.MTS files from Panasonic GH2 camera show noise artifacts

[skydragon01]

If I load .MTS media files from my Panasonic GH2 camera onto the timeline of Premiere Pro CS6 (Win7 on PC) on some footage I get a wierd noise/artifact appearing in the footage on playback and also if i render the timeline out.

The artifacts look like a 'rain' of digital noise appearing in certain dark areas of the footage (issue doesn't happen on well lit scenes)

If I use Media Player Classic to play back the .MTS footage outside of PP CS6 the footage plays back 100% ok.

If I transcode the .MTS files into DNxHD format using Adobe Media Encoder the problem persists.

However ....if I transcode the .MTS files into DNxHD format using a 3rd party transcoder (5DtoRGB) the problem is resolved and the DNxHD files work 100% ok in PP CS6

It is as though both PP CS6 and also Adobe Encoder are not interpretting the .MTS file structure ok (?) and introducing artifacts.

It seems that some dev work is needed to resolve the handling of .MTS files by Adobe (?)

Can anyone please assist?

Thanks

[Emanuele_Giannini]

Hi all, I have buyed Creative suite CS6 and I have the same problem. Adobe in the summer told me that this problem was known and they were working to resolve it. A few days ago, a colleague told me about PREMIERE DC have solved the problem with an update. There are other guy that confirm the notice?

Now why ADOBE don't resolve the same problem in the CS6?

Is terrible to transcode always the clip.

I'm thinking of removing the panasonic for this reason.

Thank you so much for the attention

Emanuele

[DrDave42]

The problem has not been fixed, simply use an intermediary codec to resolve the issue. I recommend Cineform, but you have many choices. The newer cameras will be better anyway, either the GH3 or the new 4K Panasonic rumored to be coming online soon.

[gregb98056542]

Emanuele Giannini wrote:

Hi all, I have buyed Creative suite CS6 and I have the same problem. Adobe in the summer told me that this problem was known and they were working to resolve it. A few days ago, a colleague told me about PREMIERE DC have solved the problem with an update. There are other guy that confirm the notice?

Now why ADOBE don't resolve the same problem in the CS6?

Is terrible to transcode always the clip.

I'm thinking of removing the panasonic for this reason.

Thank you so much for the attention

Emanuele

The problem of adding a post to a very long thread like this is that it can confusing as to what problem you are referring to.

Can you clarify - what problem are you seeing that Adobe informed you was known?

We do try to resolve any issues that we know about in both CS6 and CC.

[DrDave42]

I'm sure you do fix the bugs, and we absolutely appreciate it. However, as a practical matter, since the bug has been around for more than an entire year, and the GH2 has been superseded by the GH3, with the GH5 around the corner, there is no practical reason for anyone to spend time on this when the workaround is to use an intermediary codec.

In fact, this thread one year old.

With H265 around the corner, we can only hope that the problem is resolved in H265, which is what we all will be presumably be using. I'm looking forward to it, in fact.

The bug is not present in 5.5, so using 5.5 for the final encoding is certainly an option; I prefer the Cineform codec but it depends on your worflow, grading etc.

If you are looking to fix a bigger bug that affects more users, fixing the pulldown bug in Premiere (it only works in After Affects) would be very usefull, but, again, many people are replacing their 24p/60i cams with 24p cams (no wrapper).

Thanks for all the work you do.

[DrDave42]

Actually, an x264 encoder option would be even better.

[gregb98056542]

What is the exact bug that we're talking about here?  Noise in the AVCHD files (MTS)?  I just want to make sure so I can look into the status of the bug and just confirm that it is not already fixed in CS6.  If it's supposed to be fixed and you are still having problems, it would be something important to look into.

Otherwise, x264 encodes video streams into a h.264 stream - which you can do directly in Premiere Pro.  Not sure why we would need to add that option.

[DrDave42]

You would add the x264 because of the license. That would be very helpful.

The "digital rain" problem, for which there are numerous threads and examples (I can totally understand that you would not want to wade through them), is when footage from the GH2 goes through the PP 6 or 6.5 encoder to h264--and noise, sometimes streaky noise, is added to the ouput. It only happens under certain conditions, but it is easy to verify by recording a scene that has a bright area and a shadow area.

The noise is not at all present when using PP 5.5, or when using an intermediary codec, like Cineform. Some people have claimed using "all i-frame" recording in the GH2 solves the problem as well. Under certain conditions, the noise can be quite dramatic, but in a well lit, outdoor scene it isn't an issue.
I've been using PP since 1.5, and this is one of the oddest bugs I've seen, but since there is a workaround, I just use the workaround, just like for the pulldown bug, I do the pulldown in AE, which works perfect (thank you AE).

I suppose the easiest thing to do would simply add an option to use the encoder from 5.5, instead of rendering lossless, opening in 5.5 and rendering, or trying to open the project in 5.5, or using Cineform or 5D2RGB, Prores, etc.
The thing is, most of us simply don't have the time to test all the updates, we just want to get the footage out the door. But it would be nice not to have to use a workaround, absolutely.

[Jim_Simon]

What is the exact bug that we're talking about here?

I'm not sure there is a bug in PP here, Greg, as the artifacts they're talking about manifest in outside players like VLC and KMPlayer as well as PP.

Or perhaps more accurately, it seems to be the result of an interaction between the clip itself and the renderer used.  Something is wrong with these clips, and various renderers will show that problem to varying degrees.

To clarify, KMPlayer gives the user the choice of which renderer to use for decoding.  As I switch between renderers, the problem get's better or worse.  Premiere Pro uses the MainConcept decoder and doesn't allow such a switch of render engines, so the clips that have that problem will often show it when played back in PP.

