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Why Creative Cloud for Europe is so expensive?

Contributor ,
Apr 30, 2012 Apr 30, 2012

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Just curious why the price of Creative Cloud for Europe is 60% higer? Okay, maybe there are some taxes etc but World of Warcraft online game with the same business model charges pretty the same for subscription in US and Europe.

Looks like discrimination, yeah?

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replies 203 Replies 203
Explorer ,
Jun 21, 2012 Jun 21, 2012

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Yes

And surely Greece is also responsible for the polical success of the Pirate Party in Germany...

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 21, 2012 Jun 21, 2012

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http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/06/20/adobe_cloud_europe_hit_income/

Poor things, how this could possibly happen... "It's not us charging them 50% more for the same downloads - it's the ECONOMIC CRISIS!!!".

My advice to Adobe: next time try charging EU folks 300% more - maybe that'll help...

They had a really great opportunity to actually INCREASE their legitimate user base and they blew it. Somehow I can't get myself to sympathize with them.

Message was edited by: Zbig T.

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 21, 2012 Jun 21, 2012

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Well - we were thrilled when we saw the new model (when the link of the news went to the US Pricing Site).
We discussed it into our company to go to the cloud with Adobe.

When we discovered the price difference, it was quite a shock, even we just need a couple of seets,

we decided against it and said, we will wait. If many european companies think the same, I am sure this tells,

why "poor European demand" exists.

Actually - we, luckily, don't feel the crisis in our company, so our decision to not take it was solely based on the higher price,

which the very very little hope, many do the same that Adobe sees, that what they are doing is not alright.

The sad thing is, which really gives me pain, that we most probably still have to get one licence for one workstation,

as we need some of the newer features and improvements.

But again - even we have to get a licence - we only get this one for the workstation, which we are really in need of.

But not for all of our computers (my preferred way to have same versions all over finally again, which we denied because of pricing).

I personally still stick on CS3 on mine, being years behind, as it's still good for me

The price difference upset me since I don't know, Adobe purchased Macromedia, or since ever?

So yeah, nothing new, but for sure cutting revenue (which I hope as it makes big company react).

Thanks for listening.

Patrick

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Community Expert ,
Jul 05, 2012 Jul 05, 2012

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Was just reponding to a similar post in another thread.

David's first reply was very much in the Adobe company line, that is often stated as follows.

"Our pricing methodology takes into consideration the costs of doing business in different regions and customer research that assesses the value of the product in the local market. Conditions vary between markets and it’s difficult to make a straight comparison between countries."

http://desktopmag.com.au/news/adobes-cs6-pricing-explanation/

There are many articles, blog posts and other discussions about the above where people don't really buy the 'cost of doing business' being so much higher, particularly with products in English (other languages have development and maintenance costs that could result in those products being more expensive).

In Australia, I have seen that the Creative Cloud price is significantly higher than the USA. However, the educational price for Creative Cloud is in line with the US price. In fact, with current exhange rates, it's slighly cheaper. So, taking the Adobe model of pricing to regions based on what they can bear, they have realised that education would not bear this inflated price.

Dean

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 11, 2012 Jul 11, 2012

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In the meantime, just set up a new adobe ID, with a different email address,and with an Billing address in USA. Then you can pay in USD. You will need to uninstall and re-download apps. Another grumpy customer BTW. Can't even buy in local currency and have to buy in overinflated AUD.

Only if you have an office in US of course ;-).

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Explorer ,
Jul 11, 2012 Jul 11, 2012

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Danr7 wrote:

In the meantime, just set up a new adobe ID, with a different email address,and with an Billing address in USA. Then you can pay in USD. You will need to uninstall and re-download apps. Another grumpy customer BTW. Can't even buy in local currency and have to buy in overinflated AUD.

Only if you have an office in US of course ;-).

It may be a bit more involved than that.  The current system is going to require an internet connection, and I am sure that when you would try to do what you are saying that the Adobe system is going to see that tthe purchasing location is not a U.S. location.

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 11, 2012 Jul 11, 2012

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urdaddi wrote:

It may be a bit more involved than that.  The current system is going to require an internet connection, and I am sure that when you would try to do what you are saying that the Adobe system is going to see that tthe purchasing location is not a U.S. location.

Nah, I don't think they're going to spy on your IP address location - that's not their business where is your TCP connection currently originating from. And even if they did, that's no problem using a proxy. The thing is the card you're using to pay has to have a US billing address and that's what they're verifying, from what I know.

But all of this aside, to me it boils down to one simple thing: if they don't want my money, they won't get it. I'm not going to "cheat" their system, I'm not going to be like "just take my money, pretty please, with a cherry on top". That'd be just humiliating. I don't want to feel like a fraudster just because I'm not willing to pay their European/Australian/Rest-of-the-World-tax and not buying their "higher cost of doing business" BS. Simple as that.

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Guest
Jul 22, 2012 Jul 22, 2012

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When is the Adobe going to answer all those questions here? Please do so.

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Community Expert ,
Jul 23, 2012 Jul 23, 2012

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jakubkrcmar2
>When is the Adobe going to answer all those questions here? Please do so.

