[Locked] No perpetual licenses are you serious?

[Mattrman]

I just head that Adobe was planning to abandon its perpetual license in favor of an on line only rental program. At first I thought that this must be a joke. I have been using adobe products for 18 years. Primarily Photoshop, Illustrator and Indesign. I am currently an owner of CS 6 Master collection and obviously do upgrade my products and have consistently done so over the years. I am not connected to the internet full time and in fact my work computer is never directly connected to the internet. So how does this work? Is adobe now forcing me to connect to the internet - it seems that this is the case.

In regards to upgrade cycles, I dont want to rent my software and be tied to a rental agreement. I want to upgrade when I choose, not rent my software like some kind of loaner program!

I want to purchase the software then not worry about it. For instance when I travel, I dont want to be bogged down with downloads and upgrades chewing up my bandwidth. I have traveled to many places where internet access is very limited. Downloading from a wireless card in China is painful, I dont want to be bogged down with no software or large megabyte downloads costing me a fortune on the other side of the planet.

Adobe I know that I am just one person and you will probably not listen to me but did someone ask? No one asked me about this. How simple could this be - I want to buy the software then use it when I want where I want, is this too much to ask?

Please let me continue to use this software in the way that I have used it for so long. If others wish to have the creative cloud then great! More power to them, don't alienate your other users. Please provide both alternatives.

Best regards - Matt

[Brntoki]

I posted this in response to staff in the thread you linked to. What do you think? Is it just me?

Is it just me, or is there a deliberate blurring of lines here?

It sounds like you're saying that CS6 products can be downloaded and installed from within a cloud subscription only. Now, perhaps that is what the OP wants, I'm not 100% sure (though it didn't sound like it at first --- he may be under the impression that it's the only way to actually dl cs6).

Either way, I suggest you be very, very, clear or you are going to end up dealing with extremely pissed off customers. If I were looking for CS6 and staff suggested, or carelessly made it seem, that I could only get it by first getting a CC subscription, I would make it my life  mission to destroy Adobe (Yeah, that's exaggeration, but I was already being wildly hypothetical anyway --- there isn't a snowball's chance in hell I'd ever pony up for anything with Adobe printed on it).

[Guest]

This is amazing and disturbing.  It almost sounds like a good movie -- unfortunately we are trapped inside that movie and it is not fake it is real.

[ChicoCDM]

How did Adobe become an out of touch SCUM-BAG company? They tricked me into installing some Creative Cloud crap by making me believe it was a CS6 update. I WANT NOTHING TO DO WITH CREATIVE CLOUD! SCUMBAGS!

[Guest]

In the UK that is illegal under the unsolicted sale of goods act.... there is probably similar legislation in the US

appaulling

[Brntoki]

Chazinbermuda wrote:

In the UK that is illegal under the unsolicted sale of goods act.... there is probably similar legislation in the US

appaulling

"appaulling" typical and expected.

[Guest]

yes I am going blind and dyslexic 🙂

[wms1]

Adobe are you listening??????? I was planning on upgrading to CS7 until

this subscription crap came out. As it is I bought Corel Draw Graphics

suite X6.

[FastFeet]

"As a Creative Cloud member, you can download and install CC applications in any language in which the products are available. Unlike buying traditional software, where all components are in the same language, Creative Cloud lets you select from multiple languages for each product. So you can have different language versions of each product depending on your needs."
http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/tech-specs.edu.html


I just found out that this is not true at all! (is there any statement by Adobe that we can believe?)

1) Be aware that the update of the installation manager doesn't care for your previous language setting. It will automatically default to your OS language. You need to switch the language before you install the CC apps!!

2) If you want to download another language the installation manager does NOT download the language packs only as stated by Adobe. It downloads the complete 20GB again. Nobody at support has a clue why.

3) Even after installing the whole 20GB twice you still can't switch the language except for Photoshop. It also works for Lightroom or Air apps like Muse, but they seem to support anyway different languages. Still you can download and install it again with a different language setting. All for nothing!

What a mess this cloud is!

[Jeff_Know1]

This is from June 18, 2013.

© Seeking Alpha - I can quote up to 400 words (It's now 400 words by removing the names of the people who asked the questions)

"Adobe Systems Management Discusses Q2 2013 Results - Earnings Call Transcript"

Question:

[...], you talked about evaluating options to accommodate customers that are resisting the move to Creative Cloud. What types of solutions are you considering? And does this in any way impact your confidence in achieving your subgoals for the full year?

Shantanu Narayen

[...], fundamentally, when we see the results that we've had, I mean, it's clear to us that our strategy is spot on. And actually, our execution has been pretty outstanding. As you realize, with any major change like this, we're looking for tweaks that would lead to a better customer and business outcome. We don't have any that we've identified today, but we're pretty confident of all of the results and the metrics that we've identified at the beginning of the year. So we continue to be very positive about the opportunity.

It sure sounds Adobe is coming up with solutions to some of our 'concerns'. 

"Adobe Systems Management Discusses Q2 2013 Results - Earnings Call Transcript"

Question:

[...] When I look at your base of people that have bought license, point solutions and the suites across the CS family. It's about 12-million-plus. Do you think it's unrealistic to expect the vast majority of them or maybe perhaps all of them over the very long term to move into a complete subscription model?

