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16

P: Generative Remove Feedback (Lr Classic & Lr Eco)

Adobe Employee ,
Aug 13, 2024 Aug 13, 2024

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This post applies to Lightroom Classic and the Lightroom Ecosystem products.
Camera Raw feedback can be found here.
 
Generative Remove makes it easier to remove unwanted objects and distractions with a simple gesture, even on complex backgrounds. For more accurate results, be sure to include the object's shadow in your selection and/or expand its size. 
 
Detect Objects uses AI to find the objects underneath a brushed area. The masked areas will now appear larger than the Early Access version of this feature. You can also circle objects for quicker selection now. 
 
We have also updated the spot selection experience to make it easier to manage variations, switch the fill type, refine the selection area, or re-generate as needed. 
 
Batch updating is also now supported for Generative Remove spots. 
 
Try out the latest updates and share your feedback with us here. Please also include the following details in your post: 
  • App version
  • System details
  • Example image(s) if you wish to share

Our team continually monitors this thread to track issues for future improvement. Thanks!
 
Lisa Ngo: Lightroom Product Manager

 

Posted by:

Rikk Flohr: Adobe Photography Org
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macOS , Windows

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New Here ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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I have to be honest, I think the generative remove on LRC is more accurate than on Photoshop. It gives me way better options, especially with nature-related asks. 

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LEGEND ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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@hopeful_Dewdrop4822: "I think the generative remove on LRC is more accurate than on Photoshop. It gives me way better options, especially with nature-related asks."

 

Can you please post a couple examples here, so we can see in detail where Remove doesn't do as well? Attach a full-resolution JPEG exported from the unmodified original photo (not a screenshot).

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Explorer ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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I have had some really good results with Generative Remove. People and spots, birs, and so on, have vanished, but it really struggles with power or phone lines.

For some reason, it does not seem to find them to select, and rarely produces a seemless replacement, often leaving the powerline in place, or merely displacing it.

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LEGEND ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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@Stoneybroke: "it does not seem to find them to select, and rarely produces a seemless replacement, often leaving the powerline in place, or merely displacing it."

 

Removing objects along the edge of a photo requires a little extra care. First, uncheck Detect Objects (on by default in LR 14) -- it doesn't work well, especially with skinny objects and along the edges of photos. Second, undo any Crop, Lens Correction, and Transform, apply Remove, then reapply those commands. Remove tries to match the unselected cropped-out pixels.

 

If that doesn't help, then see this article for how to remove objects more reliably:
https://www.lightroomqueen.com/generative-remove-replace/

Most complaints about Remove are addressed in the article. But if it doesn't help, please attach a full-resolution JPEG exported from the unmodified original photo (not a screenshot), so we and Adobe can see the issue in detail. With nearly everyone who has posted a problem photo, we've been able to show how to quickly remove the desired objects.

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Explorer ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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I think the powerlines sit with the 'skinny objects' as, even though it passes across the whole picture, LR picks a block of sky which includes the wire, even though the wire is clear, then it just seems to shuffle the clouds a little, sometimes blurring the powerline, but not removing it.

I have just tried to get it to do a bad example on a powerline for a photo, but you cannot see the difference! 

I shall keep trying.

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Explorer ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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Attached - if you look closely, you can see the powerlines have been slightly distored where I tried to do it, and the sky has changed slightly.

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LEGEND ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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[This post contains formatting and embedded images that don't appear in email. View the post in your Web browser.]

 

@Stoneybroke, I was able to quickly remove the power lines, using separate applications of Remove for each segment of line, with Detect Objects turned off:

Screenshot 2024-11-15 at 1.20.36 PM.jpg

 

1. Did you undo any previous Crop, Lens Correction, and Transform before applying Remove?

 

2. Is the original photo raw?  If so, what's the exact make and model of the camera? (That matters for objects touching the edges.)

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Explorer ,
Nov 16, 2024 Nov 16, 2024

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Thank you for your advice, I have some interesting observations following some more experimentation when I have had time, this afternoon.

But first, the original image is a Canon DNG Raw file from Canon EOS 20D (not mine) and the above example had been processed before I attempted the removal.

I created a virtual copy and cleared all processing – this is just a segment of the original photo for ease - See image 1.

The below photos show my efforts after your advice.

#2. The powerlines appear to have been treated and gone using the settings you recommended.

#3. I then applied some processing in Develop Module - Lens Profile, Basic - Auto Tone, Preset - Storm Clouds, then some additional darkening of the masked sky. Sadly, the processing created artefacts, and the editing of the powerlines is now visible, with the bit between the chimneys coming back…

Since you said you had no problems getting the powerlines to vanish on the jpgs, I then exported my original, proceed version, as a jpg, and reimported it to LR14.

#4. is the result – nearly perfect (considering I did this quickly – mouse only).

