Sony A7S XML workflow trouble going to Resolve

[reinistraidas]

Dear all,

Since upgrading to CC 2014 I have had a lot of trouble getting Sony A7S media to grade in Resolve.

I have no tricky workflows - I merely edit the XAVC-S natively on PP, then clean up the track and FCP XML it to Resolve. It has worked before and is still working just fine with just about any media - Alexa, RED, etc. This is even after updating to 2014.1.

Recenty, I have not been able to get any sequences into Resolve that have A7S media. Resolve cannot locate any media used in the timeline and says "timecode extents do not match". I inspected the XML and it seems that no REEL information is provided in the XML. An XML that has QTs from Alexa has reel numbers, although I don't think this is the issue. Force conforming the clips also does not work, because the IN/OUTs do not match my timeline. I have tried different project settings in Resolve, but to luck. 

The only workaround was to use the Project Manager to archive and transcode the project media into something else, open it, then create a new XML from the new project and then into Resolve. That worked, but it's a serious hassle.

So - what is wrong with XAVC-S originating from the Sony A7S? Why won't it XML properly? It worked just fine with CS6, also with CC - but the workflow failed after the CC 2014 version.

[KR Davidson]

Hello!

I am also having the same issue with my A7s footage and XML output to Resolve....I know Resolve is having an issue with the audio from my clips when I import directly, this is a real problem as I am loosing the simplicity of workflow that is needed and had an easier time with my ML Raw workflow.

Any help with this issue is greatly appreciated!

[reinistraidas]

Really, is there nobody else using Premiere CC 2014 with Sony A7S files and Resolve?

[RoninEdits]

there are two ways to have resolve import media, have you tried both?

first is by importing the xml and let it bring in the media using "Automatically import source clips into the media pool".

the second way is to start with a blank project in resolve, set the project frame rate and such to match the premiere project settings, add the video clips to resolves media pool, then import the xml and uncheck "Automatically import source clips into the media pool" and "Automatically set project settings" in the XML import dialog box.

the sony has other formats such as regular mp4?  do those files do the same? i would agree with you that the empty Reel in the xml isn't the problem. it is more likely that adobe changed something that broke this workflow with XAVC-S files. its always two steps forward, one step back with adobe. if say half of your timeline or less is from the sony a7s and XAVC-S files, another workaround is to use the "render and replace" feature to only transcode those files. just place those clips on their own track as you edit to easily find and select them all. if worse comes to worse, this is a work around until adobe can fix the bug.

[reinistraidas]

Thanks for your reply. Yes, I have tried both ways. If I add all the media manually in Resolve and then simply import the timeline via XML, the media still does not match. This is because for some reason the TC for all the clips in Resolve starts at zero 00:00:00:00. However, the real time code is not zero and Premiere sees this fine.

The issue seems to be either more with the way timecode is translated in Adobes XML... OR with Resolve not being able to read proper TC from these A7s .mp4 files. However, since this workflow worked fine with the previous version of Premiere CC, I think Adobe's XML is bugged somehow.

[reinistraidas]

I am starting to think this is a bug in Resolve after all.

Premiere can and does read correct TC from A7S media files.

Resolve does not - all TC starts at 00:00:00:00.

If I transcode the media to DNxHD Quicktime, the original TC is retained correctly and correctly read by BOTH Premiere and Resolve.

[RoninEdits]

so have you updated resolve to a new version since last time this was working? or has it been the same version and install the entire time? is this the same camera etc from before when it was working, or is it new or have you updated the firmware?  to clarify, you are doing the transcode in premiere and it keeps the timecode or you did this in resolve?  also if you look in the xml export from premiere, at the timecode string does it look right or is it empty or 00:00:00:00?

i did search for others with this problem and found a post where a cineform wrapper wasn't writting timecode in the same way/place inside a .mp4/mov file that quicktime does and that threw off resolve from finding it...  im not sure if thats happening here or not, especially if resolve worked before, but that was one thing i ran across. i also read several others posts where they had to import the premiere pro xml into fcp to export a new xml that resolve would read.