Mark S. Garrett

I think that's a little unrealistic. I think there will be people, and we assumed this when we rolled out this strategy 2 years ago, that maybe fall by the wayside. But we would certainly try to get as many as possible. And we will get a lot of them, but I don't think it's fair to see [ph] that we'd get every single one.

  Walking $ signs. That's what we are.

"Adobe Systems Management Discusses Q2 2013 Results - Earnings Call Transcript"

Question:

Shantanu, you mentioned earlier that the bulk of customers are, in fact, on the full product. But if you look at the sequential trends and the data, the annual demand or proportion has been increasing relatively more than the demand for full Creative Cloud, suggesting relatively strong momentum over the last few quarters sequentially for the point products. Is that something that you might expect will continue for the balance of the year? Has that played out as you thought it might in terms of that recent relative momentum of point versus full?

Shantanu Narayen

I would say overall, Jay, it's played out relatively in line with our expectations. And I think we continue to believe that the entire offering is really where people will, hopefully, migrate to, and that the point products are a great on-ramp to the entire Creative Cloud offering.

It's almost as if customers know perpetual licenses are actually the better deal.

[W_J_T]

^ Unbelievable how out of touch those responses are. I wish he would come answer a few of the questions on CC problems here at the forum since the CC launch that people are posting, since everything is so wonderful and all.

[Jongware]

.. we assumed this when we rolled out this strategy 2 years ago ..

Say whuh? Two years ... wasn't that when they also "rolled out the strategy" that you cannot upgrade anymore than from One Version Earlier?

Yes it is: http://blogs.adobe.com/conversations/2011/11/adobe-creative-cloud-and-adobe-creative-suite-new-choic... (dated November 2011):

With regards to upgrades, we are changing our policy for perpetual license customers. In order to qualify for upgrade pricing when CS6 releases, customers will need to be on the latest version of our software (either CS5 or CS5.5 editions)

[toxic_waltz]

Koolaid anyone?

The CEO is clearly a spin doctor removed from reality and eating his own bull crap based upon statistics that mean nothing  - generated forced fed from one sided surveys. He too is lost in a dream land called the cloud. If anything, Adobe's tech support will bring the cloud down. The lack of skilled employees from a 3rd world country WILL be the undoing of this pipe dream.

Good on ya Adobe. Your own product and people shall sink the ship.

[jbjones]

wms1 wrote:

Adobe are you listening??????? I was planning on upgrading to CS7 until

this subscription crap came out. As it is I bought Corel Draw Graphics

suite X6.

I've been thinking about getting a copy of X6. How does it handle?

[toxic_waltz]

https://twitter.com/xDanMorgan/status/337667336339345409

The common tech support from Adobe India, is sorry that I can't answer your question, let me transfer you to another assocuate higher up. The problem is the dip $HIT higher up is just ad dumb and the prior moron.

[ManndarrPat]

It's always possible to wake someone from sleep, but no amount of noise will wake someone who is pretending to be asleep.

Adobe is forgetting one important thing that all the loyal customer who are spending their time writing post they have paid for cs6 or any version, that may be $500 or whatever is 0.000001 percent of your earnings.

Adobe don't forget one of the interesting law of science by Newton, every action has equal or opposite reaction it also applicable to marketing side too. Its just a matter of time. And even worst part is considering and forcing the customer - instead of listening to the customer.

I think we are not in a position to send message to adobe about creative cloud but Wall Street will send message to adobe.

Also hats off to Steve Job's vision when he ditched flash, one extract from his Thoughts on Flash published in 2010, he forecasted

Adobe’s Flash products are 100% proprietary. They are only available from Adobe, and Adobe has sole authority as to their future enhancement, pricing, etc. While Adobe’s Flash products are widely available, this does not mean they are open, since they are controlled entirely by Adobe and available only from Adobe. By almost any definition, Flash is a closed system.

[teho59]

wms1 wrote:

Adobe are you listening???????

When a company is listening to their customer this can happen: http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update

Microsoft turned around 100% on all their new restriction on XBox due to the feedback from their customers!

But, the BIG differences with this case and Adobe is that Microsoft and Xbox is in a much tougher marked and has competition. Adobe is much more alone. But they will get a lot more comptetition (or piracy will increase) if they don't turn around too and start listening to their customers.

Message was edited by: teho59

[Paul_Taylor]

teho59 wrote:

wms1 wrote:

Adobe are you listening???????

When a company is listening to their customer this can happen: http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update

Microsoft turned around 100% on all their new restriction on XBox due to the feedback from their customers!

But, the BIG differences with this case and Adobe is that Microsoft and Xbox is in a much tougher marked and has competition. Adobe is much more alone. But they will get a lot more comptetition (or piracy will increase) if they don't turn around too and start listening to their customers.

Message was edited by: teho59

They really don't have any competition unlike XBox, Office etc. They bought up the competition. That's why they can take thier customers to the cleaners. Shame it was under the guise of regular updates (which despite them saying otherwise, can be done online and set aside with permanent licenses at any time) and piracy protection (which, as above, looks like it has already been circumvented).