On the same picture from which #4 is cropped, I used the AI Gen remove on various other objects, post processing of the clouds, etc., and gulls and rain spots vanished, as did two people standing by a wall, so it seems it is the powerline type of object causing an issue in a RAW file, but the AI can cope with the same issues in a jpg.

That may be the way forward to avoid to weird artefacts, and instead, remove the last troublesome intrusions from a high-quality jpg.

I hope my observations are of assistance – it is a great feature.

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LEGEND ,
Nov 16, 2024 Nov 16, 2024

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[This post contains formatting and embedded images that don't appear in email. View the post in your Web browser.]

 

Interesting, I'm seeing some issues with pushing the sky after applying Remove, but not the same as you are. So I don't think we're fully understanding yet what's really going on.

 

In your "3 Developed after Gen AI", you can see the wires themselves:

JohnREllis_0-1731778462544.png

 

But when I use a Sky mask to push the sky after applying Generative AI to the cables, the wires don't appear, though the replacement patches become quite noticeable:

JohnREllis_1-1731778537351.png

 

So two questions: 

 

1. Click on one of the existing Remove replacement icons where there wires are showing. Is the Opacity slider something other than 100?  A bug in the LR UI sometimes sets the slider other than 100.

 

2. Can you share the edited photo with all of your Develop settings? That will make explicit the precise settings and how they are interacting, more efficient than playing 20 questions. To do that, make sure Catalog Settings > Metadata > Include Develop Settings In Metadata is checked, and then in Export, set Metadata > Include: All Metadata.

 

* * *

 

A general problem with Generative Remove is that it's replacement patches don't always blend well with backgrounds, most noticeably skies and uniform gradients.  This sometimes becomes much more noticeable if you really push the background behind the Remove with a mask, as I did with the sky above.

 

You can sometimes work around that by selecting much larger portions of the sky, or all of the sky, and then doing Remove on the entire sky.  Or you can export and reimport the photo, as you did.

 

The interaction between masks and Remove creates complications in LR that takes a little learning to master.  It's sometimes simpler simply to export the edited photo as a TIFF or JPEG, reimport and then apply Remove. This is why so many people erroneously conclude that Photoshop's Remove algorithm is so much better. It's not the algorithm, but rather the interaction between LR's masks and Remove, that's causing issues. When you edit in Photoshop or apply LR Remove to a photo that's been exported and reimported, you're working a photo with all the previous edits "baked in" to the array of pixels.

 

* * *

 

A finally, LR's old Content Aware removal is still there, and often works just fine on small objects and wires.  Just uncheck both Detect Objects and Use Generative AI (the UI is very confusing here). 

 

Here I've used Content Aware and pushed the sky very hard, and the replacement patches blend perfectly:

Screenshot 2024-11-16 at 9.57.26 AM.png

 

 

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Explorer ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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I was trying to remove a zebra whose head was poking into the bottom of my image. I watched a few videos to make sure I was doing it right... this was the original:

Africadunc_1-1731703247307.png

 

This was the result...

Africadunc_2-1731703312883.png

I tried various options, including "detect objects".. but it just made things worse than before the remove.

 

Maybe Zebras are tricky because of their stripes.

 

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LEGEND ,
Nov 15, 2024 Nov 15, 2024

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[This post contains formatting and embedded images that don't appear in email. View the post in your Web browser.]

 

@Africadunc: "I was trying to remove a zebra whose head was poking into the bottom of my image."

 

JohnREllis_0-1731704923908.png

 

I was able to quickly remove the head from the screenshot, with Detect Objects turned off.

 

Removing objects along the edge of a photo requires a little extra care. Undo any Crop, Lens Correction, and Transform, apply Remove, then reapply those commands. Remove tries to match the unselected cropped-out pixels.

 

If that doesn't help, and you're working with a raw photo, then brush extra wide along the edge, as described in detail here:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/camera-raw-discussions/generative-remove-doesn-t-ignore-the-hidden-bo...

 

And if that doesn't help, please attach a full-resolution JPEG exported from the unmodified original photo (not a screenshot), so we and Adobe can see the issue in detail. With nearly everyone who has posted a problem photo, we've been able to show how to quickly remove the desired objects.

 

 

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Explorer ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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Thanks I will give it a try.

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Explorer ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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I looked at the original again and it was cropped. When I uncropped it and removed the zebra from the original it worked perfectly, then I re-cropped it. Thanks for the tip!

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New Here ,
Nov 16, 2024 Nov 16, 2024

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Ao tentar utilizar a ferramenta de remoção, apresenta esse erro, após selecionar a área de remoção. ALguém sabe resover o problema? o programa ja está atualizado com a versão 14.Captura de tela 2024-11-16 152714.png

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LEGEND ,
Nov 16, 2024 Nov 16, 2024

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@positive_Mercury5F8B: "When trying to use the removal tool, this error appears"

 

That error corresponds to this LR English error message:

"$$$/Clio/StatusCode/HTTP/Forbidden=We've encountered an issue and can't complete your request at this time. Please try again later."

