Script for splitting spreads for bleed? (or other technique?)

[supineNY]

Hi

I'm doing yet another project where I had to design a book (with bleeds) as spreads, but now as the last step, I have to create a version for the printer where each page is a single page with bleed on all four sides. I know the basic trick -- you turn off 'allow pages to shuffle' and then you can drag the spreads apart, one by one, in the Pages window.

However, when you've got a whole book's worth, it starts to seem silly to have to do all this dragging. Isn't there a way -- perhaps a script? -- that will split all the spreads into two single pages, while maintaining their left page/right page characteristics?

Thanks,

Kurt the Dragger

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

Maybe I'm missing something, but when I export a document laid out as spreads, and specify the crops and bleeds, I get single pages with whatever bleed I define on the gutter side.

No rearrangement of the document needed.

[supineNY]

doesn't work for everything, though. Say you have a white page next to an art page that bleeds on 4 sides, the white page will get artwork in its bleed (not good) and then the bleeding page will get the white of the white page in the bleed area, not art (not good).

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

Ah, I see. Don't remember the last time I had gutter-side bleeds, so that escaped me.

Can you split only such page pairs, if the number of them isn't  high? It seems to work in Pages; not sure if it would produce the bleed characteristics you need.

And as mentioned (sort of), don't gutter bleeds disappear in perfect binding, one way or the other? By a proper imposition process, for example?

[Laubender]

Hi Kurt,

there is a script, but you do not need to do it.

Just for spiral bound material. Not for perfect bound sheets for example.

And there is also a different method (highly experimental) :

[1] Save your document to a new name.

[2] Select all pages with the Page tool first.

To do this switch to the Page tool and do the keyboard shortcut for Select All.

[3] Then skew the selected pages with the Transform panel to about 4°.

[4] Apply inside bleed at the spine.

[5] Export to PDF for the printers.

Regards,
Uwe Laubender

( ACP )

[supineNY]

yeah, that doesn't seem like it would let me fine tune my bleed areas the way i can when i split the spreads. though it does sound exciting to have all my pages be 4 degrees tilted.

[Laubender]

Just try it. You'll be surprised…

Regards,
Uwe Laubender

( ACP )

[rob day]

Is the binding method wire-o where the inside bleed is trimmed and visible? Most binding methods fold the signatures on the spine—the inside edge is not trimed. This thread has some options for wire-o including Uwe’s experiment:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/indesign-discussions/gutter-bleed-still-the-same/m-p/11367643#M198592

[supineNY]

perfect bound. And as i mentioned to an earlier poster, my typical situation is something bleeding on one page (like a page with a bleeding photo) next to a white background page with text. so i need to see the pages pulled apart to fine tune my bleeds. will take a look at the link when i get a chance.

[rob day]

Even with perfect binding the signatures are folded—any inside bleed content would have to be removed in the page imposition or get buried in the binding.

[supineNY]

makes sense to me, but my printer rejects jobs that don't have bleed all around on four sides of each page. and i see other posts about this, it seems to be a thing with some printers and i don't know why.

[rob day]

 but my printer rejects jobs that don't have bleed all around on four sides of each page

Is the printer explicitly asking you to create manual bleeds, or are you assuming they can‘t come from the opposite page? Often they want an inside bleed for consistency in the imposition setup. They might be adjusting for creep, but in that case the content of the bleed doesn’t matter.

[supineNY]

yeah, like in my example of a page with a bleeding photo on one side of the spread, page with white background on right side of spread:

if my bleed area for the photo page has white in the bleed area, it gets rejected.

So, it may well be that there's some functionary at the printshop who is blindly following some rule that makes no sense. But, as I'm just a designer working for some client and this is their printer, i'm just trying to have my job sail through without complaints from the printer.

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

You may not have any choice for one reason or another, but... is this a professional print shop experienced in book production? If it's a job shop that does books, they may not have the depth of expertise to do anything but follow a blind set of rules.

For the next project, at least, seek out a pro book printer. They can adapt a wider range of submission details and tend not to run on a rigid checklist of things that can be tweaked.

[supineNY]

thank you for sharing your expertise. Meanwhile, i will work with the printer my client likes to work with, as they otherwise have a good relationship, the price is right, and the job comes out looking quite nice in the end.  i was really just looking for a tip that helped me turn a 10 minute chore into a 5 second chore...but point taken. there's probably a reason I've never had to do this for any other printer!

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

NOT trying to tell you how to do your job or please your client. It's just that not all printers are equal, and not for all job types. Clients tend to form a bond with a local commercial printer — if you're lucky — or retail printer — if you're not — and can be stubborn about shopping jobs around even for a better price. It can make the technical job a real challenge.

But from my (pretty considerable) experience and the opinions given here... there just isn't any good reason for the printer to make this rigid demand. Keep it in mind as you move forward.

[Dave Creamer of IDEAS]

The inside bleed would get ground off for the gluing process. Unless you are paying extra for a lay-flat binding, I would be unlikely that anyone would ever see the edge of the page.

[Laubender]

Hi Kurt,

see into this sample documents:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/uj4xk7h0gtqqie3/220207-3-Bleed-in-Spine-FacingPages.zip?dl=1

Regards,
Uwe Laubender

( ACP )