Pr CS5 - List of supported CUDA Cards

[Curt Wrigley]

Adobe is working on a playback and rendering engine for Adobe Premiere Pro called the Mercury Playback Engine. This new engine is NVIDIA® GPU-accelerated, 64-bit native, and architected for the future. Native 64-bit support enables you to work more fluidly on HD and higher resolution projects, and GPU acceleration speeds effects processing and rendering.

The Mercury Playback Engine offers these benefits:

• Open projects faster, refine effects-rich HD and higher resolution sequences in real time, enjoy smooth scrubbing, and play back complex projects without rendering.
• See results instantly when applying multiple color corrections and effects across many video layers.
• Work in real time on complex timelines and long-form projects with thousands of clips — whether your project is SD, HD, 2K, 4K, or beyond.

Ensure your system is ready to take advantage of the Mercury Playback Engine in a future version of Adobe Premiere Pro. The Mercury Playback Engine works hand-in-hand with NVIDIA® CUDA™ technology to give you amazingly fluid, real-time performance. See it in action

* PR CS5 supports the following list of CUDA cards:

	GeForce GTX 285	Windows and MAC
	Quadro FX 3800	Windows
	Quadro FX 4800	Windows and MAC
	Quadro FX 5800	Windows
	Quadro CX	Windows

More hardware details:

http://www.adobe.com/products/premiere/systemreqs/

[Moxtelling]

Hi

I can confirm that my GTX 260 does:

1)  GPU/CPU usage changes favoring the GPU when I enable MPE hardware support. 100% in software mode, 30% cpu/60% gpu (+/-)

2)  Renderling changes from Yellow to Red when I switch back and forth

But:

3) Smoth playback is possible with GPU while the Software jerky - still plays jerky with Mercury Playback AND above all:

MY SYSTEM CRASHES!!!! PPro freezes after a while and whole system stops working.

Running i920 2,8 Ghz - 12 GB 1033 RAM - GTX 260 and 2x1,5 TB HDD (not in RAID though).

So maybe there is more to it than just doing the software-fix - it might seem to work, but not vorking stable enough? Anyone else been able to see any difference - having crashes? Anyone else having a GTX 260 trying this?

/Morten

[cts51911]

Are there benchmark files out there available so we can compare apples to apples?

I'd like to know where Quardo, GTX 200 series, GTX 400 series stack up.

Also, there has to be headroom for improvement too (drivers/software updates).

THESE ARE EXCITING TIMES!

[Jeff Bellune]

still plays jerky with Mercury Playback AND above all:

MY SYSTEM CRASHES!!!! PPro freezes after a while and whole system stops working.

Maybe that's why support is only enabled for a few, well-tested cards.  Caveat Emptor.

-Jeff

[Moxtelling]

Hey

Tried to start a brand new job and made picture in picture - crossdissolve fastcolour correction and brightness/contrast on 5 clips - and it runs smooth. CPU load is only 30%...so it works - but stability might be an issue as I wrote before...I have ordered a FX 3800 - so I really kind of hope that the GTX 260 has it limitations compared to FX 3800 ??? Else I have used 1000$ for nothing??? And I guess Adobe and Nvidai will make some vhanges in next update that closes this way of software modding CS5....If not - and if almost all GTX cards will run significantly better and stable - we have all been misinformed from the start....

/Morten

[Jeff Bellune]

if almost all GTX cards will run significantly better and stable - we have all been misinformed from the start...

You mentioned "stable".  Apparently, this new hack is not stable - reference the post I quoted.

Nobody's been "misinformed".

-Jeff

[chupacabracobra]

Jeff Bellune wrote:

if almost all GTX cards will run significantly better and stable - we have all been misinformed from the start...

You mentioned "stable".  Apparently, this new hack is not stable - reference the post I quoted.

Nobody's been "misinformed".

-Jeff

first who knows why his machine crashed, maybe it was the CUDA hack for his 260 then again there a thousand other potential reasons

so far it has not crashed my GTX 275 system at all

it is odd that I don't seem to get such high GPU usage as others, I don't think I have seen it go above 20%, so maybe something is wrong with forcing the hack on it or maybe it depends exactly what you test (onmany scenes it never goes above 8% usage) but at the least it has been crash free so far and it definitely does smooth certain vids out

. It is a little weird but during parts of clips that use certain functi

ons the GPU may got to 20% and the drop from 95% to 30% and things do look a lot smoother but then as soon as soon as the effect is done with it may back to 95% CPU and 6% GPU.

Anyway whatever the story, so far I have noticed no harm, no instability and occasionaly CPU relief and more often smoothness improvement (at times it radically improves smootheness, at other times it makes no apparent difference in any way). Anyway, all good so far.