 

Sometimes firewalls and anti-malware / anti-virus utilities incorrectly block some network requests from LR. Try these troubleshooting steps:

- Temporarily disable all the firewall / anti-malware on your computer. If that solves the problem, then add a specific exclusion for LR to the firewall's rules.

- Connect to another network, preferably one serviced by a different ISP. E.g. a Wifi connection of a neighbor, a coffee shop, work, or your phone's hotspot. Sometimes the routers in these networks block LR's requests, especially in authoritarian countries like China.

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New Here ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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When I use the Generative AI Remove I can't see what its done in cases of small areas because you need to 'remove' the symbols superimposed on the image by the app.  

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LEGEND ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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@hughlPhugh: "When I use the Generative AI Remove I can't see what its done in cases of small areas because you need to 'remove' the symbols superimposed on the image by the app. "

 

In the Remove panel, set Tool Overlay to Auto and move the mouse out of the image.  Alternatively, set Tool Overlay to Never.  Use the keyboard shortcut H to cycle overlay modes.

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Explorer ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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Hi, the problem I have is removing a darker object against a lighter background. LRC removes the object but leaves a light shadow which it will not get rid of.. example attached.  I have tried keeping the first try and then trying again but to no avail.

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LEGEND ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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[This post contains formatting and embedded images that don't appear in email. View the post in your Web browser.]

 

@JeffP3456: "LRC removes the object but leaves a light shadow which it will not get rid of."

 

I was able to quickly remove the branch from your screenshot:

JohnREllis_0-1731958632341.png

 

You've likely applied Remove on top of an AI mask (e.g. Background). Do Settings > Update AI Settings to recompute the mask.

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Participant ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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Just sharing my 2 cents, as Gen Remove was driving me crazy on a few pictures.

I was selecting only the people on the beach, thought I was including enough of the background.

It kept giving me... very weird things.

 

IMG_2792.pngIMG_2793.pngIMG_2795.jpegIMG_2796.jpeg

 

Almost looks like there's no shadow or reflection given the weather but... actually, there's a diffuse "reflection" just below the people, in the stagnant water in the sand.

Once I included this reflection in the selection, remove worked perfectly!

I found a few other examples of extremely overcast days, where a shadow is really difficult to see, but you still need to include the tiny one existing, for the remove to work properly.



MacBook Pro 16’’ M1 Pro 16GB on OSX Ventura 13.1

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LEGEND ,
Nov 18, 2024 Nov 18, 2024

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@AlexJz, "Once I included this reflection in the selection, remove worked perfectly!"

 

Yeah, Generative Remove is very clever at matching shadows and reflections.

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Participant ,
Nov 19, 2024 Nov 19, 2024

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Indeed. I just wanted to include some food for thought, as I'm seeing a lot of people in this thread saying it doesn't work.

For a few second after the update, I myself thought maybe it was the new version.

But after a few seconds I found the bug, me 🙂

I only struggled to remove half of an engraving on metal; but I mean, this is completely to be expected, given how such an AI works.

 

Only "disappointing" thing I found so far: you pretty much have to do this as the very first step in the process.

I tried doing gen remove after having applied some develop settings, and the removed zone wouldn't match the color correction that were made.

In Photoshop terms, it would be great if it were applied on the "base" layer of the photos, without taking into account the adjustments layers on top.

But that's extremely minor.



MacBook Pro 16’’ M1 Pro 16GB on OSX Ventura 13.1

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LEGEND ,
Nov 19, 2024 Nov 19, 2024

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@AlexJz: "you pretty much have to do this as the very first step in the process."

 

That's how Adobe designed it, though it doesn't match many people's natural workflow. Often, you don't know which objects you should bother removing until you've cropped and applied basic editing.  Adobe's recommended order of operations, along with more details about shadows and reflections, are detailed in this article:

https://www.lightroomqueen.com/generative-remove-replace/

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Advocate ,
Nov 20, 2024 Nov 20, 2024

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In ACR it is possible to see the uncropped image when applying Remove.

That option solves the problem with cropped images.

 

 

 

 

 

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LEGEND ,
Nov 20, 2024 Nov 20, 2024

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@C.Cella: "In ACR it is possible to see the uncropped image when applying Remove."

 

That's good. LR 14 disables Lens Blur while Remove is open but not Crop (or Transform or Lens Corrections), even though Crop is used much more often than Lens Blur. There's a feature request for LR to do that:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-ideas/p-reveal-the-whole-uncropped-image-when-using...

 

Hopefully LR will soon follow ACR.

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