[RoninEdits]

i think i read somewhere that timecode was used last towards linking media in resolve, so i tried just removing all the timecode from my xml and importing it into resolve. this seems to work. the xml still provided the filename and frame number, which i guess is enough for resolve to reconstruct the timeline edits.

i used notepad++ to replace all the timecode strings with empty values. i used the replace command, selected the Regular Expression option at the bottom, searched for <string>...........</string>, and replace with <string></string>    i choose Replace All, saved the xml and imported into resolve and seems to work. you can give this a shot, its alot faster than having to transcode for a work around...

Use Notepad++ To Search For Variables In Documents, Notepad++ Reglar Expressions - Question Defense

[reinistraidas]

This issue appeared right after upgrading Premiere to CC 2014 some time last year. Before that, the XML to Resolve worked fine with these files. This was with Resolve 10. I since then upgraded to the latest CC 2014.2 and Resolve 11.1.3 (also latest). Same issue. Just today - upgraded the A7S firmware to the latest (1.10) - no changes still.

The A7S has proper start-stop Rec Run timecode. This means that the first clip in the card is 00:00:00:00 and then goes on as you start and stop recording. Upon importing the media into Premiere, all is fine. All timecode is read properly, no worries there.

On importing the same media into Resolve (no matter if via XML or just added into the media pane unedited) - Resolve does not understand this timecode. Resolve sees timecode for every single file as a "duration" timecode only, reading the start of every file at 00:00:00:00. There in lies the problem somewhere. Either Sony A7S uses some sort of strange metadata string for their timecode in these files which Resolve cannot read. OR Adobes XML is bugged in the way it translates it.

I checked the test XML file and there is timecode in it for every edit. It looks fine.

I also just tried your XML edit method, but it did not work. And how could it - resetting the string values to 00:00:00:00 prevents the "other app" from ever finding out where your source IN and OUT points are. The information in the XML for every edit containts the start timecode for that IN point and then the duration in frames. This means, that Resolve calculates the OUT point by just adding X number of frames to the start timecode in the string value within the XML.

Resolve simply does not read timecode from these files. It reads them fine when they are converted to Quicktime files (via Media Encoder), but not when they are MP4 straight out of the camera.

I tried importing the said .xml into FCP7. Then re-exported it out again there and loaded into Resolve. Same thing. It all stops at the fact that Resolve think that the start TC for all files is zero, but it is not. This leads me to think that it's a bug in Sony's firmware and/or a bug in Resolve. Also, this issue is identical on both Windows and OS X.

[RoninEdits]

sure does look like a resolve issue, especially if the media pool doesn't show the proper timecode in the TC columns. might need to file a bug report with resolve. have u tried installing back version 10 to see if it still works?

im not sure why the xml timecode removal worked for me but not yours. by leaving it blank i figured resolve might ignore it since its not reading it properly anyways...  i tested it with a timeline with footage that has running timecode as well as some clips that all start at 00:00:00:00 on each clip.  either way they all seemed to relink and the timeline was ok.  when i look at the timecode numbers in the xml vs timecode in resolve media tab, the numbers in the xml are the starting timecode for the clip, not the starting point of the trimmed clip in the timeline. so i dont believe its being used as the in point.  in the xml it shows things like start/end/in/out, that might be for the actual in and out points. but i dont really know...

					<start>6333</start>
					<end>6410</end>
					<in>438</in>
					<out>515</out>

after playing with it more, it looks like string and frame are used to determine the timecode.  the clips that i have with no running timecode have this in the xml:

							<string>00:00:00:00</string>
							<frame>0</frame>

if this is how resolve reads the timecode from the original clips, even though its wrong, maybe it will take the import if you replace the timecode in the xml to that...  if you have just a few then you can try manually replacing their timecode to that in the xml, or if its all sony a7s footage then use notepad++'s Replace tool to switch em all.

[RoninEdits]

an update of davinci resolve was released today. nothing in the release notes suggesting it might fix the timecode problem but you can give it a go.

[davidhtz]

Hi,

I have exactly the same setup, and exactly the same problem with the xml roundtrip export from premiere to davinci since i am on CC2014.. When i was on CS6 it used to work fine.  Hope this will be fixed soon

I use A7s . Premiere CC2014 and Davinci last update

[RoninEdits]

when you look at the media in resolve does it have a blank or all zero timecode? if so, have you tried an older version of resolve, like 10 to see if it reads timecode? if premiere reads the timecode and resolve doesn't, you could post on blackmagic's forums for a bug fix.

