Spine Width?

[Hello it's Hayley]

Hello! 

Can anyone help me calculate what my spine width should be? I have been asked to prepare a catalogue for print that was designed by someone else. The print specifications are as follows:

A4 - 210 x 297 mm,

PUR glue (longer side)

Pages 84 + 4, 

 mat 300g + mat 170g, 

(4/4)+(4/4), 

Mat laminatem cover

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated! 

[Willi Adelberger]

Only your printer knows the answer. 

[Hello it's Hayley]

Thanks Willi! I thought that might be the case as well. But I'm not the most knowledgable when it comes to prepping this kind of thing for print so I wasn't sure if I was just uninformed. I have requested that the printer sends through the measurements. 

[Willi Adelberger · Accepted solution]

Every printer has this information and they will give the information.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

@Hello it's Hayley

Can you get your hands on few sheets of the paper it will be printed on?

Then do a mockup - or at least put 84x small pieces together + cover. 

[Willi Adelberger]

Not pnly the paper, also the glue and the technique of binding has the influence.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

Not pnly the paper, also the glue and the technique of binding has the influence.

By @Willi Adelberger

I never saw a book - with spine thicker than "the rest"?

Definitely, not a 84 page fully glued catalogue? 

[Randy Hagan]

Signatures have a say in that too.

Even at 84 internal pages, thicker quality stock may stack up differently if that book is put together with a 64+16+4 compared to assembling 21 4-ups into that glue bind — or with today's digital press workflows, when you can order book guts built with 42 page sheets, printed front and back.

Even after the book is trimmed, those signature folds inside the glue bind make a difference. That's why the only way to be absolutely sure is to order a folding dummy for the job before setting it up to go to press. Measuring from that is easy.

Randy

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

How the cover wraps is one factor — the distance from the back edge of sheet 1 to the back edge of sheet (erm) 42 an vary, and if you measure, you will often find there's a mm or two of thickness variation as well.

You can set up a cover to be very forgiving (avoid color breaks etc. right at the corners, allow a wide trim range at the outer edge, etc.) but absolutely nothing replaces a hard figure from a printer who has the interior specs in hand.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

@James Gifford—NitroPress

I don't think it will be "saddle stitched"?

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

My answer had nothing to do with a stitched binding, which essentially has no spine. The OP says glued block.

[JamesWamser]

Absolutely agree, nothing replaces getting the spine width (and other specs) from the printer. 

[Pariah Burke]

I covered exactly how to calculate spine widths in my video course InDesign CC Designing a Book Cover and Spine, which you can watch free with a 10-day trial account here: https://www.pluralsight.com/courses/indesign-cc-book-cover-spine

Spoiler alert: It's a matter of looking up the thickness of your chosen paper stock multiplied by the number of pages.

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

Spoiler alert: It's a matter of looking up the thickness of your chosen paper stock multiplied by the number of pages.

By @Pariah Burke

That's exactly what I was suggesting 😉 

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

It has never been difficult to find generic infornation on calculating spine width. While this value might be useful for preliminary design, only a value from the actual printer/binder, which incorporates a half-dozen factors other than simple paper stack height, should be used for final print submission.

There is, IME, no source for an accurate figure other than from the printer who will actually run the job. Even one producing the same binding using the same equipment might have things calibrated differently, just to begin with.