For GH2 users, I can say that I haven't yet seen that artifact in any of my Moon Trial 7 clips (Set D), which is all I-frame.  It's simply the best patch I've yet seen for the GH2, and highly recommend it to anyone who cares about image quality.

[Emanuele_Giannini]

Rain effects is present only in CS6 and always with GH2 file, original file and many patch file. Moon T7 not present rain effect, but I have used it, and clip rec stopped after 5-7 seconds. Is not stable patch for me.

The conversion in intermediate codec, is very expensive, as time and storage space.

One user told me about a update resolution on CC but I don't test it because I have buyed CS6 and I use it. I was hoping someone could give me some good news

The problem is not present on PP CS5, I do not understand why adobe does not resolve on CS6. It' s true that in the maintime have come out new models of cameras, but I do not think it is correct not solve a problem in the software that user pay (CS6).

Adobe takes a step forward and one step back for me.

Thanks for the more answers, have a good day

Emanuele

[Jim_Simon]

clip rec stopped after 5-7 seconds. Is not stable patch for me.

Use only these two cards.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/824149-REG/SanDisk_SDSDXPA_064G_A75_Extreme_Pro_64GB_SDHC_SDXC...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/992493-REG/sandisk_sdsdxs_128g_a46_extreme_sdxc_uhs_1_80mb_s.h...

One user told me about a update resolution on CC

CC still shows the problem for those clips that have it.  This is not surprising because it uses the same MainConcept decoder.

[Emanuele_Giannini]

Thank you Jim, you have used MOON T7 with these card and recording not stopped out?

[Jim_Simon]

Correct.  On several projects now.

[Emanuele_Giannini]

Can you give me the link  of your patch please?

Recording for more than 30 minutes even?

I use the GH2 as a second camera at times in some convention...

[Jim_Simon]

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/7580/driftwood-cluster-x-series-3moon-t7%D0%85r%D1%96z...

[NickDriftwood]

its on www.personal-view.com

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/7580/driftwood-cluster-x-series-3moon-t7Ѕrіzz-t6nebula-t7drewnet-t9

login to download else all you’ll get is thumbnails. Try moon T7 or latest DREWnet/Spizz/Nebula.

Nick

[Emanuele_Giannini]

Thank you so much I'll try it! 🙂

[jimmiesner]

Has anyone had the digital rain problem with the G6 or GH3?  I am looking to upgrade and tired of transcoding.

[Jim_Simon]

I haven't yet seen it with the Moon Trial 7 patch.  Try that before you spend money.

And if you still decide to spend money, wait a month for the GH4.  It'll blow away anything Panasonic has released to date.

[jimmiesner]

Thanks for the GH4 suggestion.  I am probably going to get those too, but I am looking to upgrade multiple cameras.  So I was going to get a GH3 or G6 as a bcam.  Do they suffer from the same digital rain bug?  

[R Neil Haugen]

I've been shooting a GH3 for some time now ... and not had any of the dreaded digital rain appear. But then, I never use the AVCHD format, only the .mov and occasionally for less-important things the mp4. All in all, I've been quite pleased with the way it displays & grades, though ... one needs to know how to handle the dorky pink plasticene skin the engineers stuck us with. Doable, but an irritant. The GH4 seems to have quite good skin with all the original hues & details left in.

[Jim_Simon]

I didn't find the GH3 enough of an improvement over the GH2 to upgrade.  (In fact, in three separate blind tests, I chose the GH2 as the better image over the GH3.  And that was before Moon Trial 7, which is simply the best the GH2 has ever looked.)

[R Neil Haugen]

I know this is semi-off topic, but the GH3 got hit I believe by STOOOPID engineers who tried to set the processor to give us some sort of idealized skin, "pink plasticene" is an apt description. This is where one needs to get good either in PrPro with color/contrast curves/levels controls or the tools of Sg in order to increase contrast in the mids/upper mids just a bit, darken & de-sat reds just a smidge, and sometimes even lift the gamma of blue & green barely a touch. Next ... forget the All-Intra, has more noise & artifacts, shoot in the 50mbps settings ... a few other things.

That done, it grades beautifully and edits nicely. Compared to hacked GH2, toss-up. Some like their GH3 better ... some hate it and still prefer the GH2. At that point sure, no reason to "up". The GH4? Whole different game, baby ... though looking at things on a 1920x1080 monitor here with my semi-languid specs for video, when I go for the new kid, gonna have to get a new box and new monitor, this one will become the second monitor for UI/tools ...

[Jim_Simon]

This is where one needs to get good either in PrPro with color/contrast curves/levels controls or the tools of Sg

Or just use FilmConvert and be done with it.  (They have all the GH3 profiles.)

[R Neil Haugen]

I've seen a lot of discussion & examples of film convert over at p-v forums. Nick Driftwood is "there" a lot, just posted a lot of stuff on using a GH4. He's made a couple little software mods for the GH2 as I recall ... anyway, F-C does a great job of "film" look conversions, but I've not seen good examples where it "fixes" the plasticene. And let's see ... $200 for what I can do in a few moments with saved looks ... naw, not thinking. Not worthwhile for the work I do. I'm not making GWTW here ... 

Now, yak & one or two others have posted their own LUT's that work quite well as a first-step for GH3 footage. But I've created my own. Speedgrade and Ae can both do this quite well.

Neil

[Jim_Simon]

I posted two files

Neither were the original MTS from the camera.

you noted that Ann "saw them in the original, but not the converted."

My error.  I thought you uploaded the original.  It seems you've only uploaded two exports, but not the original.