P: Generative Remove Feedback (Lr Classic & Lr Eco)

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

This post applies to Lightroom Classic and the Lightroom Ecosystem products.

Camera Raw feedback can be found here.

Generative Remove makes it easier to remove unwanted objects and distractions with a simple gesture, even on complex backgrounds. For more accurate results, be sure to include the object's shadow in your selection and/or expand its size. 

Detect Objects uses AI to find the objects underneath a brushed area. The masked areas will now appear larger than the Early Access version of this feature. You can also circle objects for quicker selection now. 

We have also updated the spot selection experience to make it easier to manage variations, switch the fill type, refine the selection area, or re-generate as needed. 

Batch updating is also now supported for Generative Remove spots. 

Try out the latest updates and share your feedback with us here. Please also include the following details in your post: 

• App version
• System details
• Example image(s) if you wish to share

Our team continually monitors this thread to track issues for future improvement. Thanks!

Lisa Ngo: Lightroom Product Manager

Posted by:

[SidewaysSyd]

Thanks John..that worked. I need to read up on how to use this - I had no idea about unchecking Detect Objects

[SidewaysSyd]

I was too quick to say it was ok. The pole was removed ok, but the word 'restaurant' on the awning behind has been corrupted. I've attached hte unedited original and a screenshot of the section of the edited version showing the crruption of the word restaurant and also the words on the board at the bottom of the pole

[John R Ellis]

@SidewaysSyd: "I had no idea about unchecking Detect Objects"

See this article for an excellent introduction to how to use Remove effectively:

https://www.lightroomqueen.com/generative-remove-replace/

As the article says, "Like any tool, you need to know how to use it properly to get the best results." I don't think Adobe is doing a very good job at helping people learn the tool.

"The pole was removed ok, but the word 'restaurant' on the awning behind has been corrupted."

Yeah, Remove doesn't do as well trying to generate fill-replacements for words. It usually generates gibberish "letters" in the same color and font style. (I haven't seen other tools able to do words reliably either.)

But surprisingly in this case, on my third try I was able to replace the pole cleanly, minimize the visual distortion to the sides of the pole, and get a pretty good replacement for the missing letters in "RESTAURANT" and the chalk board:

The things I did to make this happen: 

1. Uncheck Detect Objects. It's too crude for such fine control.

2. Brush straight lines using the same method as with other LR brushes: Click at one end, shift-click at the other.

3. Pick a width that's just a little bit wider than the pole but not too wide. I used two straight lines, for for the pole, one for the white sign at the top of the pole.

Here's what the brush stroke on the pole looks like:

I've attached the original JPEG you posted saved with the Develop settings containing the Remove brush strokes -- you can import it into your LR and go to the Remove tool to see the exact brush strokes.

[SidewaysSyd]

Thanks John. I never read anything about generative removal - I just tried by trial and error but learned how to do the simple things I need it to do. So I will read that lightroomqueen article. But I do agree that something has changed as shown by the many complaints from people.  Thanks for the downloads

[John R Ellis]

@SidewaysSyd: "I do agree that something has changed as shown by the many complaints from people."

Of the people who have provided sample photos here, the issues fall into different buckets: LR 14 increased the size of the Detect Objects border, which often hurts as much as it helps. The Opacity slider is now hidden when you first use the tool, and the LR upgrade infrequently and incorrectly changes the slider to 0.  But most of the people are tripping over things whose behavior hasn't changed (e.g. applying Remove on top of a crop or AI masking, or not selecting a shadow), but since they first encountered the issue soon after the upgrade, they assume it's an upgrade issue.

[steven30428533bjee]

Doesn't work any more. Tried to remove a picture that was hanging from a wall - it just replaced it with another picture. How does this get through QA? Put it back how it was please.

[wa-so]

Am I missing something, or has the opacity slider disappeared completely in the removal tool?

[John R Ellis]

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@wa-so: "Am I missing something, or has the opacity slider disappeared completely in the removal tool?"

The new user-interface design of the Remove tool in LR 14 makes it very easy to miss.  After you click Remove, it will appear with the other controls that let you modify the removal: 

[wa-so]

Oh yes, you're right!
Quite hidden compared to the previous version.