I think I will avoiding getting the program for now though although it definitely is a step up from CS4. What if Adobe fights back against the simple hack in a future patch? Seems riskty to spend this sort of money before we get a promise they won't lock people out at a future date (I would seriously hope they don't become one of THOSE sorts of companies).

[cts51911]

Moxtelling:

If you were buying a supported card it means you are serious about your work, don't doubt the purchase.

For me, this is a hobby.

[Guest]

Jeff Bellune wrote:

still plays jerky with Mercury Playback AND above all:

MY SYSTEM CRASHES!!!! PPro freezes after a while and whole system stops working.

Maybe that's why support is only enabled for a few, well-tested cards.  Caveat Emptor.

-Jeff

Jeff Bellune wrote:

if almost all GTX cards will run significantly better and stable - we have all been misinformed from the start...

You mentioned "stable".  Apparently, this new hack is not stable - reference the post I quoted.

Nobody's been "misinformed".

-Jeff

Those are mindless leaps to conclusions (with no actual technical diagnosis), and have pretty much been your only contributions - repeatedly - to this emerging discussion.  The objective is to uncover whether Adobe was being overcautious by disabling CUDA/GPU acceleration for certain cards:  to use the most heinous example, the GTX 295 is based on the same GT200 GPU as the GTX 285, exceeds the GTX 285 capabilities only slightly, and is purposefully disabled from CUDA/GPU acceleration in CS5.  Why?  We prefer to hear boots-on-the-ground answers (and if there is silence, to investigate this issue ourselves), rather than to hear from Adobe's defensive army who don't think twice about bending over.

I just installed a "new" GTX 285 into my workstation, a reasonable compromise since we have been forced to wait for another quarter or two until Fermi capability arrives, while I'll still want to do some editing.  If a Fleabay'ed $200 accessory can save hours of work for a quarter or two of a year, that's a pittance.  However, it is pathetic and spineless to couch that as a formal defense for how this is panning out.  If somebody walked up to you on the street and asked for $200, you'd ask why.  I don't see the wisdom in holding your tongue against a multi-million dollar corporation.

As for the changes in performance I've experienced, I need more time to assess.  To start with, as a practical matter the effect of this on my unique workflow will depend quite simply on whether the third-party developers "play game."  I am a full-blown Red Giant Looks addict, so when they update it "this summer" (whenever that is), if they shall have taken the lazy road, they will only facilitate compatibility rather than adding CUDA/GPU acceleration for the application of their (priceless for me) filters.  In other words, without integration of CUDA/GPU acceleration from third-party plug-in developers, the lowest common denominator will take us back to stuttering.

Another thought:  I didn't invest in a way-overpriced Quadro (which appears to be marketed under the charismatic, faith-based moniker that it is "for pros, industrial, so trust us, it's worth it!").  But I am skeptical at the moment that you would see an appreciable performance gain from the best Quadro up against, say, my GTX 285.  (And I do remember the earlier debate blip in this thread about the number of accelerated tracks available with each respective card, which I find irrelevant since I'm not NBC Sports dealing with feeds from multiple angles at the Kentucky Derby.)  These video timelines are not 3D games, after all.  I am suspecting (based on one day of work) that there was only so much of the GPU's power, from the high-end to the low-end, that Adobe could address for these non-gaming tasks of transcoding, etc.

Basically, I expected a full-blown revolution from this, but merely found myself satisfied by this long-overdue advancement in HD video editing, which had failed miserably to keep pace with technology.  Especially you, Steve Jobs, who has a lot more to worry about with FCP now than the stupid Flash war.

A few early thoughts.

[Moxtelling]

Hi HPmoon

I get your point! I´m very confused too and can´t help thinking there is something rotten in the states of Adobe and Nvidia.If the only thing you have to do to get GPU support for any Nvidia card is to change a few lines in a text-file we have all been victims in a big fraud - but I hope this is not true...time will show if there is more too it than just a simple textfile.

[cts51911]

Hi Mox,

Do you really think Adobe was praying that nobody would notice?  They knew about this.

I think long term is that tests will appear and it will show a  clear lead for Quadro.  The cards are different.

Also, the whole time I was goofing around with Premiere 5 with my GTX  470 I was thinking:  "Is this thing going to explode?"

That is the last thing you want to think about when you are working.

You are going to drive yourself crazy.  Now, get to work

[cts51911]

Words from Wil on the upsupported CUDA cards...

"Hi Wil,  Care to comment on the Hack  floating around the web for other using Nvidia cards for MPE that are  NOT on the list of "official" cards? Thanks, Chris"

"@Chris - Gee, there's a simple text file that allows you to unlock  non-supported CUDA cards?  How cool is that...? "

UPDATE:

" For instance, currently the Fermi chipsets have some rendering errors  that actually require bug fixes in an upcoming dot before they'll work  correctly. So, to reiterate, it's not as simple as 'CUDA works  everywhere' with every chipset.  There's a reason we're validating  boards..."