An Adobe person has already given their stand. I also included a quote that reflects the Adobe position. It is not an argument many feel is substantial or even valid. However, it is what Adobe have decided upon and we're not going to get aything more at this time.

Dean

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New Here ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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putting my money where my mouth is. I am not buying this until the US / Uk price disparity is fair.  Rip off Adobe lost another customer

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Community Expert ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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Tekano_bob wrote:

putting my money where my mouth is. I am not buying this until the US / Uk price disparity is fair.

Define fair.

Adobe believes it's already fair and it won't changing any time soon.

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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Fair = same price before taxes for US and the rest of the world for the English downloadable version.

I have no problem with the fact that Adobe thinks it's already fair as it is.

My bankaccount also thinks it's fair that my money stays put and does not flow any longer to Adobe, at least not for products where there is a significant difference in price.

I'm curious how many people are doing the same thing. Most people don't voice their feelings on a forum like this, but I hear some talking when I meet other Adobe users. It's quite obvious that Adobe is losing a lot of credit fast in Europe.

If Adobe is fine with that, no problem, at a certain point in time it will open the market for competition.

And meanwhile, they don't get my money.

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Community Expert ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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Patrick WOU wrote:

Fair = same price before taxes for US and the rest of the world for the English downloadable version.

That's one definition (with which I agree but, apparently Adobe remains unmoved).

The downside is that you cannot use the CS6 products.

Have you found alternatives?

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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> The downside is that you cannot use the CS6 products.

> Have you found alternatives?

Yes, the version I already have, CS 5.5.

Most of us don't need the latest versions.

We are brainwashed by software companies to think we need all the latest stuff to succesfully do our jobs or hobbies and I'm ready to play that game with them when treated fairly.

This is not the case with Adobe on this moment, thus I play my own game now.

The day that CS 5.5 really shows it's age and the situation did not change yet, that's the day I'm going to look for alternatives at other companies.

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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I'd just like to say that I was surprised a little bit by the price hike but ya know what?  I don't mind all that much.

Let me put it this way you pay less than £600 per year for the whole collection.  Something that would cost you thousands to buy outright and a few hundred to upgrade each year.  Some people have mentioned they have CS3, seeing as that was launched in 2007, using my awesome maths (totally not awesome or researched in anyway) you would have only started to make the saving under the clouds pricing structure after five years.  BUT you are still on a 5 year old version and it will cost you some more to upgrade.  So in that sense even for its UK price, it still makes perfect sense to buy the product.  (This is of course if you haven't pirated the software, and seeing as the statistics say approx. 30% of all adobe software is pirated, someone on this thread isn't being honest at a guess).

You get 2 installs to use, one for home (freelance in my case) and another for work, so being a Creative Cloud member immediately makes you more employable as a designer.  Hell I'm even gonna charge my workplace extra on my invoices if they want me to use my license for them, so I can offset the price difference that way.

Quite frankly, if you can't earn £50pcm using the creative suite then why are you even considering getting the software?

The only thing that discovering that it isn't $49.99 for me as a UK customer has made me do is delay my purchase of the software while I wait 1 week until I get my next paycheque.  Yes it's annoying that it's more expensive here, but so is petrol, house prices, food and pretty much everything!  Oh yeah and the average UK salary is higher than the US.  It's all relative.

Personally I can't wait to get my hands on all this software!

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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If I understand you correct:

You are a freelancer. So you would also charge US companies a lower hourly rate than companies within the UK for the same work?

I am sure most could even afford a 5 times higher rate for the subscription and still make profit.

But this is not the discussion about if you can afford it or not. It's the discussion if you, as non US Company, want to

help Adobe to make more and more profit at costs of your own company.

Main problem is lacking alternatives, which is always bad for customers.

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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Nah I wouldn't charge them a lower hourly rate, but thats because I'm working under UK conditions, and paying UK costs.  If I were to go on a visa to the US for some reason where my costs are lower then it wouldn't be too difficult to lower my rate accordingly.  My rate is decided by the market I'm competing in.  Also, if they charged 5x the subscription rate then you would just buy the Master Collection instead.

Yes I understand that it's a digital product and in the age of the internet that means country's borders don't come into play.  But by that same notion, why should I as a UK customer, earn more in relation to a US customer?  If I pay the same as a US customer, but I charge UK prices, which are higher, I would make more profit.  Then the shoe would be on the other foot with US customers saying they aren't making as much money from the software as UK customers and that is discrimination in pricing too.

Anyway, I'm not here to argue, I'm just pointing out that it's not as bad as you think.  It costs a UK user more to subscribe, but a UK user should also make more money on average from the product by the fact they live in a high cost market.  In the end, the more of you that don't buy the software the better, as it lowers my competition.  I remember seeing a comment earlier on a news item to do with creative cloud that went along the lines of:

"Great, now anyone can be a designer "

It should have an addition of "unless you live in the UK because theyre too cheap to realise how good a deal this is".  Software that I could only use at university or at work because I couldn't afford it I can now use at home (instead of GIMP and InkScape).  I'm genuinely starting to think most nay-sayers are on pirated copies, because that's the only reason why someone would be angry at such a low cost.  After all, wasn't someone saying Adobe Creative Suite was more expensive in the EU anyway before creative cloud in this very thread?