They are listening alright - just choosing not to hear, while hoping that the Captive Customers bank roll the company. I hope each and every member of staff feels proud they are working for a company that (based on recent marketing releases and feedback here) many users no longer trust to speak a word of truth. 

I wonder if BBC Watchdog would be interested in doing a program on them and their 'happy' customers.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74

[bitm07]

I'm considering purchasing Coral software as well.  The survey gave me hope that a version of CC that made business sense was on the way, but if they are only accepting pro CC opinions I see little hope of a positive outcome.

[wms1]

I only recently made the purchase however like Adobe, Corel offers a thirty day free trial. It can be found at http://www.corel.com/corel/product/index.jsp?pid=prod4260069&cid=catalog20038&segid=5700006 Down load a copy try it out and see how you like it. From my very limited experience there is a lot of usefulness there, but it seems to have its strengths and weaknesses, just like previous versions of CS. The photo editing portion is very diferent, and seems to lack some of my favorite photoshop tools, but that could easily mean that I just havent found the corisponding tool yet. (I'be been using photoshop sense CS-2 and Elements before that going back to the predicessor of elements 1, so Im far more famelear with those tool icons and where they are found that with this new program).

From what I have seen so far Draw is more powerful than Paint, unless you are actually using the program to paint with, There eem to be more options in painting (which is something I do not do) than in photo editing. As for some of teh other pieces of the suite I haven't used them enough to get a feel for them yet.

[bitm07]

I download the trial of Coral PaintShop Pro (X5 ultimate a think) a while back.  Seemed to have a good range of features however the RAW processor was extremely basic compared to Lightroom 4.  So am hoping that future versions of Lightroom don't become subscription only.  Other than that I think I could live with Paintshop

[Lee_Jay]

Adobe needs to take a lesson from Microsoft:

http://beta.fool.com/markhibben/2013/06/20/microsoft-does-an-xbox-one-eighty/37899/?source=eogyholnk...

(emphasis added)

Microsoft Does an Xbox One – Eighty

"In the announcement, Microsoft reversed all the essential elements of the DRM system it had intended to impose with Xbox One (XB1).  Gone is the requirement to be always connected to the Internet, or check in with Microsoft once a day.  Any disk-based single player game will be playable offline after installation, although the disc will need to be in the tray.  Also gone are the new limitations on used games.  Sharing, lending, or giving disc-based games will work as it does on Xbox 360.

The speed with which Microsoft caved on DRM has been truly breathtaking. I really didn't expect it to come before Sony's PS4 and the XB1 had an opportunity to go toe-to-toe in the market place, and that wasn't going to happen before the end of the year, since Sony had announced a late December release. 

Apparently Microsoft read some of the polls I mentioned in my last post on the subject, "Sony and Microsoft Battle for Hearts and Minds at E3."  The response to Microsoft's DRM approach was resoundingly negative, and continuing to pursue it would have set Microsoft up for a flop of epic proportions. "

...

[Greg_Bohn]

> Adobe needs to take a lesson from Microsoft:

  In the Microsoft case, I think it was the very real threat of the Sony PS4 that made the difference to get them to make a U-turn.

  In Adobe's case, they seem to be counting of the lack of any single big threat. So with Adobe, its "Customers be damned, full steam ahead!". (Not that MS wouldn't have done the same thing if they thought they could've gotten away with it...)

[Andy_Bay]

I think you are right.

Adobe does have one huge threat though: The fact that most people will simply not see the need to upgrade. I think their old software is in a way their biggest competitor.

There is absolutely nothing must-have in CC.

First I thought Cinema 4D light might be a killer feature for AE. Until I read what Mylenium had to say about the product (=it sucks). For those of you who don't know him, Mylenium is propably in the top 5 of voluntary contributors to the Adobe forums and he has an amazing amount of technical knowledge. When he says something suck, I believe it.

[bababongatwo]

There a link to his comment? As I OWN the right to use Cinema 4D studio, the Bridge between AE and C4D is the only feature which sounds interesting to me. But I had my doubts about, that this could already work in a satisfying manner. If I can hear now, that it sucks I would be glad. As I feel no disapointment about, not to have it - as CashCow (CC) is unacceptable, and I will never subscribe.
BtW: cinema itself is far away from a product that sucks. Even the bridge between both might be made a little bit to fast (they have to catch Cloudies and so I think, they did that very fast and buggy...)

----------

CC = Cash Cow = Terminating the word "Archive" in digital future = Lifelong dependency = NoGo = Never

[Guest]

I too will never sign up to the captive cloud! I have everything I need with the Creative Suite. Adobe can spin this however they wish but I have all the tools I need for as long as I need and don't need any of that ridiculous nonsense regarding bells and whistles and tweaky upgrades. Once they decide to revert this absolute colossal disaster of a decision, then maybe, just maybe I'll think about moving forward with Adobe. And if my computer dies before that, I still won't subcribe to cc just on principle. I'll find other means rather than giving any more of my money to this greedy and immoral company.