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Answered

Help with Lightroom CC display settings - Library v Develop

Forum|Forum|4 years ago
February 18, 2021
8 replies
1971 views

A few months ago, I got a new PC and had to re-install the software. I thought I had set it up correctly, there really weren't a lot of choices to make. It was not possible to compare settings from the old machine as the new PC was a replacement.

Anyway, I started noticing really long import times so I changed the Build Previews to Minimal and that seemed to help. But I noticed a difference in what I was seeing. Today it was really noticeable on these portraits.

Here is the one I edited in Develop mode:

And here it is when I switched back to Library - I was like WTH???

In short, the photos are not sharp in Develop mode - I shoot real estate professionally, and sharpness is critical so I've been able to work around it until I had time to research it; I know there's something wrong because I wasn't experiencing this on the old PC a few months back.

In this scenario, though, I WANT the softer look, but these two photos look more like a Before and After in reverse.

Here is the System Info I was able to get - may be helpful, IDK. Hope someone can help me get this straightened out....

Lightroom Classic version: 10.1.1 [ 202101041610-8c69aa4e ]
License: Creative Cloud
Language setting: en
Operating system: Windows 10 - Home Premium Edition
Version: 10.0.19042
Application architecture: x64
System architecture: x64
Logical processor count: 4
Processor speed: 3.6 GHz
SqLite Version: 3.30.1
Built-in memory: 8028.0 MB
Real memory available to Lightroom: 8028.0 MB
Real memory used by Lightroom: 1096.3 MB (13.6%)
Virtual memory used by Lightroom: 3528.2 MB
GDI objects count: 985
USER objects count: 2614
Process handles count: 2879
Memory cache size: 10.0MB
Internal Camera Raw version: 13.1 [ 658 ]
Maximum thread count used by Camera Raw: 3
Camera Raw SIMD optimization: SSE2,AVX,AVX2
Camera Raw virtual memory: 436MB / 4014MB (10%)
Camera Raw real memory: 458MB / 8028MB (5%)
System DPI setting: 96 DPI
Desktop composition enabled: Yes
Displays: 1) 1600x900
Input types: Multitouch: No, Integrated touch: No, Integrated pen: No, External touch: No, External pen: No, Keyboard: No

Graphics Processor Info:
DirectX: Intel(R) UHD Graphics 630 (26.20.100.8141)

Application folder: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Lightroom Classic
Library Path: C:\Users\alle1\OneDrive\Pictures\Lightroom\Lightroom Catalog.lrcat
Settings Folder: C:\Users\alle1\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\Lightroom

Installed Plugins:
1) AdobeStock
2) Facebook
3) Flickr
4) Nikon Tether Plugin

Config.lua flags: None

Adapter #1: Vendor : 8086
Device : 3e91
Subsystem : 9981028
Revision : 0
Video Memory : 128
Adapter #2: Vendor : 1414
Device : 8c
Subsystem : 0
Revision : 0
Video Memory : 0
AudioDeviceIOBlockSize: 1024
AudioDeviceName: Speakers (Realtek(R) Audio)
AudioDeviceNumberOfChannels: 2
AudioDeviceSampleRate: 48000
Build: LR5x64
Direct2DEnabled: false
GL_ACCUM_ALPHA_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_BLUE_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_GREEN_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_RED_BITS: 16
GL_ALPHA_BITS: 8
GL_BLUE_BITS: 8
GL_DEPTH_BITS: 24
GL_GREEN_BITS: 8
GL_MAX_3D_TEXTURE_SIZE: 2048
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE: 16384
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_UNITS: 8
GL_MAX_VIEWPORT_DIMS: 16384,16384
GL_RED_BITS: 8
GL_RENDERER: Intel(R) UHD Graphics 630
GL_SHADING_LANGUAGE_VERSION: 4.60 - Build 26.20.100.8141
GL_STENCIL_BITS: 8
GL_VENDOR: Intel
GL_VERSION: 4.6.0 - Build 26.20.100.8141
GPUDeviceEnabled: false
OGLEnabled: true

I stopped copying at GL_Extensions because it just looks like a bunch of garbled nonsense and goes on for about a mile. If needed, let me know.

This topic has been closed for replies.

