How do you get numbered lists to restart after a break?

Report · May 12, 2025

I've never seen this behavior in software before: Numbered lists in InDesign just continue incrementing their numbers, even when the list has been interrupted by some other kind of paragraph (which, in the vast majority of cases, means you are now in a new list).

So... are we seriously doomed to the tedium of fixing the numbering on every first item of every list manually? And then, if we later want to add an item to the top of the list, we must not only set that entry to start at 1, but also go to the now-second entry and fix it so it isn't also #1?

Report · May 12, 2025

You've two options - have higher level in between - or you can manually "start" list from 1.

https://helpx.adobe.com/uk/indesign/using/bullets-numbering.html

Report · May 12, 2025

Welcome back @Thomas_Calvin!

You can restart a numbered list manually or you can leverage your old FraneMaker logic and use another paragraph to restart the list for you. Based on how you worded your question, I think you want to go with option number two.

I detailed both in this blog post: https://www.rockymountaintraining.com/adobe-indesign-restart-numbered-lists-automatically/

Come back and ask if you have any questions.

~Barb

Report · May 13, 2025

Thanks Barb!

This is an instance where I can mock the dumbness of InDesign's behavior while acknowledging that there's an effort here to make a really flexible and cool feature.

To follow up on the method your link describes and that Eugene describes: It didn't work for me at first, but I think I found the issue:

If you set up your base style (from which all your other styles descend) at numbering level 1 (I just left the list as "default"), and you set up descendant styles with numbering level 2 as described... numbers still won't start over in those descendants unless every parent between them and the base class also has numbering enabled (albeit blank). Although it looks like the number options from your base style are going to pass through to grandchildren (if you look at intervening styles, the numbering options are greyed out if numbering is off; but they show the options inherited from the parent style). But they don't.

It looks like the immediate parent of your style must have numbering on, even if it's just inheriting the level-1 stuff from the ultimate parent. At first I though every parent between the base and the style on the numbered text had to have numbering on, but it seems that you can have a non-numbered ancestor in between the base style and the one you actually applied... as long as the immediate parent has it on...

Actually, now I'm experimenting, and I have no idea what the rule is. But it appears that intervening ancestors can interfere if their numbering is off.

Report · May 13, 2025

Hi @Thomas_Calvin:

I'm not 100% sure I'm following. Numbers can start over per story or continue across stories or even books – it depends on how you set up the named list. You will see this dialog box as you created a named list, and can access it later in Type > Bulleted and Numbered Lists > Define List > Edit.

But, I think you're saying that it's working now? If it's not, I'm happy to take a look to explain what's going on. Unfortunately, I'm heading out on a sailing adventure for the next few days so I won't have time to look at it until Friday morning. Of course, Eugene can help you troubleshoot it as well.

~Barb

Report · May 13, 2025

Thanks Barb! Have fun! I crewed on a 38-foot Catalina for a while.

I'm saying that this won't work:

Basic Paragraph (Numbering on, Level 1, starting at 1)
Basic Indent (based on Basic Paragraph, numbering off)
Numbered (based on Basic Indent, numbering on, level 2, reset after different level)

If you have a hierarchy of styles as above, it won't work. Basic Indent will show what it inherits from Basic Paragraph, but Numbered will not reset its numbers as expected after Basic Indent or other styles based on Basic Paragraph. It appears that the numbering is broken by having it off in the immediate parent.

Actually, the grandparent relationship probably doesn't even matter. My guess is that any child will not renumber properly if any parent style has numbering turned off.

Report · May 13, 2025

@Thomas_Calvin

Can you share your INDD file?

Just so I can test your theory on your file - I'm not sure if I would be able to correctly reproduce your description - the "parents" part.

Report · May 13, 2025

See if the above clarifies, Robert. If that's not sufficient I can probably strip a file down.

Report · May 13, 2025

See if the above clarifies, Robert. If that's not sufficient I can probably strip a file down.

By @Thomas_Calvin

Yeah, one second, I'm on fire today 😉

Report · May 13, 2025

@Thomas_Calvin

Works for me:

Report · May 13, 2025

@Thomas_Calvin

As "Basic Indent" has Numbering OFF - why it should be resetting anything?

In this case - only [Basic Paragraph] is resetting numbering.

Report · May 13, 2025

Because Basic Indent inherits from Basic Paragraph, which is a level-1 style. It does not override any of its parent's numbering settings, since its own numbering is off.

Report · May 13, 2025

Because Basic Indent inherits from Basic Paragraph, which is a level-1 style. It does not override any of its parent's numbering settings, since its own numbering is off.

By @Thomas_Calvin

But turning OFF some property IS an override...

Report · May 13, 2025

@Thomas_Calvin

Report · May 13, 2025

That's one way to see it. I saw it as turning off the entire section.

Either way, there is no apparent way to simply pass through a parent's numbering settings, the way you can pass through other style properties.

Report · May 13, 2025

That's one way to see it. I saw it as turning off the entire section.

Either way, there is no apparent way to simply pass through a parent's numbering settings, the way you can pass through other style properties.

By @Thomas_Calvin

But if you're defining lower level - there is no "link" with higher level.

You can define it any way you want - you can include marker of the precious level - but otherwise - those will be completely unrelated styles.

They can be even from different groups / folders.

Report · May 13, 2025

I don't know what you mean. A style being "based on" another style is most certainly a link, and (in general) the lower-level style inherits the characteristics of its parent.

Report · May 13, 2025

I don't know what you mean. A style being "based on" another style is most certainly a link, and (in general) the lower-level style inherits the characteristics of its parent.

By @Thomas_Calvin

Yes, but in that case - I was referring to just the Numbering part - it's not linked / related in any way to the higher level.

Only LEVEL and LIST properties tell InDesign what to do - the rest of the properties - including BasedOn - are completely ignored.

Report · May 13, 2025

@Thomas_Calvin

You can have Level 5 - without having Levels 1 to 4.

Or you can have Level 1 - and then Level 3.

Report · May 13, 2025

The numbering levels aren't the issue here. The dysfunction was caused simply by the on/off switch for "numbering" inside each style. If it's "off" anywhere in a style's ancestors, it will not behave as expected.

Report · May 13, 2025

The numbering levels aren't the issue here. The dysfunction was caused simply by the on/off switch for "numbering" inside each style. If it's "off" anywhere in a style's ancestors, it will not behave as expected.

By @Thomas_Calvin

But it behaves as it should?

Report · May 13, 2025

If you ensure that every member of the entire parent hierarchy of styles has the "Numbering" options toggled on, then the numbering will behave as expected when you assign the child style to some text.

Report · May 13, 2025

Tagging others who might help clarify things 😉

@Joel Cherney, @James Gifford—NitroPress, @Peter Kahrel, @Laubender, @rob day, @leo.r, @Dave Creamer of IDEAS

Maybe I'm missing something?

Report · May 13, 2025

Why? It seems that the situation has been resolved at this point. What are you pursuing further?

Report · May 13, 2025

Why? It seems that the situation has been resolved at this point. What are you pursuing further?

By @Thomas_Calvin

I'm sorry, but to me it sounds like you still think that there is something wrong in my explanation - so maybe I'm wrong and would like to be corrected?