[davidhtz]

The media in resolve seems to have the right timecode.. but i cannot see the video of these a7s medias

[davidhtz]

Erratum.. you are right, the problem is due to the timecode

[davidhtz]

I tried with the version 10 and i have the same timecode bug

[RoninEdits]

you may have to transcode the media to have it link properly, or export a complete video from premiere to then grade in resolve, or try messing with the xml timecode frame and string, as shown above...  you can also bring this up to blackmagic on their forums and help them get it fixed.

[davidhtz]

Yes i transcoded.. It's a shame.;

I tried to deal with timecode in the xml file but i did not understand anything 

[Guest]

Found a solution. its not perfect and takes a little bit of time but definitely worth trying because it just works.

First import all the footage into Resolve and import the xml, of course you will get the *failed to link because the timecode extents...* its ok. take a screen capture of it in order to remember all names.

Then search for the first footage and open the clip attributes. the current frame timecode short be 00:00:00:00  now go and find the same excat clip in premire and copy/paste the Start TC into clip attribute you opened in resolve. and you should have on clip sorted. do the excat same thing for the next 30/50 or 100 clips that you have and you're good to go.

[LazyFox87]

gert kombate wrote:

Found a solution. its not perfect and takes a little bit of time but definitely worth trying because it just works.

First import all the footage into Resolve and import the xml, of course you will get the *failed to link because the timecode extents...* its ok. take a screen capture of it in order to remember all names.

Then search for the first footage and open the clip attributes. the current frame timecode short be 00:00:00:00 now go and find the same excat clip in premire and copy/paste the Start TC into clip attribute you opened in resolve. and you should have on clip sorted. do the excat same thing for the next 30/50 or 100 clips that you have and you're good to go.

I'd like to point out that this guy right here has the exact answer to this question. This came up for me recently and I know it may be old info in the thread but it's still relevant.

If anyone has already shot their project, do the above (import the clips in question that appear in your timeline, change timecode to zero in clip attributes in resolve, then import the XML)

If you are yet to shoot - if possible, always zero your timecodes on every clip.

If you need timecodes for whatever reason (broadcast, multicam, whatever) then either do the first statement above, in resolve. Or alternatively you may be on such a professional shoot and be such a pro that you don't need this info. But for the self-taught and the prosumers, this issue can be a real flabberghasting pain, but the above is the answer

[easymate13]

Thank you, LazyFox87​

I just started using Sony a6500, and got the same issue with xml from Premiere CS6 to Davinci Resolve 12.5

This advice really helped, and I understood it better than that of the original poster

That's ridiculous that it's still an issue in August 2017.

Is it going to be solved?

I couldn't imagine that switching from Canon to Sony would be such a pain.

[kenneth.c.merrill]

I just started having this issue today. Not fun. I'm going to try a different method: export Premiere Pro sequence as a quicktime video file, import into DaVinci Resolve using Scene Cut Detection. Not elegant, but possibly workable for shorter projects.

[jensf0351]

"RoninEdit" has the answer ...

He tried to change the <string> with notepad++ to:

<string>00:00:00:00</string>

<frame>0</frame>

but instead of changing the values to "0" I just delete the 2 lines ... this is a little bit faster ...

For me it worked excellent

Of Course you need some time to make the changes in the XML ...
but if you are fast you get 10 shots per min ...

I´m working with PR CC2014.2 (8.2.0)  and Resolve 11.3 ...

Best Solution at the time ...

Thank you very much "RoninEdit"

[RoninEdits]

glad to hear that worked, and thanks for reporting it. 

[davidhtz]

Hi there ! I have a new issue :

i work on e film with a7s files, and 4kprores files.

The transcoding roundtrip still does not work from p^remiere to davinci with A7S files. so i try to transcode my premiere cc2014 sequence into dnxHD..

The problem is that in "sequence" mode the a7s files which are shot in 50fps are not transcoded. And in "individual" mode, my 4k prores footages make the transcoding crash.

I also tried the "Ronin Edit" solution by changing manually timecode of my a7s files, but it does not work/

I definitly cannot find a solution to send my sequence in davinci.. that's very embarassing

Thank you