P: Font sizes in UI are small and unreadable - we need to be able to resize with greater granularity

[zones30]

I’m writing about a problem I’ve encountered that seems to have a lot of people frustrated on the forums, but that Adobe apparently hasn’t done anything to address. This pertains to both LR Classic and PS 2002.

I use LR Classic CC and Photoshop 2022 on a new Macbook Pro (OS 12.1, M1 max chip), connected to an external monitor with a resolution of 2560 x 1440. The problem is that the fonts in the drop-down menus (and to a lesser extent, on the panel labels) are spidery and difficult to read, and there’s no way to adjust them or make them larger and clearer. From what I’ve read on the forums, this problem is even worse for those who have upgraded to 4K monitors.

The usual solution (and the only one offered by tech support) is to use the Mac’s system preferences to change the monitor display settings to a lower resolution. This isn’t a workable solution because external monitors don’t work well when they’re not at their optimal resolution. If you try to scale them to something other than the default setting, you lose sharpness. I’m a professional photographer and I can’t work on a blurry monitor.

In the “preferences / interface” panel of LR, there are options to make fonts larger, but these have no visible effect on drop-down menu fonts (and in fact I still don’t know what they actually adjust). Some responses on the forums suggest that people think these DO affect those fonts, but they’re mistaken. Whether the efficacy of those settings is affected by monitor resolution, I don’t know—but it shouldn’t be.

What's really needed—and will be even more important as people transition to 4K monitors—is the ability for the user to adjust font size and sharpness in the panels and menus without rescaling the monitor resolution. This should be well within the technical capabilities of the Adobe programming team. It could simply be part of the "preferences" panel -- an option for "Font sizes in drop-down menus" and another for "Font sizes in panel labels." It may require some collaboration between your engineers and those at Apple, but I assume there’s precedent for that.

With all the griping about this problem on the forums—complaints that go back years, mind you—it’s hard to understand why nothing’s been done about it. I’d appreciate it (and so would a lot of other people) if you could look into this and come up with a fix.

Thanks.

[brynl44302093]

Okay thanks for this.
But how do I get someone from Adobe to look at this?
Lightroom is supported by them to run on a Windows platform.
Thanks
Bryn

[brynl44302093]

Follow-up

On Windows version of LR we have these font size options:

[brynl44302093]

Small is too small for me/my screen

Large - 150% is too large for me/my screen

Medium may be just right for me, but it looks the same size as small, this is my issue.

[Rikk Flohr: Photography]

Don't post Word documents - most people will avoid those as potential virus vectors. I will not open your word document.

• Repeatable instructions for reproduction are the best thing you can give to start. 
• Second best thing is to provide detailed information about how you have your display configured under  Windows settings. 

With a conventional 4K display under Win 10 I see no issue - as demonstrated in my original image in my first reply. I suspect you have a Windows Control Panel setting that is causing the issue on your end.  I've since tried on a separate Windows 11 machine (Laptop with 4K Display) and the Small and Medium font is visually different. 

[Ian Lyons]

I believe the additional options are Windows specific.

This recently published blog post by another user may help with resizing the available options https://technologytales.com/2022/11/25/more-user-interface-font-scaling-options-in-adobe-lightroom-c...

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, please merge with this existing Idea:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-ideas/p-font-sizes-in-ui-are-small-and-unreadable-w...

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, please merge with this existing Idea:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-ideas/p-font-sizes-in-ui-are-small-and-unreadable-w...

[brynl44302093]

Thanks again for getting back.  I will try and paste the bits from the word doc below, but they look a bit fuzzy, that's why I put them in a Word doc.  I have also attached a pdf version.

LR Panel font size change test:

System info provided at the end of this doc.

Steps to reproduce:

Select Preferences from the edit menu, then the Interface tab.

Change the Panels – font size to ‘small’ using the dropdown.

Select ‘Restart Lightroom Classic’ button at the bottom of the Preferences window.

LR restarts and shows the following

Step two, open up the preferences window as before, this time set the font size to ‘medium’ and restart lightroom

LR restarts and shows the following

Issue is that the Developer panel has not changed, I cannot determine a difference between this and this and the first screen dump done with a ‘small’ front selected.

For completeness, Step three, open up the preferences window as before, this time set the font size to ‘large – 150%’ and restart lightroom.

LR restarts and shows the following:

With the ‘large -150%’ font size selected, the Developer panel is clearly wider, and the font size is larger.  The tab options at the top (Library/Develop/Map/Book…) are also in a larger font.