Correct answer Todd Shaner

The Detail panel settings are unique to this image (out of focus) so I wouldn't use the settings for a preset. Make sure you are at 100% Zoom view and adjust Sharpening Radius by holding down the ALT key, which helps to visualize the edge sharpening. This article should be helpful:

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/retouch-photos.html#sharpening_and_noise_reduction

For the Basic panel Tone control ssettings adjustment the below article should be helpful:

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/tone-control-adjustment.html

There was an issue with LrC 9.3 that caused the Library module to appear sharper than the Develop module at 33% or less Zoom view setting. This appears to be fixed in LrC 10.1.1 on my system, but it's possible some users are still seeing this issue.n (GPU dependent?).

https://feedback.photoshop.com/conversations/lightroom-classic/library-preview-zoom-interpolation-changed/5f5f462c4b561a3d4277ef23

You can try again turning off GPU support and close & restart LrC as suggested in my post above.

That may now make a difference using my suggested settings. If so then you are experiencing the issue I have reported at the above link.

Concerning the camera settings you can try setting the focus points to one central zone. Thta should place the focus directly on the model's face as you've composed the shot in the uncropped image. What camera model?

J

Jao vdL

Community Expert

I think the sharpness issue has already been addressed but I am also seeing a difference in tint in the image between the screenshots in Library and Develop. The Library screenshot is beigish and the develop screenshot has a bit more blue in it. This is typically due to a bad monitor profile which means your monitor needs to be recalibrated. This is very common on windows machines and is usually caused by bad monitor profiles installed by drivers for the monitor. It can affect perceived sharpness because it can affect contrast.

Todd Shaner

Brainiac

I think the sharpness issue has already been addressed but I am also seeing a difference in tint in the image between the screenshots in Library and Develop. The Library screenshot is beigish and the develop screenshot has a bit more blue in it. This is typically due to a bad monitor profile which means your monitor needs to be recalibrated.
By @Jao vdL

Jao, I down loaded the two screenshots (double-arrow launch & Save As) and they are R=G=B on the whole B&W image and GUI. I think it's an optical illusion due to difference in apparent sharpening.

J

Jao vdL

Community Expert

Thanks. I think you are right. Interesting how this sort of thing can easily fool your brain!

Todd ShanerCorrect answer

Brainiac

The Detail panel settings are unique to this image (out of focus) so I wouldn't use the settings for a preset. Make sure you are at 100% Zoom view and adjust Sharpening Radius by holding down the ALT key, which helps to visualize the edge sharpening. This article should be helpful:

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/retouch-photos.html#sharpening_and_noise_reduction

For the Basic panel Tone control ssettings adjustment the below article should be helpful:

https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/help/tone-control-adjustment.html

There was an issue with LrC 9.3 that caused the Library module to appear sharper than the Develop module at 33% or less Zoom view setting. This appears to be fixed in LrC 10.1.1 on my system, but it's possible some users are still seeing this issue.n (GPU dependent?).

https://feedback.photoshop.com/conversations/lightroom-classic/library-preview-zoom-interpolation-changed/5f5f462c4b561a3d4277ef23

You can try again turning off GPU support and close & restart LrC as suggested in my post above.

That may now make a difference using my suggested settings. If so then you are experiencing the issue I have reported at the above link.

Concerning the camera settings you can try setting the focus points to one central zone. Thta should place the focus directly on the model's face as you've composed the shot in the uncropped image. What camera model?

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

My apologies to all for the lengthy absence. I haven't really had time to fully explore all the suggestions.

For this photo, I used my Nikon D5600 with prime lens and built-in flash, on the Portrait scene setting with a 10 second timer. (I thought that mode would set the focus point to central?). I think the timer could create the issue of the backdrop being the focus as the model was not in the scene yet.

The D5600 is a backup camera. My preferred camera and the one I use for real estate photography is a Nikon D7000.

Upon further analysis, I'm not seeing the same issues, at least to the degree where it's obviously noticeable, when using the D7000 and LRCC. I've downloaded several photos since and do not see the difference in viewing.

Now I'm thinking it's something with the camera settings and/or how this camera (D5600) is interacting with LR. I've noticed once in a while that the lens corrections don't seem to apply, I will see curved walls where there is no curved wall and lens correction doesn't change anything, even when LR is reading the right lens. Not to be bringing up a new issue, I just am now thinking there are more issues that seem to maybe be camera-related or settings related.

In order to fix this photo, I ditched the Nikons altogether and pulled out an old Lumix point and shoot - downloaded the photos into LR and had no issues. Mission accomplished.

I just need to dive into the Nikon D5600 in more depth I guess.

Thanks so much for the detailed info and links for further study!

Todd Shaner

Brainiac

For this photo, I used my Nikon D5600 with prime lens and built-in flash, on the Portrait scene setting with a 10 second timer. (I thought that mode would set the focus point to central?). I think the timer could create the issue of the backdrop being the focus as the model was not in the scene yet.