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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@DA-Design :

1. Are you paid by Adobe or an employee ?

2. Read the title of the discussion : it's about the difference in price between Europe and the US, not about the Creative Cloud being a better deal than the buy-option

3. People who pirate Adobe software will not appear on this thread : why would they. They couldn't care less about the price difference. But I guess that after seeing the difference in pricing, some people who are paying might shift to that group. I'm not, but that's me and I have a feeling that I'm becoming more and more an exception.

4. What makes you think that all people use Adobe software to make money : ever heard about the enormous amount of amateurs that do something with images, movies or websites these days ?

5. The fact that petrol or house prices are more or less expensive in Europe has nothing to do with this. I'm not going to explain something that obvious, since that would insult my and your intelligence.

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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Seeing as you posted this before I'm going out Ill give you your answers:

1. No, don't be silly.  The fact that that was your first thought above all others says a lot really.

2. Maybe so, I came here because I wanted to see if there was a way to pay the US price (I'm self-employed, so I'll always try to save money where I can)

3. Again maybe so, they would be on this thread to maybe find out if they could get a non-pirated version finally?  The point of this price difference actively making people get illegal copies is a bit silly too quite frankly.  If someone was of that disposition they probably weren't going to pay the £32 or whatever the exchange rate comes to anyway.

4. If you don't intend to use an industry standard software to make money then what exactly is wrong with the open source software?  You can do many things for the web using open source software.  I've been making money from GIMP and InkScape for 3 years since I left university, because I know how to use them effectively.

5. Yes I know what you're getting at there.  My point was merely that the UK is a more expensive place to live, while most of those extra costs are down to government tax rather than foreign countries seeing the UK as a cash cow, it still stands to reason that any business operating outside of the UK is going to use what the UK consumer expects to pay for any product or service, which is noticeably higher than the US.  Why shouldn't someone make as much money as they can?  Whether it's an individual or a company?

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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@DA-Design :

3. There are different types of software pirates : the hardcore ones, which always pirate no matter the price and the ones that pirate when they feel that they are not treated fairly. The first group is hopeless, the last group is the one that shifts depending of the strategy of the sector or company.

4. Exactly my point. Why should I give money to Adobe when I can get free products. I bought their products since I liked their products. I accepted the extra price because of the extra cost for getting the boxes to Europe and the translation. I'm no longer accepting that difference since we are now in a cloud world and downloading exactly the same product from the same servers.

5. Adobe can try to make as much money as they want to. I'm voicing that I'm not cooperating anymore because of the difference in price. That's interesting information for Adobe to know. If they don't change their strategy, that's fine for me. If enough people do, they might even change their strategy.

And by this, I rest my case.

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New Here ,
Jul 28, 2012 Jul 28, 2012

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I was excited about creative cloud at first and thought "I could live with those prices for some short term jobs, finally something I could afford" ...until I saw the European pricing. Next though was "what a joke, 'alternatives' it is then".

So here's one who would be willing to pay a reasonable price, but seeing as I would be getting screwed over, not a chance.

Adobe is, of course, free to put whatever pricing they want for their products, but they should know they're pushing people to alternative solutions due to unfair pricing (our salaries are less than US and living costs are higher). I just recently had a discussion with a handful of colleagues, and most of them said they would have bought PS if they could get the US pricing. None of them use PS now (we all use alternative solutions). Anecdotal evidence, I know, but this wasn't the first group who have said the same thing, and probably will not be the last.

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New Here ,
Aug 25, 2012 Aug 25, 2012

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I'd like to know which alternatives are you using?

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New Here ,
Aug 25, 2012 Aug 25, 2012

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GIMP mostly.

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New Here ,
Jul 24, 2012 Jul 24, 2012

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Oh I would define FAIR somewhere in the region of

US$ 49.99 = 32.2266632 UK£

For a digital download that is, the additional costs for each copy are marginal, things like credit card processing fees, electricity & bandwidth, and a few other considerations keep each copy cost from truly falling to 0. but still it is not £173.52 extra per year that Adobe see fit to charge me because I am not an American. 

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New Here ,
Aug 25, 2012 Aug 25, 2012

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Lol, man you really think I'm that stupid? "Cost of selling bla bla" I buy online, pay online, no cost ****WHATSOEVER****. NONE. You can't go lower in sales costs than ME, DOING ALL THE WORK. From marketing to the act of purchase. Now I want you to elaborate for me again, what was it that makes me more expensive customer?

ADOBE IS PEEING IN MY BOWL OF CEREAL AND YOU WATCH IF I TAKE IT LIGHTLY.

Lame excuses won't do; I have been offended by hinting that I'm a retard and don't know the exchange rates of currencies and propably won't notice. Come on! Discrimination? Definately. Bold, greedy, discrimination.

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