Looks like it is official...Non-certified cards are buggy and are not ready for any kind of production.

[chupacabracobra]

cts51911 wrote:

Words from Wil on the upsupported CUDA cards...

"Hi Wil,  Care to comment on the Hack  floating around the web for other using Nvidia cards for MPE that are  NOT on the list of "official" cards? Thanks, Chris"

"@Chris - Gee, there's a simple text file that allows you to unlock  non-supported CUDA cards?  How cool is that...? "

UPDATE:

" For instance, currently the Fermi chipsets have some rendering errors  that actually require bug fixes in an upcoming dot before they'll work  correctly. So, to reiterate, it's not as simple as 'CUDA works  everywhere' with every chipset.  There's a reason we're validating  boards..."

Looks like it is official...Non-certified cards are buggy and are not ready for any kind of production.

1. the 275 is practically the same as the 285 and should work the same, it's not new like Fermi

2. even if it makes some rendering errors, you might still want it enabled for editing, if not final render

[Jeff Bellune]

Those are mindless leaps to conclusions (with no actual technical diagnosis), and have pretty much been your only contributions - repeatedly - to this emerging discussion

I can only present my opinions on why things were done this way.  They may have a basis in fact, but it's up to you (or anyone else) to decide if you  believe that.  I can assure you, for whatever it's worth, that those conclusions are not mindless, nor are they very big leaps at all.  Again, your choice as to whether to believe me or not.

The objective is to uncover whether Adobe was being overcautious by disabling CUDA/GPU acceleration for certain cards

You'd have to define "overcautious".  With stability and performance being stated goals for CS5, how many more cards would Adobe have been able to test properly and thoroughly before putting those goals at risk?  One?  Six?  Zero?  How many?  How many cards did they start out with?  How many failed QE for one reason or another?  Why did they fail?  I don't know those answers, and I don't think you do, either.  Conspiracy theories aside, maybe you could give the guys who write the code the benefit of the doubt on this one.

And I do remember the earlier debate blip in this thread about the number of accelerated tracks available with each respective card, which I find irrelevant since I'm not NBC Sports dealing with feeds from multiple angles at the Kentucky Derby

You may find it "irrelevant", but you better believe there's a significant segment of Adobe's customers who don't.

Look, I really hope that folks who alter their Pr installation to get access to CUDA-accelerated playback, effects and rendering end up with a really fast and solid editing experience.  The fact is that some (many?) will not.  Is it worth the risk?  Everyone has to decide for themselves.  And everyone will have to take responsibility for that decision if things go fruit-shaped.

-Jeff

[trilobyte550m]

I know it's physically larger.  But I've also seen posted on other sites' forums that some of the well-off gamer kids have been playing around with installing the card in their Mac Pro's for Windows gaming in boot camp.  My understanding is that it does fit in the chassis (though barely), though workarounds are required for power.  It all seems ludicrous to me, I'll wait until the next generation hardware is announced, and work with what's available (and within my budget) then.

[FelixUnderwood]

I agree with Harm & trilobyte550m: patience is a virtue. This is all so new that if we wait even just the month of May and stay on top of this Forum, we're going to know A LOT more then in order to make a more intelligent decision on which GPU card to purchase. My thanks in advance to all of you who report your findings if you're able to experience the rush of MPE now or anytime in the near future. PLEASE keep us all posted on your experience!

[edelf63]

Found this on the cinema5d.com forum:

------------------------

How to make Premiere CS5 work with GTX 295

by marvguitar on 01 May 2010 22:38

I figured out how to activate CUDA acceleration without a GTX 285 or Quadro... I'm pretty sure it should work with other 200 GPUs. Note that i'm using 2 monitors and there's a extra tweak to play with CUDA seamlessly with 2 monitors.Here are the steps:Step 1. Go to the Premiere CS5 installation folder.
Step 2. Find the file "GPUSniffer.exe" and run it in a command prompt (cmd.exe). You should see something like that:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Device: 00000000001D4208 has video RAM(MB): 896
Device: 00000000001D4208 has video RAM(MB): 896
Vendor string: NVIDIA Corporation
Renderer string: GeForce GTX 295/PCI/SSE2
Version string: 3.0.0OpenGL version as determined by Extensionator...
OpenGL Version 2.0
Supports shaders!
Supports BGRA -> BGRA Shader
Supports VUYA Shader -> BGRA
Supports UYVY/YUYV ->BGRA Shader
Supports YUV 4:2:0 -> BGRA Shader
Testing for CUDA support...
Found 2 devices supporting CUDA.
CUDA Device # 0 properties -
CUDA device details:
Name: GeForce GTX 295 Compute capability: 1.3
Total Video Memory: 877MB
CUDA Device # 1 properties -
CUDA device details:
Name: GeForce GTX 295 Compute capability: 1.3
Total Video Memory: 877MB
CUDA Device # 0 not choosen because it did not match the named list of cards
Completed shader test!
Internal return value: 7
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you look at the last line it says the CUDA device is not chosen because it's not in the named list of card. That's fine. Let's add it.Step 3. Find the file: "cuda_supported_cards.txt" and edit it and add your card (take the name from the line: CUDA device details: Name: GeForce GTX 295 Compute capability: 1.3So in my case the name to add is: GeForce GTX 295Step 4. Save that file and we're almost ready.Step 5. Go to your Nvidia Drivercontrol panel (im using the latest 197.45) under "Manage 3D Settings", Click "Add" and browse to your Premiere CS5 install directory and select the executable file: "Adobe Premiere Pro.exe"Step 6. In the field "multi-display/mixed-GPU acceleration" switch from "multiple display performance mode" to "compatibilty performance mode"Step 7. That's it. Boot Premiere and go to your project setting / general and activate CUDAHope this helps

--------------------

can anyone with a gtx confirm this

tia

[Moxtelling]

Hi

Yes I can confirm that I can get Premiere Pro to show my GTX260 as valid and it shows the Accellerated icon inside PPro. I could not get NVIdidao Controlpanel to add Premiere Pro CS5 for some reason? So maybee it is not 100% correct.

But it does not seem to make any difference afterall. Fx. using a crossdissolve between two clips still pauses and stutters - using AVCHD.

Just spend 1000$ on a FX 3800 yesterday - coming next week - hope it show better results....but so far GTX 260 is recognized and Accelleration icon shows up insaide PPro. But no accelleration seems to be going on.....

Morten

[Moxtelling]

Hi agian

I can see - in process explorer - that my CPU is not so heavely used - only 40-60% against before 90-100% while playing back inside PPro. But it does not help on the playback at all - everything still stutters when using just 1-2 effetcs. Harm and Bill has allready stated that my disks is my bottle neck - even though they perfrom well - Does Adobe recommend RAID for Premiere?

But why will I not see any perofrmance gain what so ever when my CPU goes from 100 to 50% playing back? Is that because this "fix" is not working and will I experience better performance with FX3800? I certainly hope so....else I have spend 1000$ on nothing....

[trilobyte550m]

As for the market share comment, that generalization is dated and inaccurate.  It's also relative.  Regardless of the number of generic PC's out in the marketplace, something in the neighborhood of half the sales of Adobe's creative apps (which would include Premiere Pro) are Mac versions.  I'm going to dodge any other attempts to start up the 5 billionth platform debate on the internet, though... both platforms have their own merits and shortcomings, the trick is to find and use something that works for you.

[Christopher_Hendrick]

To All

This is the price you pay for progress. Just figure on not using the Mercury engine if your not on a supported platform.

You can operate without it. This is for the big boys that really want the most power for the dollar and have the budget to

upgrade or purchase new systems to support Adobe's tech. If you don't have it well that is something you will have to deside for

yourselves. Do your productions benefit you enough to upgrade your hardware.

[Line]

I am so annoyed at myself.

Bought a GTX295 thinking, i'll be ahead of the game and have an even more CUDA powered card for the next CS suite. First thing that happens is it overscans my computer monitor. Bought a new monitor. Now CS5 is released, and GTX295 is not even supported but the previous version is!

Doh doh doh doh!!!!!!

[cts51911]

See this:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/629557?tstart=30

Be warned it is a hack so don't expect much if anything at all.

You paid $500+ for that card?

[Moxtelling]

Try the softmod described in this thread. It seems to work - works for me with GTX 260 - but for how long? I don´t know if it´s stable.

But I understand your frustration. I too did invest in new PC only 10 months ago - buyed the GTX 260 back then - hoping it would be supported in CS5 because everybody talked about CUDA - and maybe all CUDA cards was supported etc. Now I have ordered FX 3800 - but if the softmod works for good and is stable I also feel like som kind a fool - even though the FX 3800 all in all will be a better choice - for stability and power the next couples a years - but there might come some cards in a year performing even better in CS5 to ½ of the price of FX 3800? So if you are not a pro - try the softmod...I will have to stick to the supported cards and pay the bill - right here - right now! Good luck!

/Morten

[moore22]

Are the GTX 285 1gb and 2gb cards compatible with Premiere CS5 ? I am putting together a computer  right now and just wanted to make sure everything would work fine.

[cts51911]

The requirements say nothing about the amount of memory on the card.  I would guess that it is GPU specific.

http://www.adobe.com/products/premiere/systemreqs/