It appears the Portrait scene setting is the cause of your focus issue. It sets the camera to Auto-Area AF so you have no control over the focus point selection. Since you're shooting raw file format there's really no need to use the Scene mode settings as most of them are applied only to the the in-camera JPEG image file. I suggest using aperture priority, shutter priority, or program mode setting. I use aperture priority 99% of the time so I can choose it manually for the setting I want to use.

https://imaging.nikon.com/support/digitutor/d5600/functions/afareamode_finder.html

Now I'm thinking it's something with the camera settings and/or how this camera (D5600) is interacting with LR. I've noticed once in a while that the lens corrections don't seem to apply, I will see curved walls where there is no curved wall and lens correction doesn't change anything, even when LR is reading the right lens.

I don't see this issue with Nikon D5600 NEFs downloaded from the Web. What lens are you using?

Todd Shaner

Brainiac

I can see the difference in sharpening with the DNG file. It appears to be due to using a very high Sharpening Amount setting (103) and Luminace setting (77). The Library and Develop modules use different interpolation types (Bilinear and Bicubic), which will look different with very high Detail panel settings. In addition the camera focus is on the drop cloth in the background with the models face very out of focus. This is causing some double line artifacts due to lens astimatism, which exacerbates the sharpening diffeence between the Develop and Library modules.

Try the below settings.

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

Thank you - now I feel like we're getting somewhere. Part of the problem is probably because I was using a self-timer (and scene mode for portrait) and it must have set the focus on the backdrop (to be replaced obviously) every time. I might have to switch cameras and use the wireless remote to eliminate some of this.

Normally I am editing real estate photos and maybe not seeing some of these minute differences, but I do still notice them when switiching between views in some photos.

Do you suggest these settings as a preset? Or just as a fix for this particular photo?

Thank you!!

Todd Shaner

Brainiac

Can you upload the raw file for the picture you posted with your Develop settings to a file sharing site (Dropbox, etc.). Export it to DNG file format as shown below, which will embed your settings. Please verify that the DNG file exhibits the same sharpening difference between the Develop and Library modules. We can then see if the issue appears on our systems.

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

Thank you. I hope I did this correctly. I just exported the file per your instructions.

Here's the dng file:

https://we.tl/t-kusZnO7br5

I'm not exactly sure how to "verify that the DNG file exhibits the same sharpening difference between the Develop and Library modules".

The exported dng photo does not look like the photo appears in Develop mode - luminance gone, etc, the edits I made don't seem to be visible.

When I export the photo as jpg, my edits are visible: (just not in Library)

https://we.tl/t-chNLJ9p00p

I appreciate your help, sorry I don't have enough knowledge of LR to make this easier.

GoldingD

Brainiac

Second, Library and Develop use different color spaces, and will never be absolutly 100% the same.

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

I hope to get this resolved soon. Like I said before, I did not have this issue at all on the previous PC, and it was garbage.

My edits looked exactly the same in Develop view as they did when I switched back to Library view for exporting.

I believe it has something to do with LR settings when I set up the software on the new PC. Very frustrating to say the least.

GoldingD

Brainiac

From your System Info

Displays: 1) 1600x900
Input types: Multitouch: No, Integrated touch: No, Integrated pen: No, External touch: No, External pen: No, Keyboard: No

Graphics Processor Info:
DirectX: Intel(R) UHD Graphics 630 (26.20.100.8141)

So less than 4K, and an Integrated Video Control as opposed to an Dedicated GPU. If LrC even allows it, turn off use GPU, as Todd Shaner stated. That feature is of no use, and probably detrimental on your rig.

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

Thanks, I'll try.

Todd Shaner

Brainiac

Try turning off GPU support. Go to Edit> Preferences> Performance and set 'Use Graphics Processor' to Off. Close LrC, restart it, and try again.

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

Thank you, I will try that.

I imported new photos this morning and selected 1:1 preview option. It may have made a small difference, but this is certainly not how the program was working previously, it slows down import time considerably.

Fingers crossed!

P

PJB_2016Author

Known Participant

I did that, but it did not seem to make a difference in the view issues I'm experiencing.

May help with import speed?

Anyway, with all this experimenting, it appears the edited image I see in Develop is the one that is actually exporting, which is critical of course. Guessing I'll just have to find a way to get used to seeing images in the Library that aren't true representations of the edited photo in Develop module.

Thank you -

D Fosse

Community Expert

These are not the same zoom ratio. Screen resampling plays a huge part in perceived sharpness.

To get an absolutely accurate preview, you need to view at 100% (1:1) - one image pixel represented by exactly one screen pixel.

Other zoom ratios are less reliable. Even at the same (odd) ratio you may see small differences because of different resampling algorithms, especially for noisy images.