[vinceha]

Since the update, any generative AI + masks I have applied are automatically resetting every time I leave the photo or switch modules.  This means I have to constantly "update AI settings" for each photo and this is exhausting.

[John R Ellis]

LR 14 introduced a severe bug where LR wouldn't properly save the AI settings for masking and Remove. Adobe says that LR 14.0.1 fixes it, but there might be additional steps you might have to take (see the second reply):

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-bugs/p-subject-mask-from-previous-versions-are-requ...

[amrey329]

Lightroom Classic 14.0.1

The Generative AI is fabulous! One thing I feel could be eventually achieved to improve is some way to *save* AI changes we've accepted so they can be applied across other images for a consistent look. For example, I have images of a bride where her bra was up above the back of her gown, and it was Velcroed together. I used the Generative AI to remove the bra strap, and it performed marvelously. I kept the choice simple because I felt it would be my best option for trying to find a consistent-looking option every time. On the next image, when I went to remove the bra strap, it only offered elaborate designs no matter how many times I generated new options. Obviously, I had to just pick the closest one in shape, since the eye would notice that first, but the look is still quite different if you look at the images a few times. I don't think my bride will be upset; I think she'll be pleased that the bra strap isn't showing and that she has those images, but since they aren't exaactly a scene one would print, it should be fine. However, if it was one of my more high end clients, I'd have to just Photoshop it and spend way more time on it than I'd prefer in order to make it look like the exact same dress every time. Keep up the great work!

[David_Latini1083]

What a I supposed to enter in this space.

[John R Ellis]

@David_Latini1083, did you have a problem or question about the photo you attached?

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

Greetings all, 

Thank you for the feedback on the Generative Remove Feature thus far. We've noticed some comments in this thread that results from the Max release have, in some cases, been a regression from the August iteration of the feature. A change has been made on the server to address this today. 

For those of you who have seen sub-par results when compared with the August release, can you please rerun a few of your images through the Generative Remove tool again to see if the results have improved or if you are still facing issues? 

Thank you for your patience and we look forward to hearing additional feedback. 

[lex_9408]

Dear, 

Object removals works not always well. The area of the brushed area is larger but object removal is not accurate anymore especially in complex photo's.  Too much has been removed 

Best regards

Lex

[John R Ellis]

@lex_9408: "The area of the brushed area is larger but object removal is not accurate anymore especially in complex photo's.  Too much has been removed"

I think that in many cases, using Detect Objects makes the selection too big. In those cases, I usually get much better results unchecked it. If that doesn't help, please attach a full-resolution JPEG exported from the unmodified original photo (not a screenshot), so we and Adobe can see the issue in detail. With nearly everyone who has posted a problem photo, we've been able to show how to quickly remove the desired objects.

[lex_9408]

John R,

Thanks that works much better, but you would expect that object removal
would be much more accurate. I have attached the photo where I wanted
to remove the persons behind the dog


Met vriendelijke groet
Best regards

Lex

[lex_9408]

John,

I attached the one with removed objects
Now the original in jpeg


Met vriendelijke groet
Best regards

Lex

[John R Ellis]

 @lex_9408: "I attached the one with removed objects. Now the original in jpeg"

Your attachments didn't make it, unfortunately. You have to come back to the web to add them to your reply (drag them to the box right below the reply box).

[lex_9408]

[lex_9408]

Without object removal it works fine however I should expect better with it 

best regards Lex

[John R Ellis]

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@lex_9408: "Without object removal it works fine however I should expect better with it "

Agreed. Detect Objects is fine in simple cases, and can be a good starting point, but I often end up turning it off or significantly refining it manually.

Also, I was curious to see if the noisy background with the dog cages could be simplified.  It took three applications of Remove -- the left person, the clump of people on the right, and then the background, using the second variation of the background:

[David_Latini1083]

 Sorry, I don't have a reply.

[David_Latini1083]

I have only had a few problems with Generative Remove where the item to be replace wasn't replaced.    I tried to remove a power line pole and the replacement was a white looking pole.  I then went to use Color Efex and the Remove worked fine with the edit file it produced.