Overlaying the three different font size options together, clearly shows that two are identical

My Windows 10 display settings are: (note: I also tried with the windows text setting to 100%, but had the same issue)

System info:

Lightroom Classic version: 12.0.1 [ 202210260744-9e008017 ]

License: Creative Cloud

Language setting: en

Operating system: Windows 10 - Home Premium Edition

Version: 10.0.19045

Application architecture: x64

System architecture: x64

Logical processor count: 12

Processor speed: 3.1GHz

SqLite Version: 3.36.0

CPU Utilisation: 6.0%

Built-in memory: 16190.6 MB

Dedicated GPU memory used by Lightroom: 1353.5MB / 4018.0MB (33%)

Real memory available to Lightroom: 16190.6 MB

Real memory used by Lightroom: 2569.8 MB (15.8%)

Virtual memory used by Lightroom: 5977.7 MB

GDI objects count: 726

USER objects count: 2057

Process handles count: 2509

Memory cache size: 2592.8MB

Internal Camera Raw version: 15.0 [ 1261 ]

Maximum thread count used by Camera Raw: 5

Camera Raw SIMD optimization: SSE2,AVX,AVX2

Camera Raw virtual memory: 1217MB / 8095MB (15%)

Camera Raw real memory: 1292MB / 16190MB (7%)

System DPI setting: 96 DPI

Desktop composition enabled: Yes

Standard Preview Size: 2048 pixels

Displays: 1) 2560x1440

Input types: Multitouch: No, Integrated touch: No, Integrated pen: No, External touch: No, External pen: No, Keyboard: No

Graphics Processor Info:

DirectX: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti (27.21.14.5751)

Init State: GPU for Image Processing supported by default

User Preference: Auto

Application folder: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Lightroom Classic

Library Path: C:\Users\bryn\OneDrive\Pictures\Lightroom\Lightroom Catalog-2-v12.lrcat

Settings Folder: C:\Users\bryn\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\Lightroom

Installed Plugins:

1) AdobeStock

2) Flickr

3) Loupedeck2

4) Nikon Tether Plugin

Config.lua flags: None

Adapter #1: Vendor : 10de

                Device : 1c82

                Subsystem : 35121028

                Revision : a1

                Video Memory : 4018

Adapter #2: Vendor : 8086

                Device : 3e92

                Subsystem : 8591028

                Revision : 0

                Video Memory : 80

Adapter #3: Vendor : 1414

                Device : 8c

                Subsystem : 0

                Revision : 0

                Video Memory : 0

AudioDeviceIOBlockSize: 1024

AudioDeviceName: $$$/dvaaudiodevice/SystemDefaultAndEffectiveDeviceName=System Default - DELL SE2723DS (NVIDIA High Definition Audio)#{comment}DVAAU-4201250: Open the audio hardware preferences page.

AudioDeviceNumberOfChannels: 2

AudioDeviceSampleRate: 48000

Build: LR5x19

Direct2DEnabled: false

GL_ACCUM_ALPHA_BITS: 16

GL_ACCUM_BLUE_BITS: 16

GL_ACCUM_GREEN_BITS: 16

GL_ACCUM_RED_BITS: 16

GL_ALPHA_BITS: 0

GL_BLUE_BITS: 8

GL_DEPTH_BITS: 24

GL_GREEN_BITS: 8

GL_MAX_3D_TEXTURE_SIZE: 16384

GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE: 32768

GL_MAX_TEXTURE_UNITS: 4

GL_MAX_VIEWPORT_DIMS: 32768,32768

GL_RED_BITS: 8

GL_RENDERER: GeForce GTX 1050 Ti/PCIe/SSE2

GL_SHADING_LANGUAGE_VERSION: 4.60 NVIDIA

GL_STENCIL_BITS: 8

GL_VENDOR: NVIDIA Corporation

GL_VERSION: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 457.51

GPUDeviceEnabled: false

OGLEnabled: true

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[Hard Coder]

Is there still an issue with the UI widgets having a 2^31 or 2^32 pixel height limit? As in, the maximum size of a scrolling list is limited by the number of pixels it takes up? 32-64k pixels is perfectly attainable in a list of keywords. Particularly if the fonts are large and/or display is high res.

[GoldingD]

Graphics Processor Info:
DirectX: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti (27.21.14.5751)
Init State: GPU for Image Processing supported by default
User Preference: Auto

Probably not the cause of your issue, but your GPU driver is way out of date. You probably have an NVIDIA app called GeForce Experience, Bring that app up, look out for any message stating an update for it exists, fix that if so, then use it to check for and update the GPU driver, when you do, select custom install as to cause a uninstall of old crud.

Note, on my Windows 10 rig, I cannot notice much difference in LrC small s medium.

[johnrellis]

Measuring on my LR 12.0.1 / Windows 10 / 2560 x 1440 display, I observe about a 10% difference between Medium and Small and a 49% difference between Large - 150% and Small.  As on Mac, the difference between Medium and Small isn't very useful -- it would be much better to have a Medium that's about 25% larger than Small.

