gonna change Adobe's tact.
Let's meet back here in 10 years and see where we are. LOL
"According to the Adobe site right now you can still buy CS6....so you have that choice."
I love this response since I've heard it so often. If that's what you call choice, then you really don't understand the concept and the gripe others have with this. You really are ignoring the issue if you truly believe this line of BS.
What? "Many people do not care about having access to their files for 10 years?" I have spoken to NO ONE who is not concerned about being able to open and edit their files for MANY years later.
There is also one other choice you have,.....walk away from Adobe and find a better/cheaper/more flexible for your needs software. Keep your old Adobe software for opening up your 10 year old files you need and start new projects with new software. And cross your fingers that you have tied your wagon to software that can be trusted to go the long haul.
And NOW you don't have that ASSET that you once had. Similar to renting a house, the money you rent goes down the toilet whereas the if you owned, it's an asset that you can SELL. Now of course unlike a house, the software will not appreciate - but is IS worth something for quite a few years. Since there are many copies of VERY old Adobe software selling on ebay and elsewhere, that is money that YOU and others on CC will never see - flushed as it were.
Uhhhhhh....not sure, so dont quote me....but is reselling registered software legal ,per the license agreement? Could swear it says "not transferable" ? maybe so, maybe not......But I do know that as long as you continue to use the product , using the previous one to get new upgrades, you are not allowed to sell the old product since it was the base for the upgrade you bought.
So not sure why this is a point at all???
And that's not all... I find it interesting that you ignored the other VERY important aspect of this removal of choice into rental-only: Setting a terrible precedent that will ultimately end up with all of us renting ALL of our software instead of owning - JUST what the corporations want us to do.
And I find it interesting that you are overlooking the VERY important point of WHY Adobe is doing this......you can blow it off and say "it's a money grab"....or you can consider that Adobe has always been fighting a losing battle with product theft....people using educational licenses years after they leave school, installing a second copy on a friends computer when its supposed to be for BACKUP ONLY, not concurrent use, and downright piracy.
I used to use an editing package called Speed Razor, along side my Premiere box.....(long story).....it used a hardware dongle.....only ONE copy could run at a time because it was linked to that hardware dongle. I think Adobe could have done that years ago......but didn't. They knew that the educational maluse, the "extra" copies running and maybe even the piracy WAS in fact a way to get their software to take a major foothold and get it noticed...a decade or more later it has done just that. Professional level products that are still in reach of anyone who has the desire to make it happen.
It really boils down to this in the end. Adobe will do what they need to do, and so should you. Walk away or pay to play.
I do know that complaining on a forum, even an Adobe forum and accusing Adobe of being greedy and advocating piracy as some seem to be doing will get you absolutely no where. Let your wallet talk. That is how its done.
If you can't swing $50 a month for your tools then you are in the wrong business or hobby. Hell, many people pay twice that for a lousy cell phone or XBOX online play. LOL
I think we are going in circles now......I am going back to editing.
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