* * *

Facts: I measured the size of history-step text in the Develop History panel for Windows Display Scaling of 100% and 125% and LR font sizes of Small, Medium, and Large - 150%:

- Line Height is the pixel distance between the baselines of History-panel text.

- "P" Height is the pixel height of the letter "P" in the first History line.

- "Publish" width is the pixel width of the first line of History, from "P" to ")".

- Linear Ratio is the linearized ratio of the total pixels of the texts in the first History step:

Linear Ratio = sqrt ((P Height * Publish Width) / (Small P Height * Small Publish Width))

If Medium used a "P" height of 10 rather than 9, with about the same relative character widths as Large - 150%, that would produce a more useful visual ratio of 1.25 rather than the current 1.10.

* * *

Here are screenshots of what I measured, for Windows Display Scaling of 100% and then 125%, at Small, Medium, and Large - 150%:

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, please merge with this existing Idea:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-discussions/preferences-interface-panels-font-size-...

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, please merge with this existing Idea:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-discussions/preferences-interface-panels-font-size-...

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, oops, this thread should be merged into the pre-existing Idea with 8 votes:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-ideas/p-font-sizes-in-ui-are-small-and-unreadable-w...

(I meant to use that one originally, sorry.)

[johnrellis]

Moderators, @Rikk Flohr: Photography, please merge with the existing Idea:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-ideas/p-font-sizes-in-ui-are-small-and-unreadable-w...

[johnrellis]

"Is there still an issue with the UI widgets having a 2^31 or 2^32 pixel height limit? As in, the maximum size of a scrolling list is limited by the number of pixels it takes up?"

Unfortunately still an issue:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-discussions/p-windows-limit-on-number-of-keywords-f...

It's been present in Windows LR since 1.0 and I think it's highly unlikely to get fixed.

(Also, the limit is 2^16 ~ 64K pixels.)

[Hard Coder]

Ah yeah sorry I am in the wrong power of 2 decade. I actually know better but wrote incorrectly. But yes I have had the problem of the keyword list "overflowing" and obviously font size and high-res scaling confounds that already stupid very 20th century problem.

[johnharveyphoto]

Same. We don't know what % medium is, but it's too small on my UHD monitor, already set to scale the whole monitor view to 125% in Windows, which is fine for everything else that I've checked so far. Having medium (% unknown), large 150% and nothing in between in LR isn't useful enough for some (many?) of us.

At the very least, we need to be able to choose 100% font size (perhaps call it Full, Normal or even ... gasp ... 100%?).

Ideally, we could choose whatever scaling we want, but a great starting point would be some additional predefined ones (100%, 125%, etc).

Fingers crossed.

[brynl44302093]

Moderators, please review why this has been moved to ‘ideas’ when it is clearly is a ‘bug’ i.e. doesn’t do what it says/implies that will it will do.  "On Windows 10, there is no difference between the small and medium options for the panel font sizes"

Some may view this as a minor ‘defect’, but it makes Lr very difficult to use on 2560x1440 resolution monitors and higher, as the next font option size up, Large-150%, drastically reduces the central workspace. I am positive that whoever specified this feature, did not intend that the small and medium front size options to be identical. Thanks.

 PS Is there a list of defects to be addressed somewhere, may be with an intended release version and date? Call me old fashioned, but that’s how I use to do things…. If only to keep the clients from chasing all the time. 🙂

[GoldingD]

We are just fellow users in this community (mostly), we have no idea what Adobe may be working on, however Adobe does post this:

Known issues in Lightroom Classic

P.S. Adobe also posts:

Fixed issues in Lightroom Classic

[johnrellis]

On my Windows LR 12.0.1 2560 x 1440 display, Small and Medium are not identical -- Medium has about 10% more pixels. But I fully agree that Medium isn't useful and there should be a useful size between Small and Large - 150% (e.g. 125%).  

Whether Adobe marks something as Bug or Idea doesn't really matter with respect to whether they're going to change LR.  They do review everything posted in these forums and ruthlessly prioritize both bug fixes and feature requests based partially on their estimate of how many users are affected (which is partially informed by the number of votes and replies here).

[omni.media]

I can confirm also on QHD medium and small are essentially the same (maybe there's a 10% difference but it doesn't matter practically) and that large is MUCH larger. Medium should be right in between small and large.

[Elisabeth5FDA]

It would be great to be able to increase the text and slider sizes as well as have an option for high contrast visuals for anyone who suffers with poor vision or sight loss. 

Due to my vision getting worse it is becoming increasingly difficult to edit images and this feature would make my life much easier and allow me to continue doing something I love. 

[Ian Lyons]

Have you tried any of the 'Accessibility' features in Windows or macOS (example in screenshot below)

[Elisabeth5FDA]

None of the accessibility options effect anything inside the programme. I have larger text and a high contrast theme but the lightroom options